Questions For Joe Smith, for starters: "mansion" & "huge pool" Options

[Aletheia]

Talk about spreading gossip and innuendos.

I agree, this is the kinda thing I find embarassing for both sides in these issues, as both are professing the name of Christ.

And it has been said before:
"Prove all things, and hold fast that which is good"

[princessdi]

You mean both of them wer at GC in STL? Man!!! If I had known that I would not have taken so much time at my spa day! LOL!!!!!

So, Joe, you are tyring to say taht Linda proceeded Danny in remarriage? Now, now, Joe, you might have to let that one go. I think we are now just trying to plant "reasonable doubt". I don't believe a word of it. Danny still cannot marry anyone by getting divorced on what is little more that suspected adultery(In fact, I dont' even believe he susupected it, he just wanted to be free.....jes' keepin' it real!). He lacked so much evidence he had to make up his own sin to do it. Poppycock!!! You are going to have to do better, Joe!

[Aletheia]

he had to make up his own sin to do it. Poppycock!!!

whoa, OR woe!

WE INTERUPT THIS PROGRAM TO BRING YOU THE FOLLOWING ANNOUNCEMENT:

I don't know if Linda was or is guilty of adultery or not, I need proof, but this argument about there being no such thing as the sin being described simply because it's been mislabelled "spiritual adultery" is flat out bogus. No one invented that sin. Let's put a rest to that argument right now!

You really think IF YOUR HUSBAND IS SITTING AROUND LUSTING AFTER OR FANTASIZING ABOUT ANOTHER WOMAN THAT HE'S NOT DISLOYAL OR CHEATING ON YOU?

The world tells you that's normal, *EVERYBODY DOES IT*, BUT GOD'S WORD SAYS DIFFERENT.

Sin is transgression of the law and God's law IS spiritual, and far reaching even to motive and intents and thoughts.

Three witnesses are all that's needed, here's four.

1. Thou shalt not commit adultery - Ex 20:14

2. ....Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's wife...nor any thing that is thy neighbour's. -Ex 20:17

3. But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart. - Matt 5:28

4. ... I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet. -Rom 7:7

The tenth commandment proves the law is spiritual..

For coveting happens in your mind only, and paves the way for all the rest.

Temptation takes place in the mind, resisting it or giving into sin also happens in the mind.

"Blessed is the man that endureth temptation: for when he is tried, he shall receive the crown of life, which the Lord hath promised to them that love him. Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:

But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.

Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin:

and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.

Do not err, my beloved brethren. Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning. "- James 1:12-17

oK-- BACK TO YOUR REGULARLY SCHEDULED PROGRAMING.

--Corrected mistatement - typo--

This post has been edited by Aletheia: Feb 21 2007, 08:31 PM

[princessdi]

Cindy, "spiritual adultery" which is what Danny began accusing Linda of, it not a sin. In fact, as far as man is concerned it doesn't exist. You can only commit spiritual adultery against God. It is the terms most commonly used for the COI and all the times they waundered after to gods of their neighboring countries. etc. Danny is not God, threfore, Spiritual Adultery could not be committed against him. They have gone to court when Linda ocntested teh Guam divorce, and still there was presented no definitive 'evidence" of Linda's adutery(and if he had something then would have been the time). The burden of proof was on Danny to prove her guilt, not Linda to prove her innocence. Danny still really doesn't refer to it as a physical/sexual affair. They still only claim to have phone tapes(from a calling card no less ), etc. Nothing yet, and Danny has been dogging the whole entire time, knowing Linda could not respond. Like I said before, it is more about Danny actions, than Linda's. That is all I have to go on, I guess if he had not come here to tell his lies personally, I might have given him the benefit of the doubt.

whoa, OR woe!

WE INTERUPT THIS PROGRAM TO BRING YOU THE FOLLOWING ANNOUNCEMENT:

I don't know if Linda was or is guilty of adultery or not, I need proof, but this argument about there being no such thing as spiritual adultery is flat out bogus. No one invented that sin. Let's put a rest to that argument right now!

You really think IF YOUR HUSBAND IS SITTING AROUND LUSTING AFTER OR FANTASIZING ABOUT ANOTHER WOMAN THAT HE'S NOT DISLOYAL OR CHEATING ON YOU?

The world tells you that's normal, *EVERYBODY DOES IT*, BUT GOD'S WORD SAYS DIFFERENT.

Sin is transgression of the law and God's law IS spiritual, and far reaching even to motive and intents and thoughts.

Three witnesses are all that's needed, here's four.

1. Thou shalt not commit adultery - Ex 20:14

2. ....Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's wife...nor any thing that is thy neighbour's. -Ex 20:17

3. But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart. - Matt 5:28

4. ... I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet. -Rom 7:7

The tenth commandment proves the law is spiritual..

For coveting happens in your mind only, and paves the way for all the rest.

Temptation takes place in the mind, resisting it or giving into sin also happens in the mind.

"Blessed is the man that endureth temptation: for when he is tried, he shall receive the crown of life, which the Lord hath promised to them that love him. Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:

But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.

Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin:

and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.

Do not err, my beloved brethren. Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning. "- James 1:12-17

oK-- BACK TO YOUR REGULARLY SCHEDULED PROGRAMING.

[sister]

whoa, OR woe!

WE INTERUPT THIS PROGRAM TO BRING YOU THE FOLLOWING ANNOUNCEMENT:

I don't know if Linda was or is guilty of adultery or not, I need proof, but this argument about there being no such thing as spiritual adultery is flat out bogus. No one invented that sin. Let's put a rest to that argument right now!

You really think IF YOUR HUSBAND IS SITTING AROUND LUSTING AFTER OR FANTASIZING ABOUT ANOTHER WOMAN THAT HE'S NOT DISLOYAL OR CHEATING ON YOU?

The world tells you that's normal, *EVERYBODY DOES IT*, BUT GOD'S WORD SAYS DIFFERENT.

Sin is transgression of the law and God's law IS spiritual, and far reaching even to motive and intents and thoughts.

Three witnesses are all that's needed, here's four.

1. Thou shalt not commit adultery - Ex 20:14

2. ....Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's wife...nor any thing that is thy neighbour's. -Ex 20:17

3. But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart. - Matt 5:28

4. ... I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet. -Rom 7:7

The tenth commandment proves the law is spiritual..

For coveting happens in your mind only, and paves the way for all the rest.

Temptation takes place in the mind, resisting it or giving into sin also happens in the mind.

"Blessed is the man that endureth temptation: for when he is tried, he shall receive the crown of life, which the Lord hath promised to them that love him. Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:

But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.

Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin:

and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.

Do not err, my beloved brethren. Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning. "- James 1:12-17

oK-- BACK TO YOUR REGULARLY SCHEDULED PROGRAMING.

Aletheia, this topic has already been discussed concerning Danny and Linda. You might go back and look through some of the older threads. The main trusts of the postings was whether Danny had a right to divorce Linda on Biblical grounds with an accusation of "Spiritual Adultery". The following is my answer:

The accusation of martial misconduct that has been charged against Linda Shelton — “Spiritual Adultery” can not be supported as a grounds for divorce nor has any evidence been produced from Danny Shelton giving him Biblical sanction for his divorce of Linda Shelton. Turning to the word of God for the Biblical definition of wrongdoing pertaining to divorce and remarriage, in the book of Matthew chapter 5, verse 12: “But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery.” What does “Spiritual Adultery” have to do with fornication? To be sure that I was not mistaken, reading on in Matthew 19: 8, 9, my suspicions were confirmed, it was not Linda who had committed adultery: “He said to them, “Because of your hardness of heart Moses permitted you to divorce your wives; but from the beginning it has not been this way. And I say to you, whoever divorces his wife, except for immorality [fornication], and marries another woman commits adultery.” NASB

According to scripture it is the husband, that has put away his wife for grounds other than fornication and remarried, that has committed adultery. The Bible is positively clear upon this subject. There are no gray areas or shadows in which to hide. No mention made nor definition given of Spiritual Adultery in regard to divorce. So how has this strange fire made it’s way into the temple of God? Or is it only applicable in the 3ABN Worship Center, where the high priest, John Lomacang presides over the 3ABN congregation of Danny Shelton?

Upon reviewing the letters written by Dr. Walt Thompson concerning Danny’s actions in regard to divorcing Linda and his remarriage to Brandy, not once is the charge of fornication made against Linda. So why is the scarlet letter “A” pinned upon her? What makes her an adulteress in the eyes of God? Like the woman dragged through the streets and thrown down on the ground in front of Jesus, was Linda caught in the act of adultery? No. Then why has she been publically dragged through the mud and deposited by her accusers at the feet of the court of Adventist public opinion: to be tried, convicted and branded as an adulteress without a shred of evidence?

Aletheia, where is the evidence that Linda has committed adultery? Everyone is still waiting for Danny to produce the evidence or perhaps the problem is he can not produce what does not exist?

[Green Cochoa]

whoa, OR woe!

WE INTERUPT THIS PROGRAM TO BRING YOU THE FOLLOWING ANNOUNCEMENT:

I don't know if Linda was or is guilty of adultery or not, I need proof, but this argument about there being no such thing as spiritual adultery is flat out bogus. No one invented that sin. Let's put a rest to that argument right now!

You really think IF YOUR HUSBAND IS SITTING AROUND LUSTING AFTER OR FANTASIZING ABOUT ANOTHER WOMAN THAT HE'S NOT DISLOYAL OR CHEATING ON YOU?

The world tells you that's normal, *EVERYBODY DOES IT*, BUT GOD'S WORD SAYS DIFFERENT.

Sin is transgression of the law and God's law IS spiritual, and far reaching even to motive and intents and thoughts.

Three witnesses are all that's needed, here's four.

1. Thou shalt not commit adultery - Ex 20:14

2. ....Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's wife...nor any thing that is thy neighbour's. -Ex 20:17

3. But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart. - Matt 5:28

4. ... I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet. -Rom 7:7

The tenth commandment proves the law is spiritual..

For coveting happens in your mind only, and paves the way for all the rest.

Temptation takes place in the mind, resisting it or giving into sin also happens in the mind.

"Blessed is the man that endureth temptation: for when he is tried, he shall receive the crown of life, which the Lord hath promised to them that love him. Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:

But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.

Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin:

and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.

Do not err, my beloved brethren. Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning. "- James 1:12-17

oK-- BACK TO YOUR REGULARLY SCHEDULED PROGRAMING.

WHOA!!!!!!!!!!!!! AND WOE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I just can't help myself. This is so blatantly a fallacy of logic known as the slippery slope, often termed "jumping to conclusions" that I feel I must set the record straight.

To lust after a neighbor's spouse IS SIN. Yes, in heaven's eye, it's close to the same as adultery, as Jesus said. BUT, before you go divorcing on someone's thoughts, better look more closely at the issues, and at where this SAME KIND OF LOGIC will take you!

Evidently, Aletheia, you must also believe firmly in capital punishment, as advocated in the Levitical laws. And, adultery was punished in this fashion.

Leviticus 20:10 "And the man that committeth adultery with another man's wife, even he that committeth adultery with his neighbour's wife, the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death."

And also, to use your logic in an equally relevant "spiritual" sense to adultery,

Leviticus 19:17 "Thou shalt not hate thy brother in thine heart: thou shalt in any wise rebuke thy neighbour, and not suffer sin upon him."

1 John 3:15 "Whosoever hateth his brother is a murderer: and ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him."

AND Leviticus 35 says "the murderer shall surely be put to death" no less than three times.

So, I guess we should all be put to death for a thought we've had in our lives at some point, however fleeting? Is this what you would advocate dear truth seeker?

There are degrees of sin. Thoughts do not have the same weight as their consequent actions. Jesus did not say we should divorce. Divorce is never commanded, only permitted "for the hardness of your hearts." To divorce, without adultery, is to commit adultery.

Matthew 5:32 "But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery."

Jesus NEVER said a person's thoughts were sufficient cause for adultery. You'll have to prove that one to me rather thoroughly before I'll be gullible enough to fall for such a lie. And once you have proven it, then I will also believe that a person's thoughts will be sufficient cause for capital punishment.

[awesumtenor]

IF Linda got married, why would she hide it? How long would that last? It doesn't even make sense her wearing a wedding ring....

It does if she were still contesting her divorce; if that was still ongoing at the time of the GC session in St. Louis (and I believe that it was) then she *WAS* married...

...to Danny Shelton.

In His service,
Mr. J

[Aletheia]

Aletheia, where is the evidence that Linda has committed adultery? 7

R U very defensive or confused?

I wrote and you even quoted "I don't know if Linda was or is guilty of adultery or not, I need proof"

and did you see my question, just a couple of posts back to you regarding your proof? for you appear to be ignoring it, and I am still waiting for your answer...

This post has been edited by Aletheia: Dec 26 2006, 11:58 PM

[sister]

R U very defensive or confused?

I wrote and you even quoted "I don't know if Linda was or is guilty of adultery or not, I need proof"

and did you see my question, just a couple of posts back to you regarding your proof? for you appear to be ignoring it, and I am still waiting for your answer...

I am neither defensive or confused...but you did quote me out of context:

"Aletheia, where is the evidence that Linda has committed adultery? Everyone is still waiting for Danny to produce the evidence or perhaps the problem is he can not produce what does not exist?"

In context it is obvious I am not asking you to produce evidence, but rather commenting upon the lack of evidence produce by Danny Shelton or if any evidience actually exists.

But I am curious how you answer the following statement directed to you from Green Cochoa:

"Jesus NEVER said a person's thoughts were sufficient cause for adultery. You'll have to prove that one to me rather thoroughly before I'll be gullible enough to fall for such a lie. And once you have proven it, then I will also believe that a person's thoughts will be sufficient cause for capital punishment."

[Aletheia]

WHOA!!!!!!!!!!!!! AND WOE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I just can't help myself. This is so blatantly a fallacy of logic known as the slippery slope, often termed "jumping to conclusions" that I feel I must set the record straight.

To lust after a neighbor's spouse IS SIN. Yes, in heaven's eye, it's close to the same as adultery, as Jesus said. BUT, before you go divorcing on someone's thoughts, better look more closely at the issues, and at where this SAME KIND OF LOGIC will take you!

Evidently, Aletheia, you must also believe firmly in capital punishment, as advocated in the Levitical laws. And, adultery was punished in this fashion.

Leviticus 20:10 "And the man that committeth adultery with another man's wife, even he that committeth adultery with his neighbour's wife, the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death."

And also, to use your logic in an equally relevant "spiritual" sense to adultery,

Leviticus 19:17 "Thou shalt not hate thy brother in thine heart: thou shalt in any wise rebuke thy neighbour, and not suffer sin upon him."

1 John 3:15 "Whosoever hateth his brother is a murderer: and ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him."

AND Leviticus 35 says "the murderer shall surely be put to death" no less than three times.

So, I guess we should all be put to death for a thought we've had in our lives at some point, however fleeting? Is this what you would advocate dear truth seeker?

There are degrees of sin. Thoughts do not have the same weight as their consequent actions. Jesus did not say we should divorce. Divorce is never commanded, only permitted "for the hardness of your hearts." To divorce, without adultery, is to commit adultery.

Matthew 5:32 "But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery."

Jesus NEVER said a person's thoughts were sufficient cause for adultery. You'll have to prove that one to me rather thoroughly before I'll be gullible enough to fall for such a lie. And once you have proven it, then I will also believe that a person's thoughts will be sufficient cause for capital punishment.

Sorry dude you err not knowing the scriptures. Sin is sin, and God's word says "Whosoever hateth his brother IS a murderer" as well as " whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart" Jesus also said all judgment has been given to me, as in "vengeance is mine, I will repay" so I believe him, so no I am not in favor of me carrying out capital punishment. Reason being God's church is not a Nation or state anymore...

[Green Cochoa]

Sorry dude you err not knowing the scriptures. Sin is sin, and God's word says "Whosoever hateth his brother IS a murderer" as well as " whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart" Jesus also said all judgment has been given to me, as in "vengeance is mine, I will repay" so I believe him, so no I am not in favor of me carrying out capital punishment. Reason being God's church is not a Nation or state anymore...

Ah, yes. Well, then by so saying you clear the guilt of any "capital punishment" for those who merely hated or lusted while Israel was its own nation.

And, you must also feel that it's ok to divorce your husband if he steals, or breaks the Sabbath, because, just a little further from the statement you quoted in James, comes the following:

James 2:10-11 "For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.
For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law."

May God help us to follow the Biblical injunction to rightly divide the truth.

[roxe]

<snip>
Matthew chapter 5, verse 12: “But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery.”

does the bolded part mean that since Danny divorced Linda, he has caused her to commit adultery, and that whoever marries her will also commit adultery??

[Aletheia]

I am neither defensive or confused...but you did quote me out of context:

Everyone is still waiting for Danny to produce the evidence or perhaps the problem is he can not produce what does not exist?"

In context it is obvious I am not asking you to produce evidence, but rather commenting upon the lack of evidence produce by Danny Shelton or if any evidience actually exists.

Then may I suggest that in the future you do not ask me ""Aletheia, where is the evidence that Linda has committed adultery?" if you don't want me to answer, and are just commenting.

But I am curious how you answer the following statement directed to you from Green Cochoa:

"Jesus NEVER said a person's thoughts were sufficient cause for adultery. You'll have to prove that one to me rather thoroughly before I'll be gullible enough to fall for such a lie. And once you have proven it, then I will also believe that a person's thoughts will be sufficient cause for capital punishment."

I answered him. And I am still curious to see you answer my question, are you still refusing to answer or prove what you say?

[awesumtenor]

Then may I suggest that in the future you do not ask me ""Aletheia, where is the evidence that Linda has committed adultery?" if you don't want me to answer, and are just commenting.

Cindy, you know the question was not directed to you... or anyone else... so why do you persist in being contentious. By the context, it was rhetorical; even if by chance you missed that in context, sister told you the question was rhetorical and that a response from you was neither desired nor required... so why continue trying to pick a fight on a point where there is nothing to contest... or is this another weapon of mass distraction?

I answered him. And I am still curious to see you answer my question, are you still refusing to answer or prove what you say?

You responded to his post; you have yet to *answer* him.

Huge difference... even in Indiana.

In His service,
Mr. J

[Pickle]

Yes, looking upon a woman to lust after her is sin, a violation of the 7th commandment.

No, it is not biblical grounds for divorce.

"Man looketh upon the outward appearance. The Lord looketh upon the heart."

While the state is appointed by God to enforce the second table of the 10 Commandments, it very obviously cannot do that in regards to mere thoughts, since it cannot read the heart.