This Should Not Be News, But it is. Options

[Bystander]

I am a newbie also and promised myself that I would read before writing. If Danny hadn't of opened his big mouth on a 3ABN live program in February 2007, I would have NEVER found this wonderful site. Thank you Calvin and others.
My husband tells me daily to read and let him know what's going on with 3ABN. We both feel that we have found lots of good information on this site. I told him that Bystander commented yesterday on this thread and that he stays in the line of fire.
Who knows, I might be in Big trouble myself.

Welcome jnana15. No, you won't be in trouble if you can sort out the truth from the lies. This 3abn forum was based and some horrible allegations and falsehoods. All of the allegations were discussed, acted upon as if they were truth and statements were made as fact. Through the months, those same falsehoods have been expanded on, hashed and rehashed. The people that arrived her later, never knew that a lot of those "facts" came from a beginning of lies. Is everyone at 3abn perfect? Hardly. Is everyone on this forum perfect? hardly. Is any thriving ministry perfect? absolutely not. But what has happened here has been a faulty snowball that has grown larger and larger as it picks up speed. Many of the allegations are completely outlandish. Those that have written the lies and told them as truth will be accountable to God and man. What else can be done at this point when they will not stop trying to destroy a tremendous ministry and those that work there. The slander has went on too long, has gotten completely out of control even though, those that do most of the accusing have never eyewitnessed the horrible things that they are depicting.
If you choose to stay here, please be much in prayer for discernment. But, above all, please don't base your conclusions on the beginning lies.

[Clay]

If you choose to stay here, please be much in prayer for discernment. But, above all, please don't base your conclusions on the beginning lies.

yep... the very first lie was told by Danny himself when he came.... and Bystander, WWJD, and the other apologists have continued to perpetuate that lie.....

Great recommendation....

[PeacefulBe]

Welcome jnana15. No, you won't be in trouble if you can sort out the truth from the lies.

I agree with you that jnana15 won't be in trouble if she can sort out the truth from the lies. Of course then you get busy and test her by making a statement filled with some truth and a bunch of false allegations (lies).

This 3abn forum was based and some horrible allegations and falsehoods. All of the allegations were discussed, acted upon as if they were truth and statements were made as fact. Through the months, those same falsehoods have been expanded on, hashed and rehashed. The people that arrived her later, never knew that a lot of those "facts" came from a beginning of lies.
Is everyone at 3abn perfect? Hardly. Is everyone on this forum perfect? hardly. Is any thriving ministry perfect? absolutely not. But what has happened here has been a faulty snowball that has grown larger and larger as it picks up speed. Many of the allegations are completely outlandish. Those that have written the lies and told them as truth will be accountable to God and man. What else can be done at this point when they will not stop trying to destroy a tremendous ministry and those that work there. The slander has went on too long, has gotten completely out of control even though, those that do most of the accusing have never eyewitnessed the horrible things that they are depicting.
If you choose to stay here, please be much in prayer for discernment. But, above all, please don't base your conclusions on the beginning lies.

I have made bold the sentences in your statement that can, unequivocally, be considered truth. As for the rest of your statement, just because you say it doesn't make it so. Have you considered the possibility that you may be pointing your finger at the wrong group of people? You constantly try to rebut what is here simply by characterizing it as lies or hearsay, etc., and yet you just don't bring any substantive proof to back up your claims. Oh, that's right, you and your compatriots don't feel it is necessary to waste your "evidence" on the small group of folks in "chat rooms".

You continue to sing your song (Lies, Lies, Lies. Rumor, Slander, Lies. Just-you-wait-we're-gonna-sue-you. Lies, Lies, Lies!) but it is not scoring very well on the charts, IMO. Perhaps because your verse has no compelling hook (truth/substance) and, therefore, falls a little flat and empty.

If you believe someone has made a false allegation, back up your claims with proof or just leave it to honest folk to use their brains and decide for themselves. When you can bring something more than empty words to the dialogue, perhaps people will give your words more credibility and will be more willing to listen.

This post has been edited by PeacefullyBewildered: Mar 14 2007, 07:31 AM

[Bystander]

If you believe someone has made a false allegation, back up your claims with proof or just leave it to honest folk to use their brains and decide for themselves. When you can bring something more than empty words to the dialogue, perhaps people will give your words more credibility and will be more willing to listen.

Ahhh, finally. The true "you" emerges. Speaking the exact opposite of what you have spoken before. (and you know what I mean.) I see no way for you to justify your contradictions this time.

Bewildered or not, you can surely grasp that I have said over and over that I do not have permission to bring evidence forward. End of story. I wish that I could. In fact, I would love to. It isn't my call.
The lawsuits are not within my control either. If they were, those that are guilty within the confines of the law and God would have been drug into court, already by the scruff of their necks. 3ABN has no control of the tons of paperwork and research that have to be done before those charged, receive their invitations. Those that will receive them will be, in the eyes of the law, deserving of them, or they wouldn't be receiving them.
It is a constant source of amazment to me, how several laugh and say bring it on, because something didn't happen in the appointed time frame that they themselves made up. You can go with the Bluff line all day long but does anyone here want to chance all the repercussions that would be handed down with each invidual guilty verdict. Here's the kicker. Would you want to chance any of the loss or heartache to be able to slander, defame and perform character assassination on people you don't know and have never even met. Is it really so fun for some of you that you are willing to take the fine's and punishment that could be handed out? For most, what happens to 3 abn or the people there, will have no affect on your lives whatsoever, and yet you are willing to stake parts of your lives to get to call them names.
Not too smart.

[Clay]

Bystander... put up or shut up... and the threats..... old and tiresome....... if you are not bring the lawsuits, we got the picture, you are the errandboy......

[Jnana15]

[quote name='Bystander' date='Mar 14 2007, 01:02 AM' post='185146']
Welcome jnana15. No, you won't be in trouble if you can sort out the truth from the lies. This 3abn forum was based and some horrible allegations and falsehoods.




This is where I disagree with you Bystander. I have sorted through the lies LONG before I joined this group. I have been following 3ABN for years and have had a lot of questions. This site has helped me sort out the truth and answered a lot of questions for me. I have even been able to stop one person from talking about Linda to questioning Danny's motives. This person knows G. McNelius personally and knew stuff about 3ABN before it made public or even hit the website. So see, I really know what's going on. Ask Lee.

Back to my corner for now

[calvin]

Ahhh, finally. The true "you" emerges. Speaking the exact opposite of what you have spoken before. (and you know what I mean.) I see no way for you to justify your contradictions this time.

Bewildered or not, you can surely grasp that I have said over and over that I do not have permission to bring evidence forward. End of story. I wish that I could. In fact, I would love to. It isn't my call.
The lawsuits are not within my control either. If they were, those that are guilty within the confines of the law and God would have been drug into court, already by the scruff of their necks. 3ABN has no control of the tons of paperwork and research that have to be done before those charged, receive their invitations. Those that will receive them will be, in the eyes of the law, deserving of them, or they wouldn't be receiving them.
It is a constant source of amazment to me, how several laugh and say bring it on, because something didn't happen in the appointed time frame that they themselves made up. You can go with the Bluff line all day long but does anyone here want to chance all the repercussions that would be handed down with each invidual guilty verdict. Here's the kicker. Would you want to chance any of the loss or heartache to be able to slander, defame and perform character assassination on people you don't know and have never even met. Is it really so fun for some of you that you are willing to take the fine's and punishment that could be handed out? For most, what happens to 3 abn or the people there, will have no affect on your lives whatsoever, and yet you are willing to stake parts of your lives to get to call them names.
Not too smart.

sigh. Is is Sabbath yet?

[erik]

Ahhh, finally. The true "you" emerges. Speaking the exact opposite of what you have spoken before. (and you know what I mean.) I see no way for you to justify your contradictions this time.

Bewildered or not, you can surely grasp that I have said over and over that I do not have permission to bring evidence forward. End of story. I wish that I could. In fact, I would love to. It isn't my call.
The lawsuits are not within my control either. If they were, those that are guilty within the confines of the law and God would have been drug into court, already by the scruff of their necks. 3ABN has no control of the tons of paperwork and research that have to be done before those charged, receive their invitations. Those that will receive them will be, in the eyes of the law, deserving of them, or they wouldn't be receiving them.
It is a constant source of amazment to me, how several laugh and say bring it on, because something didn't happen in the appointed time frame that they themselves made up. You can go with the Bluff line all day long but does anyone here want to chance all the repercussions that would be handed down with each invidual guilty verdict. Here's the kicker. Would you want to chance any of the loss or heartache to be able to slander, defame and perform character assassination on people you don't know and have never even met. Is it really so fun for some of you that you are willing to take the fine's and punishment that could be handed out? For most, what happens to 3 abn or the people there, will have no affect on your lives whatsoever, and yet you are willing to stake parts of your lives to get to call them names.
Not too smart.

Bystander,

What happens effects every SDA, 3ABN has made itself the public face of the Adventist church.

Besides that even if what is going at 3abn did not effect the rest of us, The Great injustice that is being done, by the the releasing of only a small part of the truth from 3abn side is enough to turn ones sense of justice upside down.

Linda has been publicly accused of having an affair on her husband, But lack of proof of that affair is telling.

Tommy S. has been accused of sexually abusing boys and young men, and lack of denial is equaling telling.


The difference in the way that 3abn handled each case is even more telling.

I know you claim to not be allowed to give way the big serects of the proof that 3abn has on al these topics, but you should be able to reason with them that the method of damage control they are currently using is failing them greatly, i am quite sure you can see and sense that by now.

How many of the posters on here say that came here thinking that danny was the victim of linda and now hold vastly different view.

THat should speak volumes has tot he correctness of the path 3 abn has taken on this whole issue.

Here is the thing that just blows my mind, 3abn is creating a huge stumbling block to many on this site and others if they are with holding proof that would clear them of the charges being leveled.


They will have to anwser to God for that.

Also they are not following the mattew 18 approach that so many pro-3abn people harp on towards the other side.


One of the things that is the must telling has to were the truth will most likely end being in this whole thing is that the side that says 3abn has problems that need fixed is they are willing to make case that there is infact problems at 3abn, on the other in nut shell from the 3abn side is trust us, in court we will be proven right.

When if tomorrow 3abn released the proof that tommy is innocent and the linda is the cheating wife she has been accused of, I would be the first to start defending 3abn based on the facts not the word of danny shelton and walt thomason, both men that has you point out all the time are people most of us do not know very well.

Bystander many on this forum are here for the truth, is just that we are not going take a trust on this one awnser, the things they are being charged with are all about the trust we have placed in them being destroyed.


Erik

[maggiecttr]

For most, what happens to 3 abn or the people there, will have no affect on your lives whatsoever,

Actually, what happens to 3abn and/or its people *will* have an effect on my life, should the story (if allegations prove to be true) appear in the mainstream media. My husband and I try to live our lives in such a way that Seventh-day Adventism is seen in a positive light -- it's how we trained our child to live as well. It could be a real embarrassment to church members like my family if a 3abn scandal should emerge in the public eye. It could very well undermine many members' efforts to witness in their communities, workplaces, schools, etc. My prayer is that I won't pick up Time or Newsweek some day in the near future and see a negative two-page spread on 3abn!

I'm a first-time poster, but I have been spending hours reading through this site, plus several others often referred to here. Thank you for providing a forum for us to discuss what we never hear about from the pulpit.

God bless!
maggie

[Jnana15]

Welcome Maggie
We Newbies seem to have spent many good hours reading here.

I have yet to figure out how to put the "Quotes" in from others.

[lookin4truth]

Welcome Maggie
We Newbies seem to have spent many good hours reading here.

I have yet to figure out how to put the "Quotes" in from others.

Jnana,

Probably the easiest way to quote is to hit the QUOTE button on the lower right hand corner of the post you want to quote.

Then hit the REPLY button.

A reply box will come up, with the full quote of the original post in it.

You can then just delete the parts you don't want, highlight or color words you want highlighted, etc.

Then submit your new post.

You can also just place the quote [ quote ] before what you want to quote, and the end quote [ /quote ] after.

When you do it this way, you will not have the name, time, etc. of the person you are quoting.

If this hasn't confused you enough, I can make it even muddier.

Note: The brackets around the quote commands should not have spaces. I place them there because it makes a quote box if I didn't

This post has been edited by lookin4truth: Mar 14 2007, 08:53 PM

[PeacefulBe]

Welcome Maggie. Unfortunately, the problems that much of the documentation prove have been festering for a long time and it was inevitable that they would begin to come to the surface. What is really a shame is that the folks who were aware of these problems kept things as silent as possible instead of standing on Christian principle and doing whatever was needed to fix the problems and help any victims to find healing.

That there are many working towards exposing the truth, whatever that may end up being, will someday show the world, that at least a group of folks wouldn't keep the secrets. That will, IMO, temper the ill will that might arise should the problems become public knowledge.

[princessdi]

Welcome to BSDA Maggie!! You are voicing exactly what I have been saying for months, years, even.............Somehow most seem to think we are flying under the radar.....which also says something about our mission... special message to the world and all........

Actually, what happens to 3abn and/or its people *will* have an effect on my life, should the story (if allegations prove to be true) appear in the mainstream media. My husband and I try to live our lives in such a way that Seventh-day Adventism is seen in a positive light -- it's how we trained our child to live as well. It could be a real embarrassment to church members like my family if a 3abn scandal should emerge in the public eye. It could very well undermine many members' efforts to witness in their communities, workplaces, schools, etc. My prayer is that I won't pick up Time or Newsweek some day in the near future and see a negative two-page spread on 3abn!

I'm a first-time poster, but I have been spending hours reading through this site, plus several others often referred to here. Thank you for providing a forum for us to discuss what we never hear about from the pulpit.

God bless!
maggie

[princessdi]

Then to put it nicely, BS, you rpobably need to stop with the defense of Danny and 3ABN. they aessentially you sending you out here unarmed, so to speak. You may, indeed, be a honest, christian man. However, as said before, Danny has already been here, lying. Then you are willing to come to his defense, and he doesn't equip you, besides being at a diadvantage. Nothing but that said proof that they are not willing to release to you, their faithful defender, will get most to even think about changing their minds.

Ahhh, finally. The true "you" emerges. Speaking the exact opposite of what you have spoken before. (and you know what I mean.) I see no way for you to justify your contradictions this time.

Bewildered or not, you can surely grasp that I have said over and over that I do not have permission to bring evidence forward. End of story. I wish that I could. In fact, I would love to. It isn't my call.
The lawsuits are not within my control either. If they were, those that are guilty within the confines of the law and God would have been drug into court, already by the scruff of their necks. 3ABN has no control of the tons of paperwork and research that have to be done before those charged, receive their invitations. Those that will receive them will be, in the eyes of the law, deserving of them, or they wouldn't be receiving them.
It is a constant source of amazment to me, how several laugh and say bring it on, because something didn't happen in the appointed time frame that they themselves made up. You can go with the Bluff line all day long but does anyone here want to chance all the repercussions that would be handed down with each invidual guilty verdict. Here's the kicker. Would you want to chance any of the loss or heartache to be able to slander, defame and perform character assassination on people you don't know and have never even met. Is it really so fun for some of you that you are willing to take the fine's and punishment that could be handed out? For most, what happens to 3 abn or the people there, will have no affect on your lives whatsoever, and yet you are willing to stake parts of your lives to get to call them names.
Not too smart.

[sonshineonme]

Actually, what happens to 3abn and/or its people *will* have an effect on my life, should the story (if allegations prove to be true) appear in the mainstream media. My husband and I try to live our lives in such a way that Seventh-day Adventism is seen in a positive light -- it's how we trained our child to live as well. It could be a real embarrassment to church members like my family if a 3abn scandal should emerge in the public eye. It could very well undermine many members' efforts to witness in their communities, workplaces, schools, etc. My prayer is that I won't pick up Time or Newsweek some day in the near future and see a negative two-page spread on 3abn!

I'm a first-time poster, but I have been spending hours reading through this site, plus several others often referred to here. Thank you for providing a forum for us to discuss what we never hear about from the pulpit.

God bless!
maggie

Being involved in this for some time, I have already processed this through my mind. It may or may not help in any way what I have concluded, but I will share it in short (yes, really, short!)

I was raised in this church too. I always had the idea IT is the only truth. That's ok, as long as it doens't make you so different from everyone else (the elevated over others way) that you can no longer see the common things you have with all christians. I have found over my years in this church, MANY people think of themselves, probalby unconscienceously, they are "better" then others because they have the truth. I don't mean this in a bad way, I'm just trying to say that we are sinners and often we can get pride and boastful of what "GOD" has given us (the truth) and no one else.

I have accepted that ALL christians are sinners. There are hypocrites in every church and denomination. There is inperfection and error in every denomination. NO denomination is protected from the devil, sin or sinners. So far in my life, the SDA church is the closest to truth I have found. I don't accept all of it. We have to some how lower ourselves down to this understanding, or we do set up ourselves for feeling the responsiblity for everyone and every denomominatin decision. That is wrong. We are free will choosing christians as God designed it, and the church is made up of us free will christians making mistakes, innocently and intentionally.

We are not special. All churches have their problems. I will not sell this church to anyone (via bible study or bragging) letting them think that just because we have the sabbath, state of the dead and some other things that we don't make mistakes and that our humans are different (sinless?) then others.

Bottom line, no matter what church you are part of (denomination as well), it's about a personal relationship with our Lord and Savior. IF HE says, FOLLOW ME, not your church, I better have enough connection with HIM to do just that. Loyalty to HIM and what He has taught us in the bible. NOt to a man or denomination. God first.

When 3abn crumbles (and I am assuming at the rate of DS behavior that is is doomed too) I feel comfortable letting people know what I have learned quite frankly was the cause of it. One man had too much power. This is not part of our denomination, and just because ANY person SAYS something does not make it so. Maybe there was a good reason that things did stay separate (3abn and the offical denomination). This is not the first off-shoot or ministry that the church had to distance and disconnect from (if that is what will take place at some point) and folks, it probably won't be the last.

There is much more that could be said of this issue - how it will affect SDA's, etc. We just need to know Jesus, tell of Jesus and keep it simple. We aren't sales people for the church. We want people to know truth, to know there is forgiveness of sins, that Jesus is coming back and the great controversary of between Satan and God, to hurt GOD! Not the SDA church!!!
Thank goodness we have so many stories in the bible of leaders and prophets that were clearly sinners, and how much God loved them still. All christians of every denomination are in the same boat. The devil hates us all, doesn't want us or anyone to know God, and doesn't want God's true loving character revealed. However he can make God look bad, that is what he is about. That will not end till the end of it all!


P.S. WELCOME maggiecttr!
I look forward to more of your posts!

This post has been edited by sonshineonme: Mar 14 2007, 09:24 PM