3abn Board Of Directors Official Position..., Is 3ABN affiliated with the SDA Church or not?? Options

[Snoopy]

I know this topic has been discussed in various threads here, and I am not trying to "beat a dead horse". But I am curious what the official position is of the 3ABN Board of Directors. What is 3ABN's relationship, if any, with the SDA Church?

Appletree? (Yes, I see that you are "away" from BSDA right now - perhaps you could reply via a friend??) Panther? Aletheia? FHB? Dona? I'd be interested in any of your thoughts, as you all seem to be very well versed in the internal operations of 3ABN. Of course, I'm interested in everyone else's thoughts as well!!!

~~Snoopy~~

This post has been edited by Snoopy: Sep 7 2007, 10:17 AM

[LaurenceD]

This probably best sums up the official postion and is they way the 3abn/SDA Church relationship is described in the Illinois Dept. of Rev., by Judge Barbara Rowe-- Recommendation for Disposition:

64. On November 4, 1997, applicant executed a Joint Declaration of Commitment
(hereinafter referred to as the “Declaration”) with the General Conference of Seventh-day
Adventists. The declaration details commitments of the two entities and issues resolution. The
declaration states that the common vision:
Includes strategic planning sessions, counseling on matters of
common interest, praying, dreaming and planning together. We
welcome the opportunity to join together in coordinating and
executing the global mission of reaching every nation, kindred,
tongue and people with the message of the saving grace of Christ
and His soon coming in the context of the Great Controversy and
the Three Angels’ Messages of Revelation 14. (Applicant’s Ex.
No. 9; Tr. pp. 96-100)
65. The declaration states that:
The General Conference of Seventh-day Adventists and Three
Angels Broadcasting Network are committed to faithfulness to
God’s Word and loyalty to Bible truth as formulated in the 27
Fundamental Beliefs of the Seventh-day Adventist Church. We
believe that our shared commitment to world evangelism through
media compels us to seek ways to cooperate in the task of reaching
the world for Christ. We believe that much more can be
accomplished to hasten the Lords return through cooperation in an
atmosphere of mutual trust and confidence. (Applicant’s Ex. No.
9)
66. According to the declaration, applicant agrees that:
As leaders of Three Angels Broadcasting Network (3ABN), we
commit ourselves to:
A. Offer our resources in accordance with 3ABN’s operational
policies to support the mission of, and work in cooperation with,
the Seventh-day Adventist Church in the proclamation of the
everlasting gospel to the entire world.
B. Proclaim the gospel in its purity and simplicity while being
sensitive to the unique cultures of people in countries around the
world.
16 Applicant’s president testified “Unrestricted funds are donations that come into Three Angels Broadcasting
Network that people don’t specify what they want it used for.” (Tr. p. 343)
19
C. Reiterate our endorsement of the concept of the Seventh-day
Adventist Church organization as set forth in the book Seventh-day
Adventists Believe, Chapters 11-13, and in the writings of Ellen G.
White.
D. Recognize the local and regional constituent responsibility and
leadership in administering activities and operations of the Church
and their territory.
E. Restate our support for integrating new members into the body
of Christ and, more specifically, encouraging membership in the
Seventh-day Adventist Church around the world. (Applicant’s Ex.
No. 9)
67. According to the declaration, the administrators of the General Conference of
Seventh-day Adventists commit themselves to:
A. Reaffirm the profound spiritual truth that God calls and
empowers both individuals and supporting ministries who are
committed to the mission of the Seventh-day Adventist Church, to
join with the Church, its institutions and organizations in the
proclamation of the gospel.
B. Establish such official communication and planning forums,
including supporting ministries such as 3ABN, with world and
division leaders as may be appropriate.
C. Encourage General Conference departments, world divisions,
and Church institutions to utilize the services of 3ABN for
production and distribution of programming as may be appropriate,
with the understanding that the agreements between the applicable
Seventh-day Adventist organizations and 3ABN, include-at a
minimum-that the financial arrangements and copyright ownership
be documented in writing.
D. Encourage Seventh-day Adventist Church organizations to
submit programming for distribution on 3ABN with the
recognition and understanding that 3ABN will review all
programming.
E. Encourage the fostering of a spirit of unity and cooperation
between all organizations of the Seventh-day Adventist Church
and 3ABN. (Applicant’s Ex. No. 9)
68. The declaration also contains a three-step process for resolution of problems.
(Applicant’s Ex. No. 9)
20
69. The General Conference of the Seventh–day Adventist Church purchased airtime
from applicant during the 2000 and 2001 calendar years. (Tr. pp. 368-369)
70. Applicant is not part of the Seventh-day Adventist Church. (Tr. p. 368)
71. Applicant is not a Seventh-day Adventist institution. (Tr. p. 97)
72. Applicant was established, organized and is operated by lay people. (Intervenor’s
Ex. No. 8 p. 400033)
73. Applicant is not owned by or controlled by the Seventh-day Adventist Church. (Tr.
p. 99)
74. Applicant’s staff includes four Seventh-day Adventist ministers that answer
telephones and pray with people in the two 14’ x 18’ offices. The pastors lead daily worship
services and view the videotapes for content that is consistent with applicant’s purposes.17
Sabbath services, foot washings, marriages, and baptisms are not held on the property in
question. (Tr. pp. 531-541)

In light of the above, the compound is a "religious organization" (p. 17), albeit non-denomination, but appears to be ready for baptism into the SDA Church...as an official part of the denomination (see reference to 27 Fund. Beliefs, #65 above).

[Snoopy]

Thank you for that, LD. I do remember reading that. But I am still real interested to hear the opinions of the Danny camp. However it seems they have all disappeared or just do not want to answer this question (or maybe they do not HAVE an answer to this question...) When appletree gets banned do they all disappear together??

This post has been edited by Snoopy: Sep 7 2007, 10:21 PM

[Panama_Pete]

In light of the above, the compound is a "religious organization" (p. 17), albeit non-denomination, but appears to be ready for baptism into the SDA Church...as an official part of the denomination (see reference to 27 Fund. Beliefs, #65 above).

What page 17 giveth, page 45 taketh away.

I understand Judge Rowe to be saying -- on page 45 -- that the applicant is a broadcasting network that just happens to air programming that appeals to a religiously-oriented client base. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong:

http://www.revenue.state.il.us/legalinform...s/pt/pt04-1.pdf

Page 45 from above link.


"Danny and Linda Shelton have control of applicant. They regulate the amount they are
paid. They have control of programming. They regulate all contracts. Applicant uses this
property to produce television programs, to sell equipment, radio and television time, and to sell
merchandise, and, absent evidence to the contrary, sales are made at commercially competitive
prices.

While a significant portion of the materials may incidentally relate to religious topics,
applicant is a radio and television/satellite broadcasting, sales, and publishing corporation that sells, markets and/or otherwise distributes its products to outside entities or individuals.

Outside entities are attracted to the content of applicant’s programs that are consistent with the tenets of
the Seventh-day Adventist Church, yet the existence of this religiously-oriented client base does
not impute upon applicant the characterization that applicant is, itself, a religious institution using the subject property in furtherance of religious or charitable activities."

[princessdi]

So Pete, in plain english, 3ABN never did calssify itself "legally" as a religious network? They just "happen" to broad cast mostly religious programs?

[princessdi]

So Pete, in plain english, 3ABN never did calssify itself "legally" as a religious network? They just "happen" to broad cast mostly religious programs?

[beartrap]

That is interesting. Two open cases: the current appeal to the tax suit they lost in which they enumerate 3ABN's denominationalism and church affiliations, and the Pickle/Joy case in which they deny any church affiliations or denominationalism. Two current and open cases that appear to present contradictory descriptions of 3ABN and its programming. Would anyone care to clear up that odd conundrum?

Also, could any legal minds in the house comment on whether the documentation from either of these cases can be used in the other case as evidence?

This post has been edited by beartrap: Sep 7 2007, 10:51 PM

[Panama_Pete]

So Pete, in plain English, 3ABN never did classify itself "legally" as a religious network? They just "happen" to broad cast mostly religious programs?

As you stated, 3ABN did not end up at the end of the court case classified "legally" as a religious organization by Judge Rowe. It ended up, in plain English, as just a broadcasting network that, in this case, offers religious and lifestyle programming.

They may have wanted to be treated as a religious organization, but did not achieve being classified as one with the judge's ruling.

That's provided I interpreted the judge's remarks correctly.

[Fran]

That is interesting. Two open cases: the current appeal to the tax suit they lost in which they enumerate 3ABN's denominational-ism and church affiliations, and the Pickle/Joy case in which they deny any church affiliations or denominational-ism. Two current and open cases that appear to present a contradictory description of 3ABN and its programming. Would anyone care to clear up that odd conundrum?

Also, could any legal minds in the house comment on whether the documentation from either of these cases can be used in the other case as evidence?

Bear:

I believe 3ABN will bend over backwards to keep the Property Tax Lawsuit out of the case against Joy and Pickle.

When I am called for my statement, I won't have to make one, all I will have to do is cite the Lawsuit! It will be from legal documentation and the Form 990's that are also public documents. Then there is the audits at the Attorney Generals site!

When one gets hold of a gravy train, it takes special forces to get them to let it go, I know this from personal experience.

FHB:

There is one particular Board Member that knew of a very LARGE financial problem as far back as 2001. Yes, this person knew! However, they did NOTHING about it until Nick Miller decided to see 9if what was being said was true. And in Jan of 2006, this Board Member still knew it was happening, but asked others to keep it quiet! They did, but I know they knew! The circle has been growing by leaps and bounds. They know that they knew what they knew; they knew what it was that they knew!

I plan to tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth! I wonder what the Judge will do when this lawsuit comes to light. Talk to your contact on the 3ABN Board, you know the one. That Board member has been used and abused for say 20 years? In FACT, I see this "Cherished Friend" of Danny Shelton being led to the cross to be crucified. Will you be there to help? Help will be neededd especially when you find that something they believed in with all their heart has never been what they thought. I am praying especially for this person. It is hard to see the forest for the trees.

Everybody;

Please pray special prayers for all the Board Members, but pray for this "Special Member" and their family extra hard. They are going to need it when all the evidence hits the fan. Everyone at 3ABN needs our prayers especially now, as the time is fast approaching for the truth is to be revealed. Please, no gloating from either side.

[LaurenceD]

The above list from the court document came from under the heading--FINDINGS OF FACT - Religious Considerations.

The following is Finding of Fact #63.

Applicant is exempt from the payment of Illinois Retailers’ Occupation Tax and
related taxes pursuant to a finding by the Department of Revenue that applicant is a religious
organization under those tax laws. (Applicant’s Ex. Nos. 6, 7)

Then there's these Findings of Fact:

70. Applicant is not part of the Seventh-day Adventist Church. (Tr. p. 368)
71. Applicant is not a Seventh-day Adventist institution. (Tr. p. 97)
73. Applicant is not owned by or controlled by the Seventh-day Adventist Church. (Tr. p. 99)

They're a non-denominational religious organization...as of now, but close enough to us be included I think. So, I think 3abn is ready for baptism (they accept our 27 Fundamental Beliefs).

[ex3ABNemployee]

Bear:

I believe 3ABN will bend over backwards to keep the Property Tax Lawsuit out of the case against Joy and Pickle.

When I am called for my statement, I won't have to make one, all I will have to do is cite the Lawsuit! It will be from legal documentation and the Form 990's that are also public documents. Then there is the audits at the Attorney Generals site!

When one gets hold of a gravy train, it takes special forces to get them to let it go, I know this from personal experience.

FHB:

There is one particular Board Member that knew of a very LARGE financial problem as far back as 2001. Yes, this person knew! However, they did NOTHING about it until Nick Miller decided to see 9if what was being said was true. And in Jan of 2006, this Board Member still knew it was happening, but asked others to keep it quiet! They did, but I know they knew! The circle has been growing by leaps and bounds. They know that they knew what they knew; they knew what it was that they knew!

I plan to tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth! I wonder what the Judge will do when this lawsuit comes to light. Talk to your contact on the 3ABN Board, you know the one. That Board member has been used and abused for say 20 years? In FACT, I see this "Cherished Friend" of Danny Shelton being led to the cross to be crucified. Will you be there to help? Help will be neededd especially when you find that something they believed in with all their heart has never been what they thought. I am praying especially for this person. It is hard to see the forest for the trees.

Everybody;

Please pray special prayers for all the Board Members, but pray for this "Special Member" and their family extra hard. They are going to need it when all the evidence hits the fan. Everyone at 3ABN needs our prayers especially now, as the time is fast approaching for the truth is to be revealed. Please, no gloating from either side.

I agree, Fran. This is no time for gloating. The lives of many people have to potential to be ruined, or at least forever changed. We need to pray for all involved, including Danny and Tommy. God CAN restore them.

[LaurenceD]

What page 17 giveth, page 45 taketh away.

I understand Judge Rowe to be saying -- on page 45 -- that the applicant is a broadcasting network that just happens to air programming that appeals to a religiously-oriented client base. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong:

I know what you're saying.

The court document goes on to say, under the next heading--Conclusions of Law--Religious Tax Exemption Standards and 3ABN’s Claim for Religious Exemption

As a preliminary matter, applicant is not organized and operated as a religious
corporation under the Illinois Religious Corporation Act, found at 805 ILCS 110/0.01 et seq.
Rather, applicant is incorporated under the General Not for Profit Corporation Act. 805 ILCS
105/101.01 et seq. The Illinois General Assembly has recognized organizational and operational
differences between the two types of organizations and has established different and separate
statutory schemes to govern those differences. Implicit in such legislative action is the
recognition that religious corporations and general not for profit corporations are separate,
distinct, and different legal entities. Therefore, as a matter of law, applicant is not a religious
corporation.
35 ILCS 200/15-40 establishes the standard for obtaining an exemption from property
tax as a religious organization. First, the property must be used exclusively for religious
purposes and second, it must not be used with a view to profit. This standard is satisfied if it is
shown that the property is primarily used for religious purposes, even though it may also be used
for a secondary or incidental purpose. McKenzie v. Johnson, 98 Ill.2d 87 (1983).

What happened is that 3abn never lost its status as a "religious organization" under Illinois law, for tax purposes, but the amount of exempt property was severely reduced to just two small rooms.

[Artiste]

Bear:

I believe 3ABN will bend over backwards to keep the Property Tax Lawsuit out of the case against Joy and Pickle.

When I am called for my statement, I won't have to make one, all I will have to do is cite the Lawsuit! It will be from legal documentation and the Form 990's that are also public documents. Then there is the audits at the Attorney Generals site!

When one gets hold of a gravy train, it takes special forces to get them to let it go, I know this from personal experience.

FHB:

There is one particular Board Member that knew of a very LARGE financial problem as far back as 2001. Yes, this person knew! However, they did NOTHING about it until Nick Miller decided to see 9if what was being said was true. And in Jan of 2006, this Board Member still knew it was happening, but asked others to keep it quiet! They did, but I know they knew! The circle has been growing by leaps and bounds. They know that they knew what they knew; they knew what it was that they knew!

I plan to tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth! I wonder what the Judge will do when this lawsuit comes to light. Talk to your contact on the 3ABN Board, you know the one. That Board member has been used and abused for say 20 years? In FACT, I see this "Cherished Friend" of Danny Shelton being led to the cross to be crucified. Will you be there to help? Help will be neededd especially when you find that something they believed in with all their heart has never been what they thought. I am praying especially for this person. It is hard to see the forest for the trees.

Everybody;

Please pray special prayers for all the Board Members, but pray for this "Special Member" and their family extra hard. They are going to need it when all the evidence hits the fan. Everyone at 3ABN needs our prayers especially now, as the time is fast approaching for the truth is to be revealed. Please, no gloating from either side.

Fran, there seems to me to be a dichotomy developing here.

While some dire events appear to be coming like a freight train, as you are discussing above, on the other hand, the official Adventist entity seems to be circling the wagons around 3ABN.

With Elder Jim Gilley as the new president and powerful new board members with financial clout and political maneuvering abilities, 3ABN seems to have taken on a new luster and credibility.

I say this because of what I am hearing this evening on Pastor Doug Batchelor's "Here We Stand" series in which Amazing Facts is partnering with 3ABN as well as the messages last night from Don Schneider and Doug Batchelor to 3ABN.


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This post has been edited by Artiste: Sep 7 2007, 11:26 PM

[Aletheia]

Bear:

I believe 3ABN will bend over backwards to keep the Property Tax Lawsuit out of the case against Joy and Pickle.

When I am called for my statement, I won't have to make one, all I will have to do is cite the Lawsuit! It will be from legal documentation and the Form 990's that are also public documents. Then there is the audits at the Attorney Generals site!

When one gets hold of a gravy train, it takes special forces to get them to let it go, I know this from personal experience.

FHB:

There is one particular Board Member that knew of a very LARGE financial problem as far back as 2001. Yes, this person knew! However, they did NOTHING about it until Nick Miller decided to see 9if what was being said was true. And in Jan of 2006, this Board Member still knew it was happening, but asked others to keep it quiet! They did, but I know they knew! The circle has been growing by leaps and bounds. They know that they knew what they knew; they knew what it was that they knew!

I plan to tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth! I wonder what the Judge will do when this lawsuit comes to light. Talk to your contact on the 3ABN Board, you know the one. That Board member has been used and abused for say 20 years? In FACT, I see this "Cherished Friend" of Danny Shelton being led to the cross to be crucified. Will you be there to help? Help will be neededd especially when you find that something they believed in with all their heart has never been what they thought. I am praying especially for this person. It is hard to see the forest for the trees.

Everybody;

Please pray special prayers for all the Board Members, but pray for this "Special Member" and their family extra hard. They are going to need it when all the evidence hits the fan. Everyone at 3ABN needs our prayers especially now, as the time is fast approaching for the truth is to be revealed. Please, no gloating from either side.

This is outrageous.

I am totally appalled.

[Artiste]

This is outrageous.

I am totally appalled.

Appalled? Why?



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