 Is The General Conference Afraid Of Blacksda? |
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 Aug 30 2007, 01:58 PM
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#121
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 Advanced Member  Group: Members Posts: 416 Joined: 16-May 07 Member No.: 3,569 Gender: f  |
QUOTE(Statrei @ Aug 30 2007, 12:50 PM)  Agreed, PB. We would make great strides if we were able to accept that each man sees what he sees without assigning them, in turn, to heaven and to hell. We are guilty of repeating the Cain/Abel syndrome. If Cain had not been made to believe that the Creator loved him less because of his independent choice of offering, thus rendering him dispensable, he would never have killed his brother. Well that's a new one! Cain's murder of his brother was not his fault? ********************************************************** |
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Aug 30 2007, 02:21 PM
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#122
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 416 Joined: 16-May 07 Member No.: 3,569 Gender: f |
QUOTE(LaurenceD @ Aug 30 2007, 11:59 AM) ... And what is there that indicates these scientists are "skeptics?" I think that's an unknown, but familiar, joker card that Chrisitans afraid of Present Truth often throw out on the table to create doubt over something so simple to understand--counting growth ring in ice or trees. Asking if one has personally examined ice cores is yet another. This comes from the same school, albeit a differnt class, that asks if you have personally examined the original Hebrew, Aramaic and Greek manuscripts and verified that nothing contained within has been borrowed from other sources, but is all 100% original. The GISP research, methods, results, and sources are all public information. The problem of runoff (layers overlapping) was solved early on by relocating the drilling rigs to locations where the highest points were centered on through...thereby eliminating the contamination of surrounding snow melt. Again, terms like "may have" are simply considered joker cards to the majority of open and qualified scientists. I realize this is off-topic, and don't intend to pusue it...just wanted to mention it in passing as related to Present Truth and those who are accused of undermining the faith of believers. Still off topic, I know. Some interesting viewpoints coming out here! Let's see ... so far there seem to be "regular" Adventists, "historic" Adventists and "present truth" Adventists ... Any others? ************************************************************ |
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Aug 30 2007, 03:02 PM
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#123
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 1,000 + posts  Group: Members Posts: 2,251 Joined: 25-August 06 Member No.: 2,169 Gender: f |
QUOTE(Artiste @ Aug 30 2007, 01:21 PM) Still off topic, I know. Some interesting viewpoints coming out here! Let's see ... so far there seem to be "regular" Adventists, "historic" Adventists and "present truth" Adventists ... Any others? ************************************************************ Hmmmmm. How about "radical" Adventist who believes that knowledge (Jeremiah 29:13), a way (Phillipians 4:13), a promise (John 12:32), the two greatests commandments (Mark 12:29-31) and preparing the world for the return of our Lord should be our method and our message. (Learning, Leaning, Lifting, Loving and Looking Forward if you want a fancy slogan.) -------------------- Got Peace?
John 14:27 Peace I leave with you; my peace I give you. I do not give to you as the world gives. Do not let your hearts be troubled and do not be afraid. "Truth welcomes examination and doesn't need to defend itself, while deception hides in darkness and blames everyone else." Aunt B, 2007 |
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Aug 30 2007, 03:03 PM
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#124
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1,000 + posts Group: Members Posts: 1,087 Joined: 21-July 06 Member No.: 1,919 Gender: m |
QUOTE(Artiste @ Aug 30 2007, 03:58 PM) Well that's a new one! Cain's murder of his brother was not his fault? ********************************************************** Where did I say it was not his fault? |
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Aug 30 2007, 03:04 PM
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#125
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 500 + posts  Group: Financial Donor Posts: 629 Joined: 8-August 04 From: Over here Member No.: 529 Gender: f |
QUOTE(Artiste @ Aug 30 2007, 03:21 PM) Still off topic, I know. Some interesting viewpoints coming out here! Let's see ... so far there seem to be "regular" Adventists, "historic" Adventists and "present truth" Adventists ... Any others? ************************************************************ Well................ Where does this leave me? i am a seventh-day Adventist! What are they by the way? Hum, let me see.... Can we see those beliefs too? If Danny Shelton is leaning in one of these other directions, I want on the otherside! Any belief that accepts its leaders to continue in the appearance of evil is not of God imo! -------------------- The greatest want of the world is the want of men-- men who will not be bought or sold, men who in their inmost souls are true and honest, men who do not fear to call sin by its right name, men whose conscience is as true to duty as the needle to the pole, men who will stand for the right though the heavens fall. {Ed 57.3}
But such a character is not the result of accident; it is not due to special favors or endowments of Providence. A noble character is the result of self-discipline, of the subjection of the lower to the higher nature--the surrender of self for the service of love to God and man. {Ed 57.4} |
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Aug 30 2007, 08:53 PM
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#126
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 Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 162 Joined: 25-April 07 From: PA Member No.: 3,439 Gender: f |
QUOTE(Artiste @ Aug 30 2007, 04:21 PM) Still off topic, I know. Some interesting viewpoints coming out here! Let's see ... so far there seem to be "regular" Adventists, "historic" Adventists and "present truth" Adventists ... Any others? ************************************************************ Burned-out Adventists??  
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Aug 30 2007, 09:34 PM
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#127
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 Heiress Josey  Group: Charter Member Posts: 9,020 Joined: 20-July 03 From: DC Metro Member No.: 6 Gender: m |
What I would really like to know is will the 3ABN crew be "voting and representing Adventists" at the next GC session?
-------------------- WELCOME to BlackSDA from seraph|m, a BSDA Charter member.
Please Join us in The Married Forum and/or Sabbath School Lesson Study forums. Then, come join us here, Live Chat Lesson Study ,for our Friday night study @ 8pm CST/9pm EST. The lesson can be found at Sabbath School Network (SSNET) Motto- "Weapons of Mass Distraction, Have No Place Here. " "Qui tacet consentire videtur," Are not official staff mottos and are not endorsed by BSDA Management. |
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Aug 30 2007, 11:03 PM
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#128
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 Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 456 Joined: 25-November 06 From: Great Northwest of US of A Member No.: 2,536 Gender: f |
QUOTE(Seraphim7 @ Aug 30 2007, 08:34 PM) What I would really like to know is will the 3ABN crew be "voting and representing Adventists" at the next GC session? count on it  unfortunatelyRosyroi 
-------------------- "Joy, Love, Peace, Long Suffering, Gentleness, Goodness, Faith, Meekness, and Self Control are what being full of the Holy Spirit is all about." Galations 5. "Don't waste your time waiting and longing for large opportunities which may never come, but faitfully handle the little things that are always claiming your attention..." F.B. Meyers "Truth welcomes examination and doesn't need to defend itself, while deception hides in darkness and blames everyone else." Aunt B. 2007 "For GOD so LOVED you and me..." John 3:16 "I believe that there is a devil, and here's Satan's agenda. First, he doesn't want anyone having kids. Secondly, if they do conceive, he wants them killed. If they're not killed through abortion, he wants them neglected or abused physically, emotionally, sexually...One way or another, the legions of hell want to destroy children because children become the future adults and leaders. If they (legions) can warp or wound a child, he or she becomes a warped or wounded adult who passes on this affliction to the next generation". -Terry Randall in TIME Magazine, October 21, 1991 |
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Aug 30 2007, 11:09 PM
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#129
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 1,000 + posts Group: Members Posts: 1,521 Joined: 17-October 04 From: Iceland, formerly Denmark, Norway, USA, Sierra Leone, Nigeria, Faeroe Islands. Bound for Heaven. Member No.: 686 Gender: m |
QUOTE(Shepherdswife @ Aug 31 2007, 04:53 AM) Burned-out Adventists?? May the Lord give us enough sense of humor not to get there -------------------- "Any fact that needs to be disclosed should be put out now or as quickly as possible, because otherwise the bleeding will not end." (Attributed to Henry Kissinger) "He who passively accepts evil is as much involved in it as he who helps to perpetrate it" (Martin Luther King)  "The truth can lose nothing by close investigation". (1888 Materials 38) |
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Aug 31 2007, 08:23 AM
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#130
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1,000 + posts Group: Members Posts: 1,483 Joined: 29-July 06 Member No.: 1,960 Gender: m |
QUOTE(LaurenceD @ Aug 30 2007, 01:59 PM) The reason the layer in the ice are considered unmistakable by the majority of our best scientists, ie up to a point in time (about 50,000 years), is becuase the annual growth rings in ice are so similar to the growth rings in a tree. Has it been unequivocally verified that under no circumstances whatsoever can multiple layers be laid down in a single year? And that no processes have merged two sequences into one, similar to what they now feel formed the El Captan (sp?) reef? QUOTE(LaurenceD @ Aug 30 2007, 01:59 PM) And what is there that indicates these scientists are "skeptics?" Do they believe the Bible when it says that God created the world in 6 days, each with a single morning and a single evening? Ellen White wrote a chapter on that question with a title of "Disguised Infidelity," decalring the position that the days of Gen. 1 are not literal days to be just that. I used the more moderate term "skeptic" rather than "infidel." QUOTE(LaurenceD @ Aug 30 2007, 01:59 PM) Asking if one has personally examined ice cores is yet another. This comes from the same school, albeit a differnt class, that asks if you have personally examined the original Hebrew, Aramaic and Greek manuscripts and verified that nothing contained within has been borrowed from other sources, but is all 100% original. Perhaps, but the question is still a valid one. When you have scientists declaring interpretations of data to be fact, and those scientists are operating from the presuppositions that the Bible is wrong, that life evolved, that the world is 4.5 billion years old, etc., it behooves us to carefully examine the basis for their pronouncements to see if there are any mistakes in their research. I've seen it over and over again. A critic of Ellen White says such and such, and it sounds so solid, but under analysis it falls apart. And if anyone's work didn't need to be critiqued, you would think it would be Ben Zion Wacholder, but his analysis of the data regarding the dating of the sabbatical years was quite unsound. Thus, when it comes to accepting the conclusions of evolutionists why don't believe the Bible regarding data such as ice cores, conclusions that contradict Scripture, experience tells me that there must be a thorough analysis of their work first. QUOTE(LaurenceD @ Aug 30 2007, 01:59 PM) The problem of runoff (layers overlapping) was solved early on by relocating the drilling rigs to locations where the highest points were centered on through...thereby eliminating the contamination of surrounding snow melt. And how did they determine that the highest point had not changed in the previous 100,000 years? |
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Aug 31 2007, 08:43 AM
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#131
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1,000 + posts Group: Members Posts: 1,087 Joined: 21-July 06 Member No.: 1,919 Gender: m |
No informed person today believes the earth is six thousand years old or that life on earth is only six thousand years old. Thankfully, the bible never makes such a claim.
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Aug 31 2007, 09:40 AM
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#132
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 500 + posts Group: Members Posts: 691 Joined: 20-February 07 Member No.: 3,035 Gender: m |
QUOTE(Pickle) Has it been unequivocally verified that under no circumstances whatsoever can multiple layers be laid down in a single year? First, I assume you understand that 200 inches of light powdery snow in Greenland, or the Antactic, will only melt down once in a season. And, 200 inches of very wet snow will form a larger meltdown growthring. Also, that the various component they study in each ring will vary from year to year, and also that counting back 1928 rings will bring you to AD 79 when a certain mountain erupted in Italy and left it's ash in that very ring. This indicates that counting rings is dependable...unmistakable. Same with the lead particles they've found in certain annual growth rings during the era when Romans were smeltering lead in pots. This accuracy leads to dependability on the rest. But there's a whole lot more than just this, I'm sure. QUOTE Do they believe the Bible when it says that God created the world in 6 days, each with a single morning and a single evening? Ellen White wrote a chapter on that question with a title of "Disguised Infidelity," decalring the position that the days of Gen. 1 are not literal days to be just that. Like I said before, this is unknown from scientist to scientist. I'm guessing that a Christian scientist, if involved in the GISP/GRIP expeditions, believed in a limited 6000 year earth history, but counted rings adding up contrary to the full generations listed in the bible, that scientist would want to go back and check the accuracy of the biblical account...much like the RCC altered its understanding of the verse that says the sun riseth. Even Religious scholars can get hung up on what and what not is literal. Galileo proved to them that the sun doesn't rise. QUOTE When you have scientists declaring interpretations of data to be fact, and those scientists are operating from the presuppositions that the Bible is wrong, that life evolved, that the world is 4.5 billion years old, etc., it behooves us to carefully examine the basis for their pronouncements to see if there are any mistakes in their research. We don't know what or if any of these scientists presuposed. Plus, in discovering the Present Truth in these GISP/GRIP projects, there is nothing for scientists--SDA Christians or otherwise--to assume the earth is 4.5 billion years old; only that snow has been falling on this earth for only several hundred thousand years. How do we know that trees haven't produced two growth rings in one year...back when the laws of nature might have been vastly different? When drilling a core out of the oldest tree ever found, Methuselah, scientists have just never been given a reason to believe this has ever happened. Regular seasons are what shapes the rings in the dependable areas where ice is drilled. It took them a while to find those dependable areas. Qualified scientists wouldn't want their results distorted anymore than the faith believer. Science is all about finding Present Truth that can be verified without failure or misinterprtation (like day for a year thing). I think EGW equates the seventh thousand year to the 7th day of the week. QUOTE Thus, when it comes to accepting the conclusions of evolutionists why don't believe the Bible regarding data such as ice cores, conclusions that contradict Scripture, experience tells me that there must be a thorough analysis of their work first. The same can be said of the RCC who believed it when the bible said the sun rises. I think you'll find the analysis standards of the GISP/GRIP scientists were much higher than we can imagine, and much higher than that of your average faith believer type...who accepts the truth of their favorite authority--hook, line, and sinker--without question. QUOTE And how did they determine that the highest point had not changed in the previous 100,000 years? I guessing here, reasoning from cause to effect. By centralizing, and by drilling in places where layers (and particles within) were obviously duplicated. -------------------- Disclaimer Notice: You are hereby cautioned that the information contained within these posts are for the sole purpose of provoking thought, adding fair comment on matters of public interest, and not providing factual information. These posts do not reflect the actual thoughts or intentions of the person writing under this username since said person is not in any position to know. No effort has been made to ensure the accuracy of any personal view, opinion, or hyperbole presented. Therefore, by disclosing, copying, or distributing these posts to others, such information must subsequently be confirmed in writing, signed and dated, by the actual person, or persons, posting behind username LaurenceD.
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Aug 31 2007, 09:55 AM
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#133
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500 + posts Group: Members Posts: 691 Joined: 20-February 07 Member No.: 3,035 Gender: m |
Again, this is somewhat off-topic. I don't plan on pursuing this here. Maybe start another thread on another forum--and continue on if you'd like. I'll be gone for a few days though.
-------------------- Disclaimer Notice: You are hereby cautioned that the information contained within these posts are for the sole purpose of provoking thought, adding fair comment on matters of public interest, and not providing factual information. These posts do not reflect the actual thoughts or intentions of the person writing under this username since said person is not in any position to know. No effort has been made to ensure the accuracy of any personal view, opinion, or hyperbole presented. Therefore, by disclosing, copying, or distributing these posts to others, such information must subsequently be confirmed in writing, signed and dated, by the actual person, or persons, posting behind username LaurenceD.
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Aug 31 2007, 10:00 AM
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#134
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 Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 356 Joined: 25-December 06 From: West Frankfort, IL Member No.: 2,722 Gender: m |
QUOTE(Statrei @ Aug 31 2007, 09:43 AM) No informed person today believes the earth is six thousand years old or that life on earth is only six thousand years old. Thankfully, the bible never makes such a claim. Color me uninformed, then. -------------------- Duane Clem
It's not about religion, it's about a relationship. Gems of Wisdom "Lisa and Ronda are not Danny's biological father." -- wwjd, 2/8/07 "Watchbird, The facts prove the above lie." -- wwjd, 2/13/07 "Another lie that can be proven..." -- Bystander, 3/18/07 "The thing about lies is they can be proven." -- Aletheia, 3/22/07 "I am not here to argue" -- Aletheia, 4/24/07 "She didn't move to 3ABN, she moved to Illinois" -- Aletheia, 4/25/07 "Hope is liberal. 3abn is not." -- steffan, 6/9/07 "Danny Shelton does not decide what goes on the air, period." -- appletree, 8/22/07 http://www.save-3abn.com/ http://www.investigating3abn.info/ http://rescue3abn.blog.com/ http://www.abundantrest.org/?p=74 http://abundantrest.org/2007/02/18/3abn-sa...ons-retirement/ http://anewsabbathschool.blogspot.com/2006...ain-wrecks.html http://cafesda.blogspot.com/2006/08/atoday...bn-news_21.html http://www.atoday.com/email/2007/02/12/ http://spectrummagazine.typepad.com/the_sp...eans_and_e.html |
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Aug 31 2007, 11:25 AM
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#135
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 500 + posts Group: Banned Posts: 655 Joined: 6-December 06 From: USA Member No.: 2,621 Gender: f |
QUOTE(Statrei @ Aug 30 2007, 05:03 PM) QUOTE Artiste: Well that's a new one! Cain's murder of his brother was not his fault? **************************************************** Where did I say it was not his fault? When you posted this". If Cain had not been made to believe that the Creator loved him less because of his independent choice of offering, thus rendering him dispensable, he would never have killed his brother." I took it the same way. I have a different view of the Lord and Cain, who apparently knew better, for the Lord tried to reason with him and remind him of that, but it did no good. But unto Cain and to his offering he had not respect. And Cain was very wroth, and his countenance fell. And the LORD said unto Cain, Why art thou wroth? and why is thy countenance fallen? If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him. And Cain talked with Abel his brother: and it came to pass, when they were in the field, that Cain rose up against Abel his brother, and slew him This post has been edited by Aletheia: Aug 31 2007, 11:31 AM -------------------- And ye shall not swear by my name falsely, neither shalt thou profane the name of thy God: I am the LORD. .. in righteousness shalt thou judge thy neighbour.
Thou shalt not go up and down as a talebearer among thy people: neither shalt thou stand against the blood of thy neighbour: I am the LORD. Thou shalt not hate thy brother in thine heart: thou shalt in any wise rebuke thy neighbour, and not suffer sin upon him. Thou shalt not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I am the LORD. Lev 19:12-18 Pro 26:20 Where no wood is, there the fire goeth out: so where there is no talebearer, the strife ceaseth. |
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