A different view of 3abn, Fitzhume's postion..... Options

[Observer]

I do regret to have ignited your ire to such a degree. That was certainly not my intention. The frustating thing about this exercise is that the questions I have raised have not been addressed to any degree of satisfaction, thus I have taken some rhetorical license to further exacerbate the issues at hand.

If you carefully considered my remarks you would understand that I am in no wise condoning a molester. However, had my earlier points been properly deliberated it would not have come to this.

For decades, our denomination have openly and secretly supported individuals of high office whose personal conduct has been questionable at best and outrageous at worse. In mostly all situations, we have either looked the other way or overlooked the individual to the ends of accommodating the greater good of the adventist movement.

So the million dollar question is: Why now the sudden righteousness, why now the calling to task, why now the singling out, why the inconsistency?. As a church we have for decades embranced hypocracy, courted double standards, capered with rationalizations and doctrinal truancy. Oh no, this is not about Danny Sheltonk, this is about us finding ourselves a convenient punching bag and getting a good workout to detract from our own skeletons and the fact that the tea of our own faith has grown tepid.

We here in BSDA are not the people who faced decisions decades ago. We cannot right the wrongs of those years. We are probably not even aware of many that you cite.

What we are is people who have knowledge of an ongoing series of events today. Our responsibility to God is for what we do today, not what someone else did many years ago.

If wrongs were done in the past, does that commit us to repeating those wrongs today?

[inga]

a remote village in Africa? has satellite t.v. you say? So let me get this straight, some folks are in a remote village in Africa watching 3abn on satellite t.v.....

Well, this is probably the most "nearly right" thing Fitzhume has written so far.

Kandace Thorp tells about negotiating with a satellite dish manufacturer so that HopeTV, in conjunction with local conferences, could provide inexpensive dishes to remote villages in Africa. They actually did it quite inexpensively. The way it works is that the whole village gests one dish, and the local people come to one place to view the programming. A lot of this was put in place for the various world-wide evangelistic crusades, some of them originating in Africa. I suspect, though, that the station gets set up for them, and they don't fiddle with it to see if they can get other programming, such as 3ABN.

I haven't heard of 3ABN doing anything similar. Have they?

[PrincessDrRe]

So....
They'll get the village "one" dish - but won't assist in the spreading of the news about HIV and feeding the land.....

...but....

They got a dish!

[beartrap]

So....
They'll get the village "one" dish - but won't assist in the spreading of the news about HIV and feeding the land.....

...but....

They got a dish!

That, my Lady, is LLBN's job. They have partnered with Loma Linda University Medical Center to spread the practical side of Christianity, which is what the four Gospels depict as true Christianity. A century past the SDA church was at the forfront of healthcare in the world through Battle Creek, and today Loma Linda is set to carry the torch.

This post has been edited by beartrap: Aug 23 2006, 09:34 PM

[PrincessDrRe]

Okay....we can send a dish....

I'm sorry....

Yall go ahead.... I can't wrap myself around this one right now....
(Katrina anniversary on my mind and just thinking about a dish when folks need to eat....sorry....)

Carry on....

[Truly Blonde]

Princess,

We need to teach them about HIV and feed them---but they also need to learn about God. How better then by satellite? I guess the question is---Are they learning about God through 3abn. I would say probably yes if they are getting Elder Bohr and the other evangelists that are on 3abn. Are they learning about God from Danny Shelton? I doubt it. But then they probably don't know what is going on at 3abn. All they see are the programs. They may wonder if they were receiving 3abn by sky angel. Their screens are blank where 3abn is concerned. But that is another issue. Maybe they wern't given a lifetime membership when the dish was sent to them LOL

[inga]

So....
They'll get the village "one" dish - but won't assist in the spreading of the news about HIV and feeding the land.....

They got a dish!

That's really quite unfar.

The Adventist church uses many means to reach the unreached. Satellite TV is but one of those means.

Have you ever heard of ADRA? I suggest you check out www.ADRA.org It is through ADRA that the kind of work you mention is done, but it's not the only way. There are many individual workers who teach people how to stay healthier through cleanliness, better diet, etc. And ADRA even teaches agricultural practices that result in better crops. ADRA builds wells, etc.

However even satellite TV can take care of the HIV crisis. Nobody gets HIV by obeying God's Law. (Of course, there are innocent children and spouses who are affected by the immoral behavior of their parents or spouses.)

The problem of those already infected takes larger financial resources than the church has. We can teach compassion, and there are those among us who do. After all, compassion is best displayed one on one.

[PrincessDrRe]

That's really quite unfar.

The Adventist church uses many means to reach the unreached. Satellite TV is but one of those means.

Have you ever heard of ADRA? I suggest you check out www.ADRA.org It is through ADRA that the kind of work you mention is done, but it's not the only way. There are many individual workers who teach people how to stay healthier through cleanliness, better diet, etc. And ADRA even teaches agricultural practices that result in better crops. ADRA builds wells, etc.

However even satellite TV can take care of the HIV crisis. Nobody gets HIV by obeying God's Law. (Of course, there are innocent children and spouses who are affected by the immoral behavior of their parents or spouses.)

The problem of those already infected takes larger financial resources than the church has. We can teach compassion, and there are those among us who do. After all, compassion is best displayed one on one.

I donate to ADRA & UNICEF - but still they starve. I do believe that if you asked them (the one's starving) if they would prefer a dish to watch some TV or a dish of food they would say the dish of food...but maybe that's coming from someone that's seen true hunger before.... maybe that's just me....

I can only be immoral if I know some sort of law or know GOD's law - even GOD HIMSELF doesn't hold those accountable that don't know. To state "Nobody gets HIV by obeying God's Law" - while there are those that don't know it to "obey" it is a catch-22.

As for the resources of the SDA Church - we would have more $$$$ if we weren't funding horse farms and new carpet where the old ain't even worn.....

Like I said before...
"Yall go ahead.... I can't wrap myself around this one right now...."
(Katrina anniversary on my mind [lemmie go into more detail]- (and the extreme loss of many of my friends and one family member) and just thinking about a dish when folks need to eat....sorry....)

..and we ain't even gonna get into how we are now....

Princess,

We need to teach them about HIV and feed them---but they also need to learn about God. How better then by satellite? I guess the question is---Are they learning about God through 3abn. I would say probably yes if they are getting Elder Bohr and the other evangelists that are on 3abn. Are they learning about God from Danny Shelton? I doubt it. But then they probably don't know what is going on at 3abn. All they see are the programs. They may wonder if they were receiving 3abn by sky angel. Their screens are blank where 3abn is concerned. But that is another issue. Maybe they wern't given a lifetime membership when the dish was sent to them LOL

Again......

I ain't learning nuthin' when I'm hungry. I will learn about GOD once you fill my stomach so the growling and pain doesn't distract me to death.

...and I'm leaving this alone after this. If anyone on this board can listen, learn, read, and think correctly when they have gnawing hunger then all power to you. However for most (all I've seen) - the only thing that would be on their mind would be getting a meal/something to eat....

Now....

BOT!

[inga]

I donate to ADRA & UNICEF - but still they starve. I do believe that if you asked them (the one's starving) if they would prefer a dish to watch some TV or a dish of food they would say the dish of food...but maybe that's coming from someone that's seen true hunger before.... maybe that's just me....

I'm glad you practice what you preach but you go on to create a false dichotomy re the two "dishes" -- it is not an either/or situation.

Following your logic, perhaps you should quit your doctoral program and give the money to the starving? Then sell the rest of your possessions & live under a bridge & beg. You'd still be better off than the starving in some parts of the world.

Why take it out on HopeTV when they work hard to ensure that some folks in backward areas have the chance to hear the gospel?

I can only be immoral if I know some sort of law or know GOD's law - even GOD HIMSELF doesn't hold those accountable that don't know. To state "Nobody gets HIV by obeying God's Law" - while there are those that don't know it to "obey" it is a catch-22.

Of course that was my point -- how can they hear except they have a preacher -- even a preacher on satellite TV. My suggestion was that in the HIV crisis, following God's directives would put a halt to it. As a matter of fact, some African countries are successfully making virginity "cool," and it's making a real dent in the spread of HIV. That's the kind of thing for which satellite TV is also well suited.

The point is not whether or not God holds them "accountable," the point is that all of God's directives are meant for our good, and in the spread of HIV it's very apparent that ignoring His directives brings us harm.

As for the resources of the SDA Church - we would have more $$$$ if we weren't funding horse farms and new carpet where the old ain't even worn.....

That's why we're having this discussion. But please remember that 3ABN is not the Adventist church!

Like I said before...
"Yall go ahead.... I can't wrap myself around this one right now...."
(Katrina anniversary on my mind [lemmie go into more detail]- (and the extreme loss of many of my friends and one family member) and just thinking about a dish when folks need to eat....sorry....)

I'm so sorry!! Now I understand ... you're frustrated with the futility of it all ...

I think you're feeling just a bit of the pain God feels watching all this .. . it wasn't His intent to bring about this kind of suffering when He created this world ...

I ain't learning nuthin' when I'm hungry. I will learn about GOD once you fill my stomach so the growling and pain doesn't distract me to death.

...and I'm leaving this alone after this. If anyone on this board can listen, learn, read, and think correctly when they have gnawing hunger then all power to you. However for most (all I've seen) - the only thing that would be on their mind would be getting a meal/something to eat....

Indeed! That was the method of Christ used -- He ministered to people's (felt) needs before He bade them follow Him. If we are to do His work, we must follow His pattern of ministry, both individually and corporately.

And that brings us back on topic! Is 3ABN following the pattern of Christ's ministry?

I think not.