The Latest In The 3-ring Circus, Discount Attorneys? Options

[Pickle]

Awhile back someone asked me, maybe it was Duane, if Danny got discount attorneys. I highly doubt they come at a discount, but maybe one doesn't always get what they pay for.

AppleTree I think it was spilled the beans here about Gailon's bankruptcy. Well, the other side gave notice to the court about it, Gailon didn't. That put an automatic stay in place as far as Gailon's involvement in the suit goes. That was before mid-September.

Not too long ago they filed a motion with the court asking for a status conference, and acting real worried about the possibility that Gailon's computer might get sold before they could get a copy of his hard drive. I think it was last Friday that a magistrate granted them the motion for the conference, which is to be next Tuesday, and said that a computer forensics expert could make a copy of the hard drive by this Friday.

The way I read two different orders by two different judges, I would say that these attorneys have violated both those orders, and possibly violated the automatic stay as well.

But that's not all. Now 3ABN has hired an attorney to represent it in Bankruptcy Court as a creditor of Gailon's, which Gailon says is a violation of a number of federal statutes. For one thing, how is 3ABN his creditor? He hasn't borrowed money from them, and they sure haven't won a judgment against him.

I'll post correspondence and documents as I have opportunity, but things are going to be busy for awhile. I'll tell you more later.

This post has been edited by Pickle: Nov 9 2007, 07:41 AM

[Fran]

Awhile back someone asked me, maybe it was Duane, if Danny got discount attorneys. I highly doubt they come at a discount, but maybe one doesn't always get what they pay for.

AppleTree I think it was spilled the beans here about Gailon's bankruptcy. Well, the other side gave notice to the court about it, Gailon didn't. That put an automatic stay in place as far as Gailon's involvement in the suit goes. That was before mid-September.

Not too long ago they filed a motion with the court asking for a settlement conference, and acting real worried about the possibility that Gailon's computer might get sold before they could get a copy of his hard drive. I think it was last Friday that a magistrate granted them the motion for the conference, which is to be next Tuesday, and said that a computer forensics expert could make a copy of the hard drive by this Friday.

The way I read two different orders by two different judges, I would say that these attorneys have violated both those orders, and possibly violated the automatic stay as well.

But that's not all. Now 3ABN has hired an attorney to represent it in Bankruptcy Court as a creditor of Gailon's, which Gailon says is a violation of a number of federal statutes. For one thing, how is 3ABN his creditor? He hasn't borrowed money from them, and they sure haven't won a judgment against him.

I'll post correspondence and documents as I have opportunity, but things are going to be busy for awhile. I'll tell you more later.

If this wasn't serious it would be outright funny! Wow, maybe I can file against 3ABN with me as the creditor and 3ABN as the one who owes me? Whatcha think?

[fallible humanbe...]

If this wasn't serious it would be outright funny! Wow, maybe I can file against 3ABN with me as the creditor and 3ABN as the one who owes me? Whatcha think?

It might interest all that Robert Pickle is not presenting to you correct information. 3ABN filed a request for a status conference on 10/24/07 (when I figure out how to attach the doc I will do so - it is available via Pacer). There was no mention of "settlement" at all. This was clearly an attempt to create perception among the readers here, since most do not have access to the documentation and take his word for it on most, if not everything.

Now, in light of the fact that we have evidence of:

1. embezzlement
2. failure to pay rent (John Alfke, a former landlord, reference on another BB, which also included reference of multiple instances of such acts)
3. car repossession

as well as other ignored responsibilities, you might find item #6 interesting . . .

"Defendant Joy's bankruptcy proceedings raise an additional issue regarding a potential conflict of interest. While Defendant Joy is proceeding pro se in this matter, he is represented by Attorney Laird Heal in the bankruptcy proceedings. Attorney Heal represents co-defendant Robert Pickle in the instant matter. Plaintiffs counsel has contacted Attorney Heal regarding conflict of interest arising from the fact that his client in bankruptcy, Defendant Joy, seeks to discharge any and all liability to Plaintiffs, which would have the effect of shifting full liability for damages onto his other client, Defendant Pickle. Attorney Heal has failed to respond in any way."

It would be very convenient for Joy to set himself up to have no responsibility should he lose the case, leaving Robert Pickle to bear the full responsibility of any future settlement. It is interesting that Joy would file bankruptcy upon the realization that his computers might very well be required as evidence (even Robert Pickle in another post today has attempted to set the spin stage by suggesting that some might read his correspondence, as submitted in the current case, as problematic when compared to his claims about his behavior and activities since his involvement).

If, as they claim, they are on the "up and up", it strikes one as very interesting that there should be any problem with turning over any correspondence (or digital storage units) or documentation detailing their actions over the past months. They knew what would happen if there was ever a court case and their shock and disingenuous indignation doesn't ring true. If they have been honest in all dealings then there should be no concern on their part in showing what they have. Recent comments and claims such as th following:

"Since I have surrendered such correspondence pertaining to the Shelton debacle in my automatic discovery materials, including correspondence that could be miscontrued [sic], and since I have not sought a protective order, there is always the possibility that AppleTree will post some of it here, or someone will get it to Alfred Smith so he can start a SavePickle blog. And I will just have to live with that . . . But I do think it in the best interest of the other side not to miscontrue [sic] anything they might find in my correspondence. Because that kind of thing will not happen without rebuttal." Link

should raise red flags. Why would it be necessary to comment on the possibility that his correspondence might be "misconstrued" if it was honest, forth-right, and completely without agenda? Additionally, why would Robert ask those here (by insinuation) to call Senators and ask them to include 3ABN in the recently mentioned actions? Why wouldn't he do it himself? After all he called the Senator - why not finish the job he is asking others to do?

- FHB

(Note: I do not have a panel to include links or upload files, when these functions come back I will edit this post to include both . . . as of 12:00 CT 9 Nov 2007, I still do not have access to any tools other than to post a text only format . . . obviously Robert Pickle has access to tools to insert links, unless he is hard coding them in himself . . . I can not even get the "Toggle Side Panel" or the "BB Code Help" functions to work . . . I don't know if these tools are being blocked or if their is an internal error situation that is keeping them unavailable . . . 12:45, a little research and I was able to hard code the link in, but can not upload anything.)

This post has been edited by fallible humanbeing: Nov 9 2007, 01:41 PM

[Fran]

It might interest all that Robert Pickle is not presenting to you correct information. 3ABN filed a request for a status conference on 10/24/07 (when I figure out how to attach the doc I will do so - it is available via Pacer). There was no mention of "settlement" at all. This was clearly an attempt to create perception among the readers here, since most do not have access to the documentation and take his word for it on most, if not everything.

Now, in light of the fact that we have evidence of:

1. embezzlement
2. failure to pay rent (John Alfke, a former landlord, reference on another BB, which also included reference of multiple instances of such acts)
3. car repossession

as well as other ignored responsibilities, you might find item #6 interesting . . .

"Defendant Joy's bankruptcy proceedings raise an additional issue regarding a potential conflict of interest. While Defendant Joy is proceeding pro se in this matter, he is represented by Attorney Laird Heal in the bankruptcy proceedings. Attorney Heal represents co-defendant Robert Pickle in the instant matter. Plaintiffs counsel has contacted Attorney Heal regarding conflict of interest arising from the fact that his client in bankruptcy, Defendant Joy, seeks to discharge any and all liability to Plaintiffs, which would have the effect of shifting full liability for damages onto his other client, Defendant Pickle. Attorney Heal has failed to respond in any way."

It would be very convenient for Joy to set himself up to have no responsibility should he lose the case, leaving Robert Pickle to bear the full responsibility of any future settlement. It is interesting that Joy would file bankruptcy upon the realization that his computers might very well be required as evidence (even Robert Pickle in another post today has attempted to set the spin stage by suggesting that some might read his correspondence, as submitted in the current case, as problematic when compared to his claims about his behavior and activities since his involvement).

If, as they claim, they are on the "up and up", it strikes one as very interesting that there should be any problem with turning over any correspondence (or digital storage units) or documentation detailing their actions over the past months. They knew what would happen if there was ever a court case and their shock and disingenuous indignation doesn't ring true. If they have been honest in all dealings then there should be no concern on their part in showing what they have. Recent comments and claims such as th following:

"Since I have surrendered such correspondence pertaining to the Shelton debacle in my automatic discovery materials, including correspondence that could be miscontrued [sic], and since I have not sought a protective order, there is always the possibility that AppleTree will post some of it here, or someone will get it to Alfred Smith so he can start a SavePickle blog. And I will just have to live with that . . . But I do think it in the best interest of the other side not to miscontrue [sic] anything they might find in my correspondence. Because that kind of thing will not happen without rebuttal." LINK

should raise red flags. Why would it be necessary to comment on the possibility that his correspondence might be "misconstrued" if it was honest, forth-right, and completely without agenda? Additionally, why would Robert ask those here (by insinuation) to call Senators and ask them to include 3ABN in the recently mentioned actions? Why wouldn't he do it himself? After all he called the Senator - why not finish the job he would like others to do?

- FHB

(Note: I do not have a panel to include links or upload files, when these functions come back I will edit this post to include both)

I did not send my comments to the Senator because of the "Pickle" comments in this thread! I sent it because of the obvious discrepancies I have see in 3ABN from 1998-2007. I do not believe "this thread" will cause any one to write the Senator. Now, facts that have been made available from court documents and other non-court documentation probably will though. That is what made me write to the dear Senator. The more people looking into 3ABN, the better! I told the Senator that I did NOT want 3ABN shut down, but I did want to see future transparent accountability. If this fails, IMO, I believe we should start a very serious grassroots campaigns to stop 3ABN from sucking the Adventist Members dry! Just my 2 cents worth.

I will be watching for your edit to include files and links about "Pickles" comments, the subject of this thread.

[appletree]

Awhile back someone asked me, maybe it was Duane, if Danny got discount attorneys. I highly doubt they come at a discount, but maybe one doesn't always get what they pay for.

AppleTree I think it was spilled the beans here about Gailon's bankruptcy. Well, the other side gave notice to the court about it, Gailon didn't. That put an automatic stay in place as far as Gailon's involvement in the suit goes. That was before mid-September.

Not too long ago they filed a motion with the court asking for a settlement conference, and acting real worried about the possibility that Gailon's computer might get sold before they could get a copy of his hard drive. I think it was last Friday that a magistrate granted them the motion for the conference, which is to be next Tuesday, and said that a computer forensics expert could make a copy of the hard drive by this Friday.

The way I read two different orders by two different judges, I would say that these attorneys have violated both those orders, and possibly violated the automatic stay as well.

But that's not all. Now 3ABN has hired an attorney to represent it in Bankruptcy Court as a creditor of Gailon's, which Gailon says is a violation of a number of federal statutes. For one thing, how is 3ABN his creditor? He hasn't borrowed money from them, and they sure haven't won a judgment against him.

I'll post correspondence and documents as I have opportunity, but things are going to be busy for awhile. I'll tell you more later.

Of course we all know that Gailon knows more than 3abn's highly respected lawfirm. After all he has AU reporter by his name..that stands for a whole lot.
Let me just say this Bob...you're right....you are going to be busy for awhile.

[appletree]

I did not send my comments to the Senator because of the "Pickle" comments in this thread! I sent it because of the obvious discrepancies I have see in 3ABN from 1998-2007. I do not believe "this thread" will cause any one to write the Senator. Now, facts that have been made available from court documents and other non-court documentation probably will though. That is what made me write to the dear Senator. The more people looking into 3ABN, the better! I told the Senator that I did NOT want 3ABN shut down, but I did want to see future transparent accountability. If this fails, IMO, I believe we should start a very serious grassroots campaigns to stop 3ABN from sucking the Adventist Members dry! Just my 2 cents worth.

I will be watching for your edit to include files and links about "Pickles" comments, the subject of this thread.

For someone who says they don't want 3abn shut down, I find your choice of words (stop 3abn from sucking the adventist members dry) to contradict that. How do you think this ministry or any other functions except by donations? Nobody is sucking anyone dry. People give by choice and impression. Without those giving people, 3abn would shut down in a minute as well as all of our other ministries. 3abn pays megabucks for 24/7 satellite time, broadcasting fees, payroll, equipment, utilities, insurance, upkeep on the satellite trucks, mailing costs..etc. etc...The list of expenses is too long to continue.. Your statements are without logic or merit. If you truly want the ministry to survive the Adventist members must be willing to give and many are, faithful supporters. You on one hand have said you are not against the ministry and yet on the other hand, you are calling senators and no telling who else. Every phone call you make and every rumor you repeat is working against 3abn, against those that support it, and if it ever does shut down, it will because of people like you that are talking out of 2 sides of their mouths.

I'll tell you something Fran. If I were you I would be scared to death to be purposely active in events that could cause the demise of God's ministry. You see, whether you like this or don't like that, or whether you hate Danny or you don't or whether you think 3abn's tax forms are incorrect...it's all rather irrelevent because this is God's ministry and He is in charge. He always has been and He always will be. He raised up 3abn. Certainly he worked through human beings, but work He did and He is in control. He blesses 3abn every single day that they continue to be on the air, spreading the gospel to all the world. He is there when the workers have worship and ask Him to give them new program ideas, reliable equipment and talented people. He is there with the guests when they come to give their testimonies and their music. He is there when the payroll is met and the satellite time is paid for. He is there when Danny and Jim are on their knees together praying for guidence, strength and wisdom for another day.

Yes mam....He makes his presence known at 3abn every single day because He is the real manager and president. Why don't you tell the Senator about that.

[appletree]

It might interest all that Robert Pickle is not presenting to you correct information. 3ABN filed a request for a status conference on 10/24/07 (when I figure out how to attach the doc I will do so - it is available via Pacer). There was no mention of "settlement" at all. This was clearly an attempt to create perception among the readers here, since most do not have access to the documentation and take his word for it on most, if not everything.

Now, in light of the fact that we have evidence of:

1. embezzlement
2. failure to pay rent (John Alfke, a former landlord, reference on another BB, which also included reference of multiple instances of such acts)
3. car repossession

as well as other ignored responsibilities, you might find item #6 interesting . . .

"Defendant Joy's bankruptcy proceedings raise an additional issue regarding a potential conflict of interest. While Defendant Joy is proceeding pro se in this matter, he is represented by Attorney Laird Heal in the bankruptcy proceedings. Attorney Heal represents co-defendant Robert Pickle in the instant matter. Plaintiffs counsel has contacted Attorney Heal regarding conflict of interest arising from the fact that his client in bankruptcy, Defendant Joy, seeks to discharge any and all liability to Plaintiffs, which would have the effect of shifting full liability for damages onto his other client, Defendant Pickle. Attorney Heal has failed to respond in any way."

It would be very convenient for Joy to set himself up to have no responsibility should he lose the case, leaving Robert Pickle to bear the full responsibility of any future settlement. It is interesting that Joy would file bankruptcy upon the realization that his computers might very well be required as evidence (even Robert Pickle in another post today has attempted to set the spin stage by suggesting that some might read his correspondence, as submitted in the current case, as problematic when compared to his claims about his behavior and activities since his involvement).

If, as they claim, they are on the "up and up", it strikes one as very interesting that there should be any problem with turning over any correspondence (or digital storage units) or documentation detailing their actions over the past months. They knew what would happen if there was ever a court case and their shock and disingenuous indignation doesn't ring true. If they have been honest in all dealings then there should be no concern on their part in showing what they have. Recent comments and claims such as th following:

"Since I have surrendered such correspondence pertaining to the Shelton debacle in my automatic discovery materials, including correspondence that could be miscontrued [sic], and since I have not sought a protective order, there is always the possibility that AppleTree will post some of it here, or someone will get it to Alfred Smith so he can start a SavePickle blog. And I will just have to live with that . . . But I do think it in the best interest of the other side not to miscontrue [sic] anything they might find in my correspondence. Because that kind of thing will not happen without rebuttal." LINK

should raise red flags. Why would it be necessary to comment on the possibility that his correspondence might be "misconstrued" if it was honest, forth-right, and completely without agenda? Additionally, why would Robert ask those here (by insinuation) to call Senators and ask them to include 3ABN in the recently mentioned actions? Why wouldn't he do it himself? After all he called the Senator - why not finish the job he would like others to do?

- FHB

(Note: I do not have a panel to include links or upload files, when these functions come back I will edit this post to include both)

mmm seems the judge is saying exactly what I told Pickle sometime ago when Joy filed bankruptcy. It was pretty clear that by doing so, Pickle will be left holding the bag should any sanctions or fines be handed down against our disastardly duo. Well...he was warned...if he wants to continue with his head stuck in the pickle jar, he has no one to blame but himself.

[Observer]

mmm seems the judge is saying exactly what I told Pickle sometime ago when Joy filed bankruptcy. It was pretty clear that by doing so, Pickle will be left holding the bag should any sanctions or fines be handed down against our disastardly duo. Well...he was warned...if he wants to continue with his head stuck in the pickle jar, he has no one to blame but himself.

Appletree:

The post by FHB is complex and subject of misunderstanding. I may have misunderstood it, and if that is so, correct me, as I assume you will do.

I understand the citations in FHBs post to be from a 3-ABN attorney. I understand your post to tell us that they came from the judge.

One of us has misunderstood. Either you misunderstood, and the citation comes from a 3-ABN attorney, or I misunderstood, and it comes from the judge.

Or, perhaps I have misunderstood you.

Is this important? Probably not of major importance. But, I will suggest that it is of value to know whether or not a citation comes from an attorney who represents a client in a case, or from a judge who decides questions in the case.

In any event, it is always of interest to read your comments. Personally, I take them as coming from an important source.

[Richard Sherwin]

Hey Appletree your post is irrelevant in light of the fact that 3abn is non-denominational. So what if SDA's quit giving? Besides if 3abn is God's ministry there is nothing that can stop it, even if all Adventist quit giving it will go on, right?

For someone who says they don't want 3abn shut down, I find your choice of words (stop 3abn from sucking the adventist members dry) to contradict that. How do you think this ministry or any other functions except by donations? Nobody is sucking anyone dry. People give by choice and impression. Without those giving people, 3abn would shut down in a minute as well as all of our other ministries. 3abn pays megabucks for 24/7 satellite time, broadcasting fees, payroll, equipment, utilities, insurance, upkeep on the satellite trucks, mailing costs..etc. etc...The list of expenses is too long to continue.. Your statements are without logic or merit. If you truly want the ministry to survive the Adventist members must be willing to give and many are, faithful supporters. You on one hand have said you are not against the ministry and yet on the other hand, you are calling senators and no telling who else. Every phone call you make and every rumor you repeat is working against 3abn, against those that support it, and if it ever does shut down, it will because of people like you that are talking out of 2 sides of their mouths.

I'll tell you something Fran. If I were you I would be scared to death to be purposely active in events that could cause the demise of God's ministry. You see, whether you like this or don't like that, or whether you hate Danny or you don't or whether you think 3abn's tax forms are incorrect...it's all rather irrelevent because this is God's ministry and He is in charge. He always has been and He always will be. He raised up 3abn. Certainly he worked through human beings, but work He did and He is in control. He blesses 3abn every single day that they continue to be on the air, spreading the gospel to all the world. He is there when the workers have worship and ask Him to give them new program ideas, reliable equipment and talented people. He is there with the guests when they come to give their testimonies and their music. He is there when the payroll is met and the satellite time is paid for. He is there when Danny and Jim are on their knees together praying for guidence, strength and wisdom for another day.

Yes mam....He makes his presence known at 3abn every single day because He is the real manager and president. Why don't you tell the Senator about that.

[Pickle]

Judge Saylor's Scheculing Order, signed by the court clerk. Notice what it says about status conferences.

Jerrie Hayes to Laird Heal on 9/13/2007, acknowledging that she understands the automatic stay now in place thanks to the plaintiffs, not the defendants, giving notice to the court.

Pucci and Duffy's 10/24/2007 motion for a status conference, in characteristic scanned, not text format, something I consider to be rude and discourteous on their part. They filed this motion without first conferring with us, a blatant violation of the scheduling order above.

Magistrate Hillman's order of 11/2/2007, allowing for a copy of Gailon's hard drive to be made by an unspecified expert, and scheduling a status conference. Notice specifically Hillman's explicit directions regarding where the copying should preferably be made, by whom it could be witnessed, and how it was to be sealed.

Jerrie Hayes to Laird Heal on 11/5/2007, already going beyond Hillman's order in claiming that the order said that Plaintiffs' so-called computer experts were the ones who had to do the copying.

Jerrie Hayes to Gailon Joy on 11/6/2007.

Gailon's response was as follows:

-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Your correspondence
Date: Thu, 08 Nov 2007 10:12:31 -0700
From: G. Arthur Joy
To: Jerrie Hayes
CC: Laird Heal

1) For the record, I consider the continuation of proceedings without a request for a lifting of the automatic stay, to clearly be a violation of the automatic stay and preserve any rights inherent therein, including any adversarial proceedings and appeal;

2) In the interest of facilitating the order, as outrageous and unnecessary as it is given that we have already provided the appropriate copies, 9:00 am on Nov 9, 2007 is an acceptable and workable time, assuming the operator wishes to risk cross contamination of a viral condition I am recovering from that resulted in pneumonitis and pleurisy, but appears to be resolving; Also, provision is essential for the record recovered to be sealed and the terms of this process need to be resolved prior to the expert beginning his process;

3) Address where the equipment will be is my Home address: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx;

4) The List of equipment is as follows:
Five (5)frames, unbranded, with OS of Mocrosoft windows or XP, with
three(3) being inoperable at the present time;
Two fax machines;
6 AT&T phones;
1 Panasonic TV;
1 Color Scanner;
1 Dell Color Printer;
2 Lamps;
1 paper shredder;
1 HP All in one office jet printer (dysfunctional).

5)My direct telephone line is (xxx-xxx-xxxx) and has voice mail.

Please advise the name of the expert and his credentials and be certain he has appropriate ID upon arrival.

Respectfully Submitted;

Gailon Arthur Joy

By "adversarial proceedings" Gailon is putting Jerrie on notice that he may sue her for breaching the stay.

Jerrie Haye's response of 11/8/2007. My reaction after reading this was, Can the lady read? Can't she see what the magistrate ordered?

Does she think we're stupid? They make not one copy but three? At their premises without us watching? With a signed agreement instead of a signed seal? By probably the same computer forensics firm that sent their chief technology officer to testify at a hearing, who we believe got basic facts about computer forensics all wrong at that hearing?

And besides, from what I can tell, this is all blatant and flagrant violations of the Sedona Principles.

Joseph B. Collins' motion of 11/8/2007. In this motion 3ABN claims to be a creditor of Gailon's. Since when have they loaned him money? Are they claiming to be owed money by someone who doesn't in fact owe them anything at this point in time? And if so, are there laws that cover that kind of thing?

Since when has 3ABN won any judgment against him, or demonstrated that they could likely win one?

If this kind of thing makes you sick, that a ministry that claims to serve Seventh-day Adventists, that solicits your money, would stoop to using lawyers that pull stunts like these, call Jim Gilley and the various board members and tell them they need to stop this foolishness, that it's a disgrace.

And while you're at it, call up Senator Charles Grassley's office, and tell him you would appreciate it if he adds 3ABN and Danny Shelton to the list of ministries and televangelists he's investigating. You could even get a petition going and see how many signatures you can collect, and then send it to his office. Mention the 1998 house deal, and how the legal documents are all posted on Save3ABN.com, and it's sure to get any legal authority's attention.

Now why would I suggest such a thing? 3ABN and Danny's frivolous lawsuit is an assault on our First Amendment guarantees of freedom of speech, freedom of press, and freedom of religion, and it was also an attempt to take us back to the Dark Ages when the trials of the Inquisition were held in secret. (If Jan Marcussen wasn't so closely tied to Danny, he just might fire off a newsletter suggesting that Danny is a Jesuit, or in cahoots with the Vatican.)

The First Amendment also guarantees our right to petition the government for redress, which includes our right to ask others to petition as well. I just exercised that right by bringing this whole matter to your attention and suggesting that you contact Senator Grassley. If I were to get sued for posting this, I would potentially be able to invoke federal and state anti-SLAPP statutes, statutes which make it tough on the big bullies who sue in order to hinder us from exercising our Constitutional right to petition the government.

Enough is enough.

[Pickle]

It might interest all that Robert Pickle is not presenting to you correct information. 3ABN filed a request for a status conference on 10/24/07 (when I figure out how to attach the doc I will do so - it is available via Pacer). There was no mention of "settlement" at all.

Thank you for pointing out my typo. I meant status conference and have corrected my post.

If, as they claim, they are on the "up and up", it strikes one as very interesting that there should be any problem with turning over any correspondence (or digital storage units) or documentation detailing their actions over the past months.

There are multiple problems that have been acknowledged for years by academics, lawyers, and judges. Read the Sedona Principles if you don't know what those problems might be.

And if nothing else, the Nick Miller story should alert you to the possibility of Danny et. al. finding stuff on a hard drive that was never ever there to begin with. Correct? If Nick's billing records were altered, which is not the only allegation we've heard of altered records, into something that didn't exist before, and I say "if" since it hasn't been proven, then the possibility exists that Danny et. al. could resort to such again. And what recourse would we have? How would we prove that what they claimed they found wasn't really there to begin with? This is why the Sedona Principles must be adhered to in this case, in my opinion, and why those principles are wisely put together.

[Ian]

Thank you for pointing out my typo. I meant status conference and have corrected my post.
There are multiple problems that have been acknowledged for years by academics, lawyers, and judges. Read the Sedona Principles if you don't know what those problems might be.

I'm quite sure the Judge knows about the Sedona principles, ...especially as you/Joy and your Attorney brought it up in your protests.

Here is the Judges ruling on the Motion for a Status Hearing.

Like Fallible I am trying to figure out how to post the Motion for the Status Conference, as it's quite interesting I think, to see why he ruled as he did...

Does the possibility of your Attorney having a conflict of interest in representing you in the lawsuit and Joy in his Bankruptcy case worry you? Does Joy lying bother you?

The conference on Monday looks to be an interesting one.


Please note that the formatting of the document below has been changed, but only for posting purpose. The content is intact and unedited.

Case 4:07-cv-40098-FDS Document 30-2 Filed 11/02/2007 Page 1 of 2

UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT
DISTRICT OF MASSACHUSETTS

___________________________________
THREE ANGELS BROADCASTING
NETWORK, INC. and DANNY LEE SHELTON
Plaintiffs

CIVIL ACTION

V

NO. 07-40098-FDS

GAILON ARTHUR JOY and ROBERT PICKLE
Defendants

___________________________________ )

ORDER ON PLAINTIFF’S MOTION FOR A STATUS CONFERENCE
November 2, 2007

The Plaintiff’s motion is granted. A status conference shall be held on November 13,
2007, at 1:00 p.m. in Courtroom 16, Fifth Floor, John Joseph Moakley United States
Courthouse, 1 Courthouse Way, Boston, Massachusetts. Counsel are reminded that they may appear via teleconference. If they so desire they are to contact my Courtroom Deputy, Lisa Roland at 617-748-4446 before Thursday, November 8, 2007.
Until that time the Defendant Joy shall, within 7 days of the date of this order:

Provide the Plaintiffs and court with a listing of all electronic equipment, owned
by the Defendant, or under the Defendant’s care, custody, or control, whether
listed in the defendant’s bankruptcy petition or not.

Make that equipment available to a forensic computer examiner who shall make a
mirror image of any hard drives or storage devises. The imaging process shall,
insofar as possible, take place at the Defendant’s premises, and the process may
be witnessed by the defendants and/or their experts.

Until further order of this court those mirror images shall, immediately upon
completion of the imaging process, be placed under seal. They are not to be
viewed, searched, copied, tampered with, or otherwise accessed. The seal shall
bear the date of sealing and the signature of any parties, or their representatives


Case 4:07-cv-40098-FDS Document 30-2 Filed 11/02/2007 Page 2 of 2


who wish to witness the imaging and sealing process.
The cost of imaging shall, for now, be born by the Plaintiffs. The Defendant Joy
may obtain a copy of the imaged devises at his own expense. The Defendant
Pickle may also obtain a copy of the devises at his own expense only upon the
express written authorization of the Defendant Joy.

/s/Timothy S. Hillman
TIMOTHY S. HILLMAN
U.S. MAGISTRATE JUDGE

This post has been edited by Ian: Nov 9 2007, 09:44 AM

[Pickle]

I'm quite sure the Judge knows about the Sedona principles, ...especially as you/Joy and your Attorney brought it up in your protests.

Here is the Judges ruling on the Motion for a Status Hearing.

The judge acknowledged the Sedona Principles, and it could be debated whether his order violates them or not.

Does the possibility of your Attorney having a conflict of interest in representing you in the lawsuit and Joy in his Bankruptcy case worry you? Does Joy lying bother you?

The conference on Monday looks to be an interesting one.

Conflict of interest? You are a bit uninformed, but I'll let you remain that way at least until the status conference, which will not be held on Monday.

Lying? When? You're not taking the opposing side's word for things, are you? You're not that naive, are you?

State precisely how Gailon lied, but if you do, why do it anonymously?

[Ian]

The judge acknowledged the Sedona Principles, and it could be debated whether his order violates them or not.
Conflict of interest? You are a bit uninformed, but I'll let you remain that way at least until the status conference, which will not be held on Monday.

My bad. I thought Monday was the 13th. Tuesday then.

Lying? When? You're not taking the opposing side's word for things, are you? You're not that naive, are you?

State precisely how Gailon lied, but if you do, why do it anonymously?

I have a hard time believing you don't know what I am talking about, so this appears to be more games and spin by you to me.

I didn't need to take anyones word for it but Gailon's, neither do you or anyone else. It's right there in his Bankruptcy case where he claims one thing, and in his arguments in the civil case where he claims the opposite, all available on PACER, ,and referred to by the Attorney's for 3ABN in the motion I'm trying to figure out how to post here.

Whether I am anonymous or not has nothing to do with it, anyone can look it up or read either case for themselves

[Pickle]

I have a hard time believing you don't know what I am talking about, so this appears to be more games and spin by you to me.

So rather than deal with facts, you would rather accuse me of playing games and spinning things. Why?

The bankruptcy forms have places for one to list all types of personal property and their location. #24 is "Customer lists or other compilations containing personally identifiable information (as defined in 11 U.S.C. § 101(41A)) provided to the debtor by individuals in connection with obtaining a product or service from the debtor primarily for personal, family, or household purposes." Gailon checked none for this one.

For our educational benefit, please explain to us all how the specific type of things Gailon brought to the court's attention falls into the category of personal property belonging to him, as well as into the category of "customer lists." After you do that there will still be one thing that must be clarified before we can conclude that he lied.