Are We A Cult?, Thoughts/Points to Ponder Options

[PrincessDrRe]

Cult... Cult tendacies...

I agree Cheryl. We are far too comfortable with conformity. We definitely show some tendancies.

Deep.... and Dead on....

This is exactly what I was thinking...

[Guest_dimples5809_*]

Deep.... and Dead on....

This is exactly what I was thinking...

I would disagree, why I serve Christ and that in it self removes me from being in a cult. The world will call me what it wants just becasue I don't follow after the beast so I feel honored when they say I am not like them.

[MsHoly1]

I would disagree, why I serve Christ and that in it self removes me from being in a cult. The world will call me what it wants just becasue I don't follow after the beast so I feel honored when they say I am not like them.

I could be wrong but I don't think the OP was only talking about what the world thinks but moreso how we look compared to non-SDA Christians.

But regardless,

Cult... Cult tendacies...

[Denny]

There are probably cult tendencies in the most 'mainstream' of Christian groups including ours. I suspect some Adventists extreme veneration of the little red books and the author put us in this category when we were going through our legalistic phase which some members have not left......

[MsHoly1]

There are probably cult tendencies in the most 'mainstream' of Christian groups including ours. I suspect some Adventists extreme veneration of the little red books and the author put us in this category when we were going through our legalistic phase which some members have not left......

I agree.

[LeePaDee]

Denny WROTE:
There are probably cult tendencies in the most 'mainstream' of Christian groups including ours.
------This was my question.... name at least 6 tendencies.

[Seraphim7]

There are probably cult tendencies in the most 'mainstream' of Christian groups including ours. I suspect some Adventists extreme veneration of the little red books and the author put us in this category when we were going through our legalistic phase which some members have not left......

When we were going through

Now Denny, you know we all know folks who would make the red book readers look like folks in a Sunday-go-to-meeting Readers Digest book club.

[Denny]

Denny WROTE:
There are probably cult tendencies in the most 'mainstream' of Christian groups including ours.
------This was my question.... name at least 6 tendencies.

This is just my definition

1. A cult of personality for living or dead human founder(s)
2. Groupthink
3. Belief that one is the only way to salvation
4. Desire not to mix with non believers or is discouraged
5. Own version of the Bible with add ons
6. Places own literature as same level as the Bible

This post has been edited by Denny: Jan 8 2007, 01:26 PM

[MsHoly1]

Denny WROTE:
There are probably cult tendencies in the most 'mainstream' of Christian groups including ours.
------This was my question.... name at least 6 tendencies.

-Ellen White - for some, it's an idolotrous relationship.
-As stated in another thread, some SDAs act like they don't know how to interact or socialize
with non-SDAs...as if they are from another planet.
-The church making the 4th commandment the greatest when the greatest is love.
-Thinking Sunday worshippers have the mark of the beast because they don't worship on the
Sabbath.
-Not wearing jewelry or make-up and, as someone who didn't grow-up Adventist, to me
that's just a way to know who the visitors are because they don't look like everybody else.
-Censorship and getting kicked out of the church for bad behavior. How do you kick somebody out of what's supposed to be God's church?

[LeePaDee]

Wonderful ... WONDER-FULL Thanks both of you... good!!!

[watchbird]

I've been following this thread closely.... just haven't had time to plug into it yet.... and it's hard even now to decide where to do so. Anyhow.... I'll start with Thomas's comment....

:
The answer is no to your original post question...there may be an abundance of things that separate Adventism from mainstream Christianity, things that may not even be found in scripture, but that doesn't make it a cult, it's just divergent views...belief in another God other than Jesus Christ would make it a non-christian cult...

Agreed.

But as LEE pointed out... we can't really know what we are talking about unless we do some defining... and defining is not as simple as listing a few characteristics of a cult. Partly this is true because historically the use of the word has changed.... and partly because there are so many uses of it currently.

In the beginning it meant simply a group which had a system of worship... compare it to the word "culture" for an idea of how generalized it was.

Later it gained negative connotations when those of the majority worship system of a culture used it in a derogatory way to refer to any minority worship system. Thus Christianity would be considered a "cult" by either the Roman polytheistic system, or the Jewish Monotheistic worship system. Later, Protestants would be considered "cults" by Roman Catholics... etc.

But all that changed with the proliferation of new religions that developed during the 19th century when East began infiltrating West, and Occultic mysticism and theories began invading "Christian cultures", and even claiming to be Christian.... as in Christian Science, for example. Theosophy, Anthroposophy, New Thought, Transcendentalism, Spiritualism... all were in one way or another amalgamations of ancient or Eastern religions with various kinds of "Christianity".... and I put Christianity in quotes because of the distance some branches of it were from Biblical Christianity.

Coming into the 20th century, these cults multiplied like the proverbial "fruit flies". And with many of them based on supernatural revelations.... whether prophet, meditating guru, or channeller, an increasing number of them qualified quite literally as being based on the "doctrines of demons" that Paul warned of.... in much more literal ways than most of us have ever dreamed possible.

Adventists, for the most part.... not only laypersons, but leaders as well.... have been so isolated from contact with these cults that we not only have never taken a leading role in explaining them to our people and warning against them, but we have needlessly concerned ourselves with worry over whether we were indeed one of the "cults" rather than truly a Christian church. And at times our ignorance in these matters have caused some of us to make fools of ourselves by condemning those of our leaders who tried to ensure that we would not be listed in the Evangelical books as one of the non-Christian cults.

And OTOH, not knowing what it was that the various "cult-watchers" were and are seeing that they are trying to valiantly to guard against, others of us scrutinize ourselves too closely, not realizing what is behind the vocabulary that is used to describe the criteria of what is considered a cult... or even what is considered a dangerous cult... which if I correctly read the list that seemed to spark this thread, was a common characteristic of all those listed.

But time is up for now... so I'll have to come back to this tomorrow. In the meantime.... carry on....

[PrincessDrRe]

There are probably cult tendencies in the most 'mainstream' of Christian groups including ours. I suspect some Adventists extreme veneration of the little red books and the author put us in this category when we were going through our legalistic phase which some members have not left......

I agree with this too.....

This is just my definition

1. A cult of personality for living or dead human founder(s)
2. Groupthink
3. Belief that one is the only way to salvation
4. Desire not to mix with non believers or is discouraged
5. Own version of the Bible with add ons
6. Places own literature as same level as the Bible

-Ellen White - for some, it's an idolotrous relationship.
-As stated in another thread, some SDAs act like they don't know how to interact or socialize
with non-SDAs...as if they are from another planet.
-The church making the 4th commandment the greatest when the greatest is love.
-Thinking Sunday worshippers have the mark of the beast because they don't worship on the
Sabbath.
-Not wearing jewelry or make-up and, as someone who didn't grow-up Adventist, to me
that's just a way to know who the visitors are because they don't look like everybody else.
-Censorship and getting kicked out of the church for bad behavior. How do you kick somebody out of what's supposed to be God's church?

OOooooo...but this is exactly what I was thinking and aligning with the beliefs of Jonestown, Heaven's Gate, and Branch Davidians...

I've been following this thread closely.... just haven't had time to plug into it yet.... and it's hard even now to decide where to do so. Anyhow.... I'll start with Thomas's comment....
Agreed.

But as LEE pointed out... we can't really know what we are talking about unless we do some defining... and defining is not as simple as listing a few characteristics of a cult. Partly this is true because historically the use of the word has changed.... and partly because there are so many uses of it currently.

In the beginning it meant simply a group which had a system of worship... compare it to the word "culture" for an idea of how generalized it was.

Later it gained negative connotations when those of the majority worship system of a culture used it in a derogatory way to refer to any minority worship system. Thus Christianity would be considered a "cult" by either the Roman polytheistic system, or the Jewish Monotheistic worship system. Later, Protestants would be considered "cults" by Roman Catholics... etc.

But all that changed with the proliferation of new religions that developed during the 19th century when East began infiltrating West, and Occultic mysticism and theories began invading "Christian cultures", and even claiming to be Christian.... as in Christian Science, for example. Theosophy, Anthroposophy, New Thought, Transcendentalism, Spiritualism... all were in one way or another amalgamations of ancient or Eastern religions with various kinds of "Christianity".... and I put Christianity in quotes because of the distance some branches of it were from Biblical Christianity.

Coming into the 20th century, these cults multiplied like the proverbial "fruit flies". And with many of them based on supernatural revelations.... whether prophet, meditating guru, or channeller, an increasing number of them qualified quite literally as being based on the "doctrines of demons" that Paul warned of.... in much more literal ways than most of us have ever dreamed possible.

Adventists, for the most part.... not only laypersons, but leaders as well.... have been so isolated from contact with these cults that we not only have never taken a leading role in explaining them to our people and warning against them, but we have needlessly concerned ourselves with worry over whether we were indeed one of the "cults" rather than truly a Christian church. And at times our ignorance in these matters have caused some of us to make fools of ourselves by condemning those of our leaders who tried to ensure that we would not be listed in the Evangelical books as one of the non-Christian cults.

And OTOH, not knowing what it was that the various "cult-watchers" were and are seeing that they are trying to valiantly to guard against, others of us scrutinize ourselves too closely, not realizing what is behind the vocabulary that is used to describe the criteria of what is considered a cult... or even what is considered a dangerous cult... which if I correctly read the list that seemed to spark this thread, was a common characteristic of all those listed.

But time is up for now... so I'll have to come back to this tomorrow. In the meantime.... carry on....

Birdy - you broketh it down....

[Seraphim7]

I agree with this too.....
OOooooo...but this is exactly what I was thinking and aligning with the beliefs of Jonestown, Heaven's Gate, and Branch Davidians...
Birdy - you broketh it down....

Sure did.

[frenchmon]

On the History Channel recently there was a look back at Cults and the "havoc" that they have wrecked on lives/the US in the past years. They looked at Jim Jones and Jonestown, Charles Manson and the Family, Shoko Asahara and the Sarin in Tokoyo, and finally David Koresh and the Branch Davidians (whom they continually linked to Seventh-Day Adventists).

Thoughts?

How far are we (SDA's) from being a cult? What is the difference between a cult and a religion? How do you know that we (SDA's) are not a cult?

Thoughts?

Yes...But you must remember with in the pale Adventisim you have many different belief systems. But for the most part yes SDAiam is cultic. Just look at how many hold to EGW. Many will go to their graves trying to prove she is on the same level as biblical prophets. Many will twist scripture to make it harmonize with EGW. This is cultic. The officail church stance is that "her writings are a continuing and authoritative source of truth which provide for the church comfort, guidance, instruction, and correction." . I have found things contained in her works that was not truth.

frenchmon



HISTORYCHANNEL.com<<<---***Click Here to See the synapsis of the Investigation/Report***

Addendum to OP Question:
"Back to the definition/characteristics.... what do cults do??"

[PrincessDrRe]

I could be wrong but I don't think the OP was only talking about what the world thinks but moreso how we look compared to non-SDA Christians.

That too....