3abn "on The Road" Again Options

[PeacefulBe]

Listening to "Behind the Scenes" on live 3abn tonight (Thurs), I was reminded of something you mentioned here earlier about taking the message to every "nation" (ethne = ethnic group), kindred, tongue, and people group. As DS held up a new contract (for new satellites around the world including India and China) one member of the panel (John L, Shelly Q, Moses ?, Danny, Brandy) mentioned that the braodcast does not reach these people in their own language. I hadn't thought of that when I mentioned what an expense satellite TV was, how few may actually be listening, and even fewer understanding. I think there may really be something to the method Christ endorsed--sending out his disciples in pairs.

Extra observation: Both DS and John L. were complaining about the rumors going around the internet. So DS tried a new approach for donations; he told a story about a non-Adventist who became aware that some people were trying to destroy the network, and so this gentleman said because of this he felt obligated to send even more money. Maybe some of you feel the same. Are you willing to sacrifice? We're about 98% there reaching the whole world. John L assured the panel that these people trying to destroy 3abn are really fighting against God, He related a passage in the Bible where God struck down the evil Ethiopians who were fighting Judah.

And there sat DS with his new young wifey, talking about the 10 Commandments and how God doesn't want us committing adultry (that's right, he said it without blinking). Truely amazing. I await his next little sermon about signs of the end, "Marrying and Giving in Marriage"

LaurenceD,
Was there a motivation obvious for that person to tell that the broadcasts to India, China, etc., were not reaching these people in their own languages? There is, of course, a huge move in China to learn English and many in India speak it as well, so there is a possibility that some in these countries will understand the progamming that is actually designed to share the gospel (and not just broadcast to recruit donors). It can bring souls to the truth, but it doesn't take the place of face-to-face evangelism.

PB

[LaurenceD]

Are you not aware that any one who is a polished liar will not wiggle or squirm when being questioned about their lies ... ?

I have known people like this. Simply charming.

One thing I learned right away around here, about a certain poster or two: If you allow for the possibility that just the opposite is true, it may explain a lot.

Was there a motivation obvious for that person to tell that the broadcasts to India, China, etc., were not reaching these people in their own languages?

Yes, the motivation was for greater donations. Someone mentioned that if we could afford to broadcast in their own language, this would fulfill the prophecy that the final events will be rapid ones.

[Johann]

I have known people like this. Simply charming.

One thing I learned right away around here, about a certain poster or two: If you allow for the possibility that just the opposite is true, it may explain a lot.

Some of us had to learn that 3 years ago. They even call it the Christian way to do things. The most amazing discovery I had to face back in 2004 was that their pastor, John Lomacang, spoke in terms where just the opposite was true. When even the pastor teaches this, is it any wonder they think it is the Christian way of doing things.

[Skyhook]

Johann, there has been mention of a book being written by Linda, and Sister mentioned it as a possibility for her as well. It occurrs to me that the story of the tragic situation of 3abn will at some point be picked up by a professional journalist who will see it as something that would have a potential for wider reader interest than just SDA church members and those close to the story. I'm not diminishing the importance of books by those who are close to, or involved in the story. I'm all for it. However, a journalist or other such writer who might undertake to write such a book would not necessarily be friendly towards the Seventh-day Adventist church. I think it would be a wise move to bring the 3abn situation to the attention of an professional writer with impeccable credentials for solid, honest non-fiction writing who would be interested in writing a book covering in a comprehensive way the whole saga. This should be someone who doesen't have a anti-religion or anti-Seventh-day Adventist agenda. Since this kind of writing usually takes a lot of time, it would be good for someone to begin thier research as soon as possible, even though the outcome is uncertain at this time.
Do you know if there has been any serious interest in such a project?

[watchbird]

Johann, there has been mention of a book being written by Linda, and Sister mentioned it as a possibility for her as well. It occurrs to me that the story of the tragic situation of 3abn will at some point be picked up by a professional journalist who will see it as something that would have a potential for wider reader interest than just SDA church members and those close to the story. I'm not diminishing the importance of books by those who are close to, or involved in the story. I'm all for it. However, a journalist or other such writer who might undertake to write such a book would not necessarily be friendly towards the Seventh-day Adventist church. I think it would be a wise move to bring the 3abn situation to the attention of an professional writer with impeccable credentials for solid, honest non-fiction writing who would be interested in writing a book covering in a comprehensive way the whole saga. This should be someone who doesen't have a anti-religion or anti-Seventh-day Adventist agenda. Since this kind of writing usually takes a lot of time, it would be good for someone to begin thier research as soon as possible, even though the outcome is uncertain at this time.
Do you know if there has been any serious interest in such a project?

First of all, while books written by those who have been intimately involved will be valuable, they will not substitute for a truly objective and analytical book produced from objective research.

And yes.... there is already more than one such individual working with this in mind.

However, I think that we should not have so much fear of professional writers who are not Adventist as what you seem to convey. There were several such non-Adventist writers/researchers who wrote analytically of the Waco group.... and none of the ones that I read... or heard in seminar presentations.... put blame on the Adventist church for what happened there. In fact, if anything, Adventist writers were more hard on, and critical of, their own church than were more objective writers.

[Johann]

Johann, there has been mention of a book being written by Linda, and Sister mentioned it as a possibility for her as well. It occurrs to me that the story of the tragic situation of 3abn will at some point be picked up by a professional journalist who will see it as something that would have a potential for wider reader interest than just SDA church members and those close to the story. I'm not diminishing the importance of books by those who are close to, or involved in the story. I'm all for it. However, a journalist or other such writer who might undertake to write such a book would not necessarily be friendly towards the Seventh-day Adventist church. I think it would be a wise move to bring the 3abn situation to the attention of an professional writer with impeccable credentials for solid, honest non-fiction writing who would be interested in writing a book covering in a comprehensive way the whole saga. This should be someone who doesen't have a anti-religion or anti-Seventh-day Adventist agenda. Since this kind of writing usually takes a lot of time, it would be good for someone to begin thier research as soon as possible, even though the outcome is uncertain at this time.
Do you know if there has been any serious interest in such a project?

Yes, Skyhook, and I believe most of your concerns have been taken care of.

[Skyhook]

Watchbird and Johann thanks for your replies. I actually meant to say that I think it would be good for a non-Adventist person with no anti-religious and no anti-SDA agenda to write a book. Thanks for the information.

This post has been edited by Skyhook: Mar 16 2007, 11:31 AM

[LaurenceD]

Remember The Road to Wellville? That was written by a non-Advent...a reporter who spent a couple of years just poking around Battle Creek. I got some new insights from that book. Prior to that (whether true or not), I had never considered the possibility that J.H.Kellogg's own adopted boy may have been the pyromaniac.

And what was the name of that book about EGW, written by a non-SDA? I think he became a convert from just doing the research.

[Voktar of Zargon]

[quote name='LaurenceD' date='Mar 15 2007, 10:35 PM' post='185622']
Listening to "Behind the Scenes" on live 3abn tonight (Thurs), I was reminded of something you mentioned here earlier about taking the message to every "nation" (ethne = ethnic group), kindred, tongue, and people group. As DS held up a new contract (for new satellites around the world including India and China) one member of the panel (John L, Shelly Q, Moses ?, Danny, Brandy) mentioned that the braodcast does not reach these people in their own language. I hadn't thought of that when I mentioned what an expense satellite TV was, how few may actually be listening, and even fewer understanding. I think there may really be something to the method Christ endorsed--sending out his disciples in pairs.

For many years the Adventist church praised it's world wide work from the context of being in almost all of the geographical countries on earth. The implication was that countries equaled the "nations" of the Bible and the work was almost finished. This is an erroneous assumption based on an imperfect translation. Likewise Matthew 28:19 says in the KJV "Go, teach..." Another unfortunately imperfect translation which should instead read, "Teach with the purpose of making disciples" or just, "Make disciples." When Christ said, "Go, make disciples of all people groups" I don't think he had television in mind. This is obviously a very personal, hands on, imperative. The disciples of the first century partially fulfilled this great co-mission. They didn't need satellite technology or even modern means of transportation to do so. Ellen White says that the world-wide advent movement of the 19th century was a partial fulfillment of the first angels message. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think they had TV in 1844. They did have some people who were willing to "Go" like Joseph Wolfe etc. By the way, did you know that Joseph Wolfe was afflicted with a nervous condition that prevented him from riding animals, or being able to cook his own food; yet he traveled more than probably any man alive in his day? John Wesley was originally a bookworm who shunned the outdoors, yet when the Holy Spirit got ahold of him he traveled more on horseback than any man in British history. Did I forget to mention the partially blind, truely self-supporting apostle Paul and his missionary endeavors?

We know that God could use angels to finish this work, instead He has chosen to use people. Why? Just ask Frontier missionaries. They benefit as much in the salvation process as did those they were trying to disciple. It is an essential part of sanctification. You cannot experience this by watching TV all day and signing checks once in awhile. The right arm of the gospel is the health work, not just the health message. Missionaries must be out in the world applying the principles in a hands-on fashion to the afflicted. Otherwise it's not really the "Right Arm." In St. Francis words, "Preach the gospel, always preach the gospel. If necessary, use words."

Is it possible to disciple someone by television ministry alone? In rare instances. Oh, in case someone thinks I am dead against television ministry my wife was actually brought into the faith solely by the influence of "It is Written." Of course she had a Bible in her own language, and received much literature from IIW in her own language too. She walked into the Adventist church ready to be baptized, only to be told she had to take a series of Bible studies on subjects she had already fully integrated into her life! She and I are both convinced though, that one of the reasons God used this ministry was because Adventists in her community probably weren't doing their job. She actually had a visit from a colporteur who wrote her off as a hopeless case because she wouldn't buy books on Sunday and never spoke to her about the 4th commandment.

Ever since the first international congress on world evangelism at Lausanne Switzerland in 1974, evangelical Christians of all types have concluded that the final fulfillment of the great commission involves reaching the unreached people groups of the world. Missiologists of all types agree that the only conceivable way of making this happen presently is to raise up indigenous churches in the midst of these people groups. Churches that become strong enough to begin multiplying through missionary activities of their own. The way this ordinarily happens is for cross-cultural missionaries to "go" to these peoples and "incarnate" into their culture bringing them the gospel in the flesh, not via satellite dish. Native missionaries from neighboring cultures are far more cost effective than sending American missionaries from across the world - though some peoples respond better to this approach.

The bottom line is this - "World-wide" television satellite ministry is a very expensive and often ineffective "shotgun" endeavor that appears to be drawing millions of dollars away from where our emphasis should really be in these last days. The major monetary appeals and goals espoused by 3ABN of "reaching the world" represent a grandiose at best - or even a false foundation to their entire ministry.

This post has been edited by Voktar of Zargon: Mar 17 2007, 07:56 PM

[Clay]

good stuff V of Z..... thanks for sharing....

[Voktar of Zargon]

good stuff V of Z..... thanks for sharing....

My pleasure. You're welcome.

[Voktar of Zargon]

Happy Sabbath!

This post has been edited by Voktar of Zargon: Mar 16 2007, 04:30 PM

[PeacefulBe]

Remember The Road to Wellville? That was written by a non-Advent...a reporter who spent a couple of years just poking around Battle Creek. I got some new insights from that book. Prior to that (whether true or not), I had never considered the possibility that J.H.Kellogg's own adopted boy may have been the pyromaniac.

And what was the name of that book about EGW, written by a non-SDA? I think he became a convert from just doing the research.

This is along the lines of what skyhook's post brought to my mind. Readers who desire truth will launch into research for themselves, those just interested in a juicy scandal will find their food as well.

PB

[Voktar of Zargon]

One further thought from this week's teacher's lesson:
"So it is through personal contact and association that men are reached by the saving power of the gospel... Personal influence is a power." - PK p.232

[Snoopy]

So true. She thought the position would fall to her and it didn't. The reasons were sound and the decision was correct. She also left of her own choosing and moved to another Adventist oriented network where, if she is posting here she would be in a position of very serious conflict of interest.

- FHB

So I wonder why she (SJ) was asked to leave 3ABN property when she tried to visit recently? Do you know, Lee?

This post has been edited by Snoopy: Mar 20 2007, 09:19 PM