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> Rumors, Lies, & False Accusations Travel With Joy, Confronting AT and Gailon with Truth
awesumtenor
post Mar 6 2008, 11:51 AM
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QUOTE(appletree @ Mar 6 2008, 12:26 PM) *
Well, been gone a few days and look what I come back to. Demands on how I know what I know! Well I could get dramatic like sister, the drama king/queen, and say I am a vapor floating around just long enough to make nasty accusations, but, I won't.


Have you actually read what you post? You dont have to say you're a vapor floating around long enough to make nasty accusations; reading 30 seconds of your posts makes that painfully evident.


QUOTE
I will say straight out, your demands fall on deaf ears. I do not, and will not justify or explain my "intimate" knowledge of the subject matter, nor am I required to.


Then why do you persist in condemning others when they choose to exercise the very same privilege you claim here?

Since you do not have that privilege alone, your making the exercise of it, whether defending your own doing so or condemning others, the topic is just another weapon of mass distraction...it diverts and deflects attention away from issues you'd really prefer not be discussed and since you have already stated you are not going to be forthcoming on anything salient, there is no real point in your continuing to belch forth brimstone as you do.. yes, I know, that too is your prerogative... but how it is received has far less to do with any inherent bias against you or for another than that it is the fruit of the stance you have taken and the vitriolic manner in which you continue to present it.

yes, I know trying to get you to see reason borders on the quixotic...but still... Sancho! My lance...

In His service,
Mr. J


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There is no one more dangerous than one who thinks he knows God with a mind that is ignorant - Dr. Lewis Anthony

You’ve got to be real comfortable in your own skin to survive the animosity your strength evokes in people you'd hope would like you. - Dr. Renita Weems
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princessdi
post Mar 6 2008, 12:00 PM
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As I said, a standoff. Simple. So you are willing to deal with less credibility, and that's ok. It is a choice you have made. I already told you and everyone else that my determinations come from Danny's own actions, starting with ahuling everybody in to retape programs, to his lies posted here, and then some. Not from sister's dramatizations, and definitely not from his friends trying to sell me the same bill of goods he tried to pawn off here. In my book at this time anyone psoting for either side has a credility issue. If you are telling the truth and god is on "your" side, then why hide? It is just a simple question. I am not sure who you all are hiding form since God sees and knows all. I just can't imagine that it is from each other. That is just plain silly. Maybe this will all come out in my lifetime and maybe it won't, but just this one thread really shows just how ridiculous the entire sad saga had become.

Now to be prefectly honest, yes, I do put gove a little more credibility to sister's accounts, because they more closely resemble Danny's own actions that are not in dispite from either side. i'm sorry that clueless man you are tyring to present here just ain't workin' for me. A man may not know every piece of clothing a owman has, but he knows she has a lot. It's a common joke amongst husbands about their wives and closet space.........Sorry Appletree, you will have to come better than that.

Carry on!



QUOTE(appletree @ Mar 6 2008, 09:26 AM) *
Well, been gone a few days and look what I come back to. Demands on how I know what I know! Well I could get dramatic like sister, the drama king/queen, and say I am a vapor floating around just long enough to make nasty accusations, but, I won't. I will say straight out, your demands fall on deaf ears. I do not, and will not justify or explain my "intimate" knowledge of the subject matter, nor am I required to. I may think differently if you made the same demands across the board, but, you all have consistently been totally lopsided. Especially you, Di. I have yet to see where you have ever made demands on Sister's identity yet, swallow everything he/she says hook line and sinker. Same goes for you Inga and several others.

Difference between sister and I is that sister has been "caught" time and again putting her own twists, turns and falsehoods to every story told. Because I do have "intimate" knowledge, I can counteract those twists with the truth. Whatever association sister claims to have had is in the past and, from her own mouth, usually has been told to her by someone. She says the Fiscallini's told their story to her, she says she has gotten information from Steve S. Sister says he/she has no contact with Linda and, maybe that is true presently, but what about in the past 2 years? No way can sister say he/she hasn't ever gotten some of her nasty little gossip from Linda.

On the other hand, I am a past, present and hopefully, future source. I can check records, verify or dismiss information, talk directly to the "correct" sources to get to the truth. Not to mention, I only have to go through those procedures, if it wasn't something I witnessed myself. Man, have I witnessed some stuff. If I wanted to get down on sister's level, I could write some "ringy dingy" vignettes concerning the life and times of Linda S. but, I just can't bring myself to get down low enough to look at sister eye to eye.

As far as the clothes and shoes goes, all the discussion of how Danny could not know....I had to laugh....Ladies, you are the ones asking the questions so I will address you. Can you honestly tell me that your husbands know what is in your closets? What if you had seperate closets as did Danny and Linda? Do you think they would know what all clothing you owned? I can tell you that I would be clueless as to what my wife would have. I honestly can't think of a man I know that could tell me what all their wives have to wear. That is a typical man thing. Common.

You question how Danny could not know Linda's wardrobe but, turn on a dime and say that Linda didn't know what she was signing, Linda didn't know anything about finances, and Linda didn't understand her contract..etc In essence though Linda was VP of a worldwide television ministry, according to you all, she was dumber than a box of rocks. She was just kind of "there" oblivious to all of this "wrong doing" that you are accusing Danny of. Like the plane for instance. MMHH so much criticism of the 3abn plane Danny rode in but never a mention of Linda. Maybe she was strapped to the top???? Criticism of Danny's house....that...Linda helped design, decorate and then lived there until the divorce. Much useless discussion about Danny's dodge truck and never a mention that Linda was driving a new (at that time) top of the line, toyota SUV. Wait, let me guess...Danny forced her to sign the papers for it and she had no idea that she was driving a new vehicle.......What about her claims that Danny handled all the finances and yet it is her signature on years and years of checks written for their bills, groceries, gas, etc... Oh...wait....I remember now....she didn't know what all those checks were for....At the gas station and the grocery, walmart, and target, Danny forced her to sign her name and he wasn't even with her!!!! Man he is powerful!!!!

In essence, once again, your sense of fair play is so lopsided it's making me dizzy..... huh.gif


--------------------
TTFN
Di


And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose---Romans 8:28

A great many people believe they are thinking when they are merely rearranging their prejudices.-- William James

It is better to be silent and be thought a fool, than to speak and remove all doubt.- Mark Twain
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Shiny Penny
post Mar 6 2008, 11:26 PM
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QUOTE(appletree @ Mar 6 2008, 10:26 AM) *
Man, have I witnessed some stuff. If I wanted to get down on sister's level, I could write some "ringy dingy" vignettes concerning the life and times of Linda S. but, I just can't bring myself to get down low enough to look at sister eye to eye.


Too bad...I'm sure such vignettes would be a tantalizing read.

QUOTE(appletree @ Mar 6 2008, 10:26 AM) *
You question how Danny could not know Linda's wardrobe but, turn on a dime and say that Linda didn't know what she was signing, Linda didn't know anything about finances, and Linda didn't understand her contract..etc In essence though Linda was VP of a worldwide television ministry, according to you all, she was dumber than a box of rocks. She was just kind of "there" oblivious to all of this "wrong doing" that you are accusing Danny of. Like the plane for instance. MMHH so much criticism of the 3abn plane Danny rode in but never a mention of Linda. Maybe she was strapped to the top???? Criticism of Danny's house....that...Linda helped design, decorate and then lived there until the divorce. Much useless discussion about Danny's dodge truck and never a mention that Linda was driving a new (at that time) top of the line, toyota SUV. Wait, let me guess...Danny forced her to sign the papers for it and she had no idea that she was driving a new vehicle.......What about her claims that Danny handled all the finances and yet it is her signature on years and years of checks written for their bills, groceries, gas, etc... Oh...wait....I remember now....she didn't know what all those checks were for....At the gas station and the grocery, walmart, and target, Danny forced her to sign her name and he wasn't even with her!!!! Man he is powerful!!!!


Your point is well taken.

MMHH - pardon me, but what's this mean?


--------------------
--Shiny Penny--

My beloved friends, let us continue to love each other since love comes from God. Everyone who loves is born of God... The person who refuses to love doesn't know the first thing about God, because God is love—so you can't know him if you don't love. This is how God showed his love for us: God sent his only Son into the world so we might live through him. This is the kind of love we are talking about—not that we once upon a time loved God, but that he loved us and sent his Son as a sacrifice to clear away our sins and the damage they've done to our relationship with God. 1 John 4:7-10 (esaajr@asia.com)
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Johann
post Mar 7 2008, 09:55 AM
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QUOTE(Shiny Penny @ Mar 7 2008, 05:26 AM) *
Too bad...I'm sure such vignettes would be a tantalizing read.


Have you seen those vignettes, Shiny Penny? How do you evaluate them?

I observed such vignettes as I got aquainted with people at 3ABN. As I gathered first hand material from the people themselves and coworkers at the station for articles I was writing about the ministry for denominational publications and private letters to various leaders in the SDA Church. We were working at our goal of making 3ABN known and used by church keaders to proclaim the message to the world.

Linda was immediately by far the most open and inspiring, giving me lots of positive information about all the wonderful workers that were engaged by 3ABN. It was as if ther was not the slightest cloud in the sky. And she defended her husband like a vigorous lion. Gave a good reason why some church leaders did not like him. She was the one who gave the most beautiful vignettes of all the people at 3ABN, including Danny Shelton.

The vignette of Mr. Danny Shelton started getting somewhat tarnished the more of his lectures I listened to, and the more I had to deal with people among church leaders who had encountered Danny Shelton earlier. In the beginning I followed Linda in defending Danny like a lion, and I found a very good excuse for every fault of his I encountered in my work.

What was it in his lectures that decreased his value? It was primarily his disevaluation of every creature that seemed to get in his way and kept him from achieving his goal and wishes as quickly as he desired. But it seemmed like most of the time he was talking about himself. As long as I was defending Danny, I did not pay so much attention to this feature. It was when I experienced how he had no qualms about making false statements about his wife, that I saw this man in a new light.

I appealed with him to do his part in saving his marriage, but he sneered at me. All he was interested in was to get Linda stamped as a prostitute (he would also use the word "whore") in the eyes of people, so he could get his Biblical mandate to marry someone else. Is 3ABN called of God to give such a message to the world?

None of this is stories I gather from other people, but what I personally have seen and heard.

So which vignette are you seeing, Shiny Penny?

Some time ago you were demanding a "yes" or "no" answer of me. You even revealed how you would use my reply. That showed me, without any reasonalble doubt, that you are dealing with things of which you have a very limited knowledge.

It so happens that I have a sister-in-law who got aquainted with Arild Abrahamsen through us, and she went to him for treatments. There she found the help she needed, but unfortunately she lived far away, and could not go through with all of his treatments. So she went home and continued treatments with another physician, but she got worse and worse. Finally she and her husband gave up their home and moved to the vicinity of Arild Abrahamsen. She is almost 80 years and will never regain the strength of her youth, but now that she is under his care again she feels healty and well for her age.

Linda Shelton is not the only Linda among his patients, and a number of them come from America. Linda Shelton had a serious ailment at the time of her divorce, and Arild has been able to help her, just like he does to thousands of other patients who travel far and wide to get to him. At one time I met another Linda there, and was permitted to follow some of her treatments. An American specialist had given her up as incurable. Three moths after her return to USA her speialist wrote Arild an e-mail asking him how he managed to give her a permanent cure. The treament took several moths, and Arild has this kind of patience with his patients.

Arild often treats 50 patients in a day, and many more want to come to him. Ask the Good Lord, Shiny Penny, to clear your evil thinkinking if you conclude that he has an immoral affair with many of his thousands of patients because they come back to him from time to time. No physician can garantee the cure lasts for ever and works against any other sickness. What kind of wickedness gets hold of you to demand a "yes" or "no" answer to which of his patients return to him for treatments, and how often? Some of these patients get sick again because they do not follow his advice. Are you demanding of me to give an accurate account if Linda is following her physicians instructions in all details? And if you got an answer to that question, how would you use it? Some more evil surmisings?


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"Any fact that needs to be disclosed should be put out now or as quickly as possible, because otherwise the bleeding will not end." (Attributed to Henry Kissinger)

"He who passively accepts evil is as much involved in it as he who helps to perpetrate it" (Martin Luther King)
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appletree
post Mar 7 2008, 01:59 PM
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QUOTE(Shiny Penny @ Mar 6 2008, 11:26 PM) *
Too bad...I'm sure such vignettes would be a tantalizing read.
Your point is well taken.

MMHH - pardon me, but what's this mean?


roflmao.gif Sorry. Just my way of turning something over in my mind.
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appletree
post Mar 7 2008, 02:21 PM
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QUOTE(Johann @ Mar 7 2008, 09:55 AM) *
Linda Shelton is not the only Linda among his patients, and a number of them come from America. Linda Shelton had a serious ailment at the time of her divorce, and Arild has been able to help her, just like he does to thousands of other patients who travel far and wide to get to him. At one time I met another Linda there, and was permitted to follow some of her treatments. An American specialist had given her up as incurable. Three moths after her return to USA her speialist wrote Arild an e-mail asking him how he managed to give her a permanent cure. The treament took several moths, and Arild has this kind of patience with his patients.

Arild often treats 50 patients in a day, and many more want to come to him. Ask the Good Lord, Shiny Penny, to clear your evil thinkinking if you conclude that he has an immoral affair with many of his thousands of patients because they come back to him from time to time. No physician can garantee the cure lasts for ever and works against any other sickness. What kind of wickedness gets hold of you to demand a "yes" or "no" answer to which of his patients return to him for treatments, and how often? Some of these patients get sick again because they do not follow his advice. Are you demanding of me to give an accurate account if Linda is following her physicians instructions in all details? And if you got an answer to that question, how would you use it? Some more evil surmisings?


Well, that is a new one. Up to now it had been a "Nathan only" type thing but now we find out Linda had a "serious ailment" at the time of the divorce. Funny we are only hearing about 3 1/2 years after the fact and only then because you know her trip to see Arild right after the divorce needed an explanation beyond "She needed her friends".

Now let's think about the fact that you are backtracking, again, to doctor/patient relationship, first concerning Nathan, now, adding Linda. Yet, just recently you posted that people had told "them" Arild & Linda that enough time had passed it would be ok for them to marry. For people to have told them it was "ok" to marry, they obviously have a relationship at the present time. So, does Arild date all of his other women patients too? You can't leap back and forth Johann, it gives the impression of a cover up.
As far as Arild's skills as a doctor, I don't see the relevance. He could cure cancer. That doesn't mean he isn't as carnal natured as the next guy.

Now as to the vignettes. You had no take whatsoever on people's thinking at that time. Why? Because Linda was still there. You think people would talk bad about her when she held their jobs in her hands. Production held the biggest amount of employees and that is the department she was in charge of. Once she was gone and they weren't in danger of losing their jobs, the truth started coming out. Believe me, if I could I would make a documentary on what 3abn people thought of the VP. Your time there was too short to have a clue and you've been duped since then.
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Johann
post Mar 7 2008, 02:54 PM
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QUOTE(appletree @ Mar 7 2008, 08:21 PM) *
Well, that is a new one. Up to now it had been a "Nathan only" type thing but now we find out Linda had a "serious ailment" at the time of the divorce. Funny we are only hearing about 3 1/2 years after the fact and only then because you know her trip to see Arild right after the divorce needed an explanation beyond "She needed her friends".

Now let's think about the fact that you are backtracking, again, to doctor/patient relationship, first concerning Nathan, now, adding Linda. Yet, just recently you posted that people had told "them" Arild & Linda that enough time had passed it would be ok for them to marry. For people to have told them it was "ok" to marry, they obviously have a relationship at the present time. So, does Arild date all of his other women patients too? You can't leap back and forth Johann, it gives the impression of a cover up.
As far as Arild's skills as a doctor, I don't see the relevance. He could cure cancer. That doesn't mean he isn't as carnal natured as the next guy.

Now as to the vignettes. You had no take whatsoever on people's thinking at that time. Why? Because Linda was still there. You think people would talk bad about her when she held their jobs in her hands. Production held the biggest amount of employees and that is the department she was in charge of. Once she was gone and they weren't in danger of losing their jobs, the truth started coming out. Believe me, if I could I would make a documentary on what 3abn people thought of the VP. Your time there was too short to have a clue and you've been duped since then.


By mistake this got posted before I wrote my reply - the reason why I am editing.

Appletree, you sure make use of any imagined opportunity to mix things up. . . Here you don't have the knowledge of Danny Shelton. Even shortly after this happened, Danny himself informed us of the nature of Linda's disease. So you better go ask him about that, since you exhibit such ignorance. . . And now you are trying your best again to create some doubt in people's minds - this time based on your own ignorance. You can do better than that. Or is this the best you muster?

Another thing you don't realize now - you are verifying what I said right from the beginning was Kay Kuzma's assignment - what she herfself informed me herself she was doing. She was interviewing staff to find some other reasons for firing Linda than the accusations of Danny, which she said at that time, was not good enough reason to fire Linda.

It does not take much imagination to figure out how a person with a doctorate in some kind of psychology is able to stir up a strong hostility against a vice president in trouble when these people also see that such an attitude pleases the remaing president, the one they are dependent on for keeping their employment.

But keep up revealing your desparate lack of human understanding, and we know better why 3ABN is such a godless institution, sweeping all kinds of misdeamors under the rug. Sooner or later it will all be revealed.

This post has been edited by Johann: Mar 7 2008, 03:18 PM


--------------------
"Any fact that needs to be disclosed should be put out now or as quickly as possible, because otherwise the bleeding will not end." (Attributed to Henry Kissinger)

"He who passively accepts evil is as much involved in it as he who helps to perpetrate it" (Martin Luther King)
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Brenda
post Mar 7 2008, 03:07 PM
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QUOTE(appletree @ Mar 8 2008, 07:21 AM) *
Now as to the vignettes. You had no take whatsoever on people's thinking at that time. Why? Because Linda was still there. You think people would talk bad about her when she held their jobs in her hands. Production held the biggest amount of employees and that is the department she was in charge of. Once she was gone and they weren't in danger of losing their jobs, the truth started coming out. Believe me, if I could I would make a documentary on what 3abn people thought of the VP. Your time there was too short to have a clue and you've been duped since then.


Appletree, there is another possible explanation for the phenomenon you have just described - that once Linda had gone, it was expedient to speak negatively of her to stay in the good books of the person who now 'held their jobs' in his hands.

I have no personal knowledge of anything at 3ABN, just pointing out logical possiblities.
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Johann
post Mar 7 2008, 03:26 PM
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QUOTE(Brenda @ Mar 7 2008, 09:07 PM) *
Appletree, there is another possible explanation for the phenomenon you have just described - that once Linda had gone, it was expedient to speak negatively of her to stay in the good books of the person who now 'held their jobs' in his hands.

I have no personal knowledge of anything at 3ABN, just pointing out logical possiblities.


Brenda, you had no knowledge of what I was in the process of writing - because I got myself in trouble with the posting. And yet you come to the same conclusion onkly on the basis of the information Mr. Appletree provides. I have stated this many times before. This time with a small addition - Danny Shelton and his best friends are Danny Shelton's worst enemies. It is amazing how they continue.


--------------------
"Any fact that needs to be disclosed should be put out now or as quickly as possible, because otherwise the bleeding will not end." (Attributed to Henry Kissinger)

"He who passively accepts evil is as much involved in it as he who helps to perpetrate it" (Martin Luther King)
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Ian
post Mar 7 2008, 03:43 PM
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QUOTE(Johann @ Mar 7 2008, 03:54 PM) *
....
Another thing you don't realize now - you are verifying what I said right from the beginning was Kay Kuzma's assignment - what she herfself informed me herself she was doing. She was interviewing staff to find some other reasons for firing Linda than the accusations of Danny, which she said at that time, was not good enough reason to fire Linda.

It does not take much imagination to figure out how a person with a doctorate in some kind of psychology is able to stir up a strong hostility against a vice president in trouble when these people also see that such an attitude pleases the remaing president, the one they are dependent on for keeping their employment.

But keep up revealing your desparate lack of human understanding, and we know better why 3ABN is such a godless institution, sweeping all kinds of misdeamors under the rug. Sooner or later it will all be revealed.


Johann, this was answered long ago.


QUOTE(calvin @ Aug 16 2004, 11:30 PM) *
Dear Calvin,

I have become aware that your site published Johann Thorvaldsson's article about "The Story of Linda Shelton." Since I am mentioned in that article, I thought you might be interested in publishing a response to correct the misinformation given about my involvement. If you need to call me, my # is xxx-xxx-xxxx.

Thank you.
Kay Kuzma

Here is my statement:

To those who may question my involvement with 3ABN and the circumstances which led up to Linda Shelton leaving 3ABN:

Yes, I was involved in what happened at 3ABN concerning Linda however the internet article in which you read about my involvement titled "The Story of Linda Shelton" by Johann Thorvaldsson, is saturated with the writer's biased personal perceptions and has very little to do with what actually happened. I was there – I know. Rather than address each falsehood, which would be too time consuming, I will simply address the three major errors concerning me:

Here is what was printed about me: "Long before Linda's dismissal, Dr. Kay Kuzma was assigned to help Linda manage after being fired. She was also supposed to interview staff members to find a good reason to fire her, so one wonders what really is behind this upheaval?"

Here is what actually happened:

1) I was not brought in early – in fact, I was brought in during the last six weeks after Danny and Linda had been in months of counseling with professionals – with Linda still refusing to follow what the counselors suggested, i.e., unanimously the counselors told her that she would have to give up her relationship with the doctor in Norway who she was spending up to six hours each day talking with.

2) I was not brought in to help Linda "manage" after she was fired – she was never fired. The committee I was on (and later the Board) repeatedly gave her opportunity to talk with them trying to bring resolution and restoration to both her ministry at 3ABN and her marriage. She refused at every point. There was never discussion concerning "firing" Linda when I became involved – only a discussion on how to help her. There was such a concern for Linda's reputation that the entire Board was not initially notified about the situation until it became an absolute necessity to do so. I was on a small committee of two Board members, the 3ABN attorney, and myself. The small committee's discussion centered on how to save Linda for ministry. Linda talked to me one time and refused any further contact I tried to make with her.

3) I was NOT asked by 3ABN to interview staff concerning Linda. Linda, herself, asked me to talk with the staff. She even gave me the specific names of the people she wanted me to talk with. The results from the interviews with the employees Linda suggested weren't flattering to her. When I tried to get back with her, she refused to answer my calls.

The overwhelming error in Mr. Thorvaldsson's account of the events surrounding Linda Shelton's departure from 3ABN gives witness to the fact that his observation was from many thousands of miles away and only receiving his information from the two involved in the duplicity. Hopefully it has become apparent to you, as I pointed out the error contained in these three lines alone, that this entire article is full of misinformation. If you would like specific answers to any other point, I'll be happy to share. God is good and truth will prevail even though there are those who are trying to stir up controversy.

I believe the most important thing to understand is that eventually the fruit of a person's decisions will become evident. Although I will not comment further about what happened to lead up to Linda's departure from 3ABN, we know that the other man had been to the States and spent time with Linda before she left Danny, and that immediately after she left Danny, the other man was with Linda. A few weeks later they spent time traveling together through Europe.

Please remember, 3ABN is not Danny or Linda's ministry – it is God's, and every day we all see incredible miracles as God is moving His ministry forward. It's been a very difficult time – as we all love Linda and recognize how much God used her in her role as co-host with Danny. God truly gifted her with the ability to write beautiful songs that have been a tremendous blessing to thousands.

Thanks for remembering 3ABN in your prayers – and thanks for not sharing Mr. Thorvaldsson's article with anyone else – since I know you don't want to be a part of spreading misinformation.

Sincerely,

Kay Kuzma


edit- added bold and red font for emphasis.

This post has been edited by Ian: Mar 7 2008, 03:48 PM
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Johann
post Mar 7 2008, 03:59 PM
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QUOTE(Ian @ Mar 7 2008, 09:43 PM) *
Johann, this was answered long ago.




edit- added bold and red font for emphasis.


You ignored my answer to that back in 2004. Kay Kuzma changed everything she had told me just a few weeks prior to that - just like everybody else at 3ABN have done ever since, just to cover up the misdeeds of their boss. I still believe she was telling me the truth the first time.


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"Any fact that needs to be disclosed should be put out now or as quickly as possible, because otherwise the bleeding will not end." (Attributed to Henry Kissinger)

"He who passively accepts evil is as much involved in it as he who helps to perpetrate it" (Martin Luther King)
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Ian
post Mar 7 2008, 05:33 PM
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QUOTE(Johann @ Mar 7 2008, 04:59 PM) *
You ignored my answer to that back in 2004. Kay Kuzma changed everything she had told me just a few weeks prior to that - just like everybody else at 3ABN have done ever since, just to cover up the misdeeds of their boss. I still believe she was telling me the truth the first time.


Johann,

I'm reminded of the kid in the marching band proudly proclaiming how he is the only one in step and pointing out how all the others are out of step.

When it comes to believing all are liars but you, it just doesn't work for me. Sorry.

This post has been edited by Ian: Mar 7 2008, 05:36 PM
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fallible humanbe...
post Mar 7 2008, 06:46 PM
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QUOTE(Johann)
Post #296
You ignored my answer to that back in 2004. Kay Kuzma changed everything she had told me just a few weeks prior to that - just like everybody else at 3ABN have done ever since, just to cover up the misdeeds of their boss. I still believe she was telling me the truth the first time.

***********

Post #292
It does not take much imagination to figure out how a person with a doctorate in some kind of psychology is able to stir up a strong hostility against a vice president in trouble when these people also see that such an attitude pleases the remaing president, the one they are dependent on for keeping their employment.



Johann,

Years from now, should the Lord wait that long, you might re-read this and see how ridiculous this sounds. So far we have you claiming that everyone has changed their tune, altered their take, and retracted their words. According to you, everyone has lied from the inception of this situation and you alone hold the truth - no one but you knows the truth . . . it is strange how no one, and at this point I use that phrase in an all inclusive manner, is honest but Linda, Arlid, and yourself. You have twisted words, misquoted, and outright lied to the people here about events and statements by individuals at 3ABN.

Notice the words in bold font above . . . it is amazing how this large amount of individuals as well as church leadership - local, division, and world wide have not fallen for your "fanteri" . . . I know, I know, I know, you claim to have regular conversations with denominational "higher-ups" (maybe those with Scandinavian connections) but the truth of the matter is that those "higher-ups" are discovering and an ever increasing rate, that they have been misled by your team - er, Linda's team, er, Mr. Pickle's team, er, Gailon Arthur Joy's team . . . oh, whose ever team it is at this point that is bent on seeing the demise of one of God's instruments for reaching the world before the curtain closes.

BTW, would you be supportive of an Adventist proclamation/evangalistic tool that used individuals who had openly and publicly embraced new age theology?

- FHB

This post has been edited by fallible humanbeing: Mar 7 2008, 06:53 PM


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But beware. Anger, fear, aggression. The dark side are they. Once you start down the dark path, forever will it dominate your destiny. - Yoda

If you would convince a man that he does wrong, do right. But do not care to convince him. Men will believe what they see. Let them see. - Henry David Thoreau

May those who love us love us. And those who don’t love us– may God turn their hearts. And if He cannot turn their hearts, may He turn their ankles, so that we may know them by their limping. - Keeping Faith
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Panama_Pete
post Mar 7 2008, 07:30 PM
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QUOTE(calvin @ Aug 16 2004, 10:30 PM) *
Dear Calvin, I have become aware that your site published Johann Thorvaldsson's article about "The Story of Linda Shelton." Since I am mentioned in that article, I thought you might be interested in publishing a response to correct the misinformation given about my involvement. If you need to call me, my # is xxx-xxx-xxxx. Thank you. Kay Kuzma

Here is my statement:

To those who may question my involvement with 3ABN and the circumstances which led up to Linda Shelton leaving 3ABN:

Yes, I was involved in what happened at 3ABN concerning Linda however the internet article in which you read about my involvement titled "The Story of Linda Shelton" by Johann Thorvaldsson, is saturated with the writer's biased personal perceptions and has very little to do with what actually happened. I was there – I know. Rather than address each falsehood, which would be too time consuming, I will simply address the three major errors concerning me:

Here is what was printed about me: "Long before Linda's dismissal, Dr. Kay Kuzma was assigned to help Linda manage after being fired. She was also supposed to interview staff members to find a good reason to fire her, so one wonders what really is behind this upheaval?"

Here is what actually happened:

1) I was not brought in early – in fact, I was brought in during the last six weeks after Danny and Linda had been in months of counseling with professionals – with Linda still refusing to follow what the counselors suggested, i.e., unanimously the counselors told her that she would have to give up her relationship with the doctor in Norway who she was spending up to six hours each day talking with.

2) I was not brought in to help Linda "manage" after she was fired – she was never fired. The committee I was on (and later the Board) repeatedly gave her opportunity to talk with them trying to bring resolution and restoration to both her ministry at 3ABN and her marriage. She refused at every point. There was never discussion concerning "firing" Linda when I became involved – only a discussion on how to help her. There was such a concern for Linda's reputation that the entire Board was not initially notified about the situation until it became an absolute necessity to do so. I was on a small committee of two Board members, the 3ABN attorney, and myself. The small committee's discussion centered on how to save Linda for ministry. Linda talked to me one time and refused any further contact I tried to make with her.

3) I was NOT asked by 3ABN to interview staff concerning Linda. Linda, herself, asked me to talk with the staff. She even gave me the specific names of the people she wanted me to talk with. The results from the interviews with the employees Linda suggested weren't flattering to her. When I tried to get back with her, she refused to answer my calls.

The overwhelming error in Mr. Thorvaldsson's account of the events surrounding Linda Shelton's departure from 3ABN gives witness to the fact that his observation was from many thousands of miles away and only receiving his information from the two involved in the duplicity. Hopefully it has become apparent to you, as I pointed out the error contained in these three lines alone, that this entire article is full of misinformation. If you would like specific answers to any other point, I'll be happy to share. God is good and truth will prevail even though there are those who are trying to stir up controversy.

I believe the most important thing to understand is that eventually the fruit of a person's decisions will become evident. Although I will not comment further about what happened to lead up to Linda's departure from 3ABN, we know that the other man had been to the States and spent time with Linda before she left Danny, and that immediately after she left Danny, the other man was with Linda. A few weeks later they spent time traveling together through Europe.

Please remember, 3ABN is not Danny or Linda's ministry – it is God's, and every day we all see incredible miracles as God is moving His ministry forward. It's been a very difficult time – as we all love Linda and recognize how much God used her in her role as co-host with Danny. God truly gifted her with the ability to write beautiful songs that have been a tremendous blessing to thousands.

Thanks for remembering 3ABN in your prayers – and thanks for not sharing Mr. Thorvaldsson's article with anyone else – since I know you don't want to be a part of spreading misinformation.

Sincerely,

Kay Kuzma


Kay Kuzma, in that same letter, stated that Linda Shelton was "never fired." After four years, don't you think the secret is out that Linda Shelton was fired? Didn't you hear the news? The board voted to terminate Linda.

It's ironic that you would use Kay Kuzma's failed letter to try to show how Johann gets things wrong.

Yes, I'm using that red-letter emphasis that you 3ABN folks are so fond of using.



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Ian
post Mar 7 2008, 07:52 PM
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QUOTE(Panama_Pete @ Mar 7 2008, 08:30 PM) *
Kay Kuzma, in that same letter, stated that Linda Shelton was "never fired." After four years, don't you think the secret is out that Linda Shelton was fired? Didn't you hear the news? The board voted to terminate Linda.

It's ironic that you would use Kay Kuzma's failed letter to try to show how Johann gets things wrong.

Yes, I'm using that red-letter emphasis that you 3ABN folks are so fond of using.



As am I. It really needs to be read in context. It is clear to me she is referring to her involvement, she was not brought in to help Linda manage after she was fired as has been claimed, for Linda was not fired at that time, and it wasn't even being discussed at that time....

QUOTE
2) I was not brought in to help Linda "manage" after she was fired – she was never fired. The committee I was on (and later the Board) repeatedly gave her opportunity to talk with them trying to bring resolution and restoration to both her ministry at 3ABN and her marriage. She refused at every point. There was never discussion concerning "firing" Linda when I became involved – only a discussion on how to help her. There was such a concern for Linda's reputation that the entire Board was not initially notified about the situation until it became an absolute necessity to do so. I was on a small committee of two Board members, the 3ABN attorney, and myself. The small committee's discussion centered on how to save Linda for ministry. Linda talked to me one time and refused any further contact I tried to make with her.


This post has been edited by Ian: Mar 7 2008, 07:54 PM
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