10 Commandmants Weekend, (moved from Lawsuits Filed thread) Options

[caribbean sda]

Yep.

Who is the book being sold to? I ask because the church we attended today, in IL, had 10,000 books to distribution. I asked what it cost the church to get the books and was told they were "given" to them for distribution.

I think the church has to pay for the shipment of the books. Probably a nominal fee, ya think?

[Skyhook]

I think it was explained on some other thread that Remnant Publications prints the books and 3abn pays Remnant publications. Also, Remnant Publications will send them directly to every address in any zip code for a small price per book. As someone has pointed out before, even a few pennies per book as a royalty adds up when hundreds of thousands of books are being moved.

I can't help but remember after it became apparant last year that the Sunday church people who promoted the initial TCW did not follow through with much activity on the actual Sunday of the weekend. Someone said that it was really about selling thier little pins and other articles that they were pushing to the local churches, and not so much about activities on the weekend. My thought was that Danny sure picked up on that one in a hurry. I don't want to sound too cynical or mean, but things like t shirts, books, coffee mugs and other such incidental products can add up to a lot of money. I have heard that some of the big famous rock groups and pop entertainers travel with a big semi truck filled with t shirts etc. that bring in a significant amount of cash.

[mozart]

I have felt for some time that this was a living bible story in front of our eyes. This was about more then just a divorce. My feeling has been that there is a great deal here for us to see - many aspects, many things to see with our eyes in this time, and it will be a breaking point (IMO) for many sda's. It may divide people, but, anything that is about principle, justice, truth and standing for what's right often does divide. My words over and over have been "wake up - open they eyes and see".

i am feeling the same way SSOM. it's been said here before but i have thought the divorce very well could have been a blessing for linda. to get her out of the way. to protect her from the gauntlet. time will tell. i sure miss her tho'. again i say, 3abn lost it's "SOFTNESS" when it lost Linda Shelton!!!
even tho' you don't read here.........we love you linda. hope to see you soon somewhere.

[sonshineonme]

i am feeling the same way SSOM. it's been said here before but i have thought the divorce very well could have been a blessing for linda. to get her out of the way. to protect her from the gauntlet. time will tell. i sure miss her tho'. again i say, 3abn lost it's "SOFTNESS" when it lost Linda Shelton!!!
even tho' you don't read here.........we love you linda. hope to see you soon somewhere.

Mo,

I will make sure she gets your note here.
She would like nothing more then to be out there doing more and more ministry. That is what she enjoys, where she connects with people, and feels called, still.

I agree, many times I have looked at this mess and thought to myself that God got her out of there - a type of Joseph experience, but still, she is out, and I have no doubt she is being taught many things by her loving Father in heaven, as we all are. If you are staying connected to God thru the trials, you can't help but learn things!

I believe we all have a role in this in some way, we all have a journey in this "story" that we either will grow from, or we will sit in a stupor, refusing to see and accept what is to be gained by such an awful time. I try not to waste anything - I have always felt God wastes nothing, and like our sermon today in my church, to be among the faithful (as in Hebrews 11) means life is not always easy, but, if we are faithful to follow God's lead, no matter what, He never fails us, and we do grow stronger in our faith because of the relationship - trusting even while questioning all the happenstance around us .... nothing happens all at once - we grow, and time shows the results of that faith and growth. You usually can't see the growth as you are going through it, but faith tells us that each day of moving forward is a step in growth. God is so good.

[SoulEspresso]

Perhaps Linda is being protected. Danny's character hasn't changed overnight, so if she was like Joseph in Potiphar's house, if she hadn't been taken out, all the stuff not having to do with the divorce (relationships with the state viz. nonprofit status, Tommy, royalties) could have sucked her in and made her culpable.

And if one heeds Paul in Romans and Galatians, it's not even that; it exists to let us know where the lines are drawn... and when we have stepped outside of them. I don't know if we can accurately call them "righteousness", baseline or otherwise, because the avoidance of sin does not automatically make one righteous...and, as the rich young ruler found, one can keep them from small and still be spiritually lacking...

This is basically what I spoke on a year ago on Ten Commandments weekend. I felt so bad about Ten Commandments Twice Removed (we lost a couple of interests in the community when some members took it upon themselves to have Remnant mail them to every address) I felt compelled to oppose it on some level.

Calling them "baseline righteousness" was sloppy, thanks for calling it to my attention. Of course the real thing grows over time out of a changed heart.

[GrammieTana]

As much as I appreciate T. Marshall Kelly, I was somewhat disappointed in his sermon on the fifth commandment. It seemed like he was talking to a lot of 'us' when he said that children should still honor their father or mother no matter what kind of parents they had been solely upon the fact that, were it not for the 'sperm donor and receiver' (my words) they would not be on this earth. That any abuse issues should just be 'given to God' and not be used to 'dishonor' the parents no matter what their ilk. (Again, my words.) Am I being too harsh here? Or did anyone else hear that as a veiled suggestion that we should just ignore Danny's behavior with Alyssa and Tommy's behavior as a sexually predatorial Pastor and 'leave it to God?' Oh, yeah, forgiveness was mentioned in there somewhere, too.

Just wonderin'

GrammieTana

[mozart]

As much as I appreciate T. Marshall Kelly, I was somewhat disappointed in his sermon on the fifth commandment. It seemed like he was talking to a lot of 'us' when he said that children should still honor their father or mother no matter what kind of parents they had been solely upon the fact that, were it not for the 'sperm donor and receiver' (my words) they would not be on this earth. That any abuse issues should just be 'given to God' and not be used to 'dishonor' the parents no matter what their ilk. (Again, my words.) Am I being too harsh here? Or did anyone else hear that as a veiled suggestion that we should just ignore Danny's behavior with Alyssa and NATHAN.
Tommy's behavior as a sexually predatorial Pastor and 'leave it to God?' Oh, yeah, forgiveness was mentioned in there somewhere, too.

Just wonderin'

GrammieTana

Did not God often order his servants to ACT !!!!!!!! against sin and evil???????

Grrrrrrrrrrrrr...............
If i had not spoken up after 3 in my family had been abused, it's very likely the youngest would have been the 4th. it took tremendous courage on my part, Praise the Lord. it was a grievous time writing the letter that ended the abuse and the letter that also ended my relationship with my father.
i did not want the relationship with my father to end, but the fact he denied all and was not repentent, made me the outcast. my father wanted to remove me from his will because of that but my mother would not let him do that even tho' she, herself will not admit she believes us. my sister would not and did not defend her own child for lack of courage and fear of dis-inheritence. so being silent is not always for the reasons people think. the reasons are vast and the longer people are silent, the more innocence is lost forever and "little" lives are permanently altered.
I also want to add that I have forgiven my father long ago and also the tremendous amount of emotional abuse from my mother. I have showed my appreciation for the "good" they did and for taking good physical care of us even tho' they were failures at raising us emotionally healthy. that has taken me most of my life to heal from.
Here's a good quote: "It's a lot easier to raise a healthy child than it is to fix a broken adult".

This post has been edited by mozart: May 6 2007, 12:49 PM

[GrammieTana]

Did not God often order his servants to ACT !!!!!!!! against sin and evil???????

Grrrrrrrrrrrrr...............
If i had not spoken up after 3 in my family had been abused, it's very likely the youngest would have been the 4th. it took tremendous courage on my part, Praise the Lord. it was a grievous time writing the letter that ended the abuse and the letter that also ended my relationship with my father.
i did not want the relationship with my father to end, but the fact he denied all and was not repentent, made me the outcast. my father wanted to remove me from his will because of that but my mother would not let him do that even tho' she, herself will not admit she believes us. my sister would not and did not defend her own child for lack of courage and fear of dis-inheritence. so being silent is not always for the reasons people think. the reasons are vast and the longer people are silent, the more innocence is lost forever and "little" lives are permanently altered.
I also want to add that I have forgiven my father long ago and also the tremendous amount of emotional abuse from my mother. I have showed my appreciation for the "good" they did and for taking good physical care of us even tho' they were failures at raising us emotionally healthy. that has taken me most of my life to heal from.
Here's a good quote: "It's a lot easier to raise a healthy child than it is to fix a broken adult".

Thank you MO. I was so disappointed in Mr. Kelly. And thank you for what you have done for your family. It is only when people stand up for the downtrodden in any way, physically, emotionally or financially, that God's will can even think to be done.

GT

[lurker]

It was my understanding that even the commandment about coveting was given the twist that someone may gossip and tell lies about a ministry because that person covets the ministry of the person they are "trying to ring down". Now that's a stretch.

Elder Kelly did not give the sermon about coveting by the way.

This post has been edited by lurker: May 6 2007, 01:43 PM

[mozart]

It was my understanding that even the commandment about coveting was given the twist that someone may gossip and tell lies about a ministry because that person covets the ministry of the person they are "trying to ring down". Now that's a stretch.

Elder Kelly did not give the sermon about coveting by the way.

AND, shelly quinn's sermon on "bearing false witness", reading, spreading and believing gossip, etc. was just laughable except for the fact it's so disturbing coming from her. the whole time i was thinking, "does she listen to her own words?". i can hardly bear to listen to her, i've always been that way. not sure why, just a bad feeling, but i listened this morning just for edification. how can she possibly stand there and say what she said after the things she has said at other times against other people? just baffles the mind and heart.

This post has been edited by mozart: May 6 2007, 02:39 PM

[princessdi]

Unfortunately, I believe more than out of some defense of Danny, I believe Pastor Kelly speaks out of a religious "cluelessness". In an effort to advoid confrontation, at all cost, we tend to want to rush the process to the stpe where we are "healed".

As an example, I know of a very beloved friend of mine. This is not an easy friendship, but God given and strong one, nonetheless. It is not easy because my firend has been victim to many of the the things of which we speak here, in fact, most of them. God has done tremendous work in her. however, It is recognized by most that she still has much anger, but has been like this for many years, so she doesn't see her interactions as such. Not that she is not kind of loving, but quick to repsond in anger, with a healthy lack of self esteem to boot. Now to hear her speak about these things would make Pastor Kelly proud because like a good portion of Adventism(or chritianity for that matter) on the surface she looks and sounds good. However, a misunderstood word from some would tell even those who are not trained to recognize such that she is stuck on the stage of anger.

This is what came to mind when Pastor Kelly was dsecribing the people who have "overcome". None of which he has had enough contact to determine their true state, but could talk a good game in a chance meeting, and even from Sabbath to Sabbath, to say what is "expected". we don't really allow for all the stages of grief or recovery. Just the ones which odnt' make "us' uncomfortable". Now, it is this mind frame which makes the fertile ground for people like Danny and his familya nd cohorts within even the leadership of any given religious organization, SDAs in particular. So while I don't believe it was intentional by Pastor Kelly, I believe he resides in and promotes the environment which allows this kind of conduct to flourish within the church.

[Eirene]

We are not going live at the 11 am hour like we did last year. The promotion has not been big at our church this year. Don't ask me why...

Our media ministries Department is recording it.

Isn't that wonderful that Jesus was there to make that miracle happen. But, as it is now, events such as these cost a great deal of money. Thankfully we know though, that no price can be put on the souls that will be won and the hearts that will be changed through the messages of this TCW.

We're ignoring the weekend altogether in our churches. One sermon is about studying the Bible for yourself (yay for broad readings in clear passages!), the other is about believing Jesus' way is best before we can really become disciples.

The Ten Commandments are baseline righteousness anyway. One can keep them without being converted at all. But maybe that's a theology post ...

The whole thing is a publicity stunt by political conservatives anyway--not even close to as serious as the National Day of Prayer. 3ABN is trying to hijack it for its own publicity--why give them any ammo?

And you're a Pastor? Lord have mercy on us.

[FineArt]

This is my first post.
I have read and reread all that is on this 3 ABN topic. Read it here and on save 3ABN and on Maritime. I just shake my head. It is hard to believe this is happening in my church. I am disappointed in many ways that the handling of this matter has been treated as if nothing has gone wrong in this ministry.

I watched the "ten Commandments" presentation Sabbath and Sunday, I feel distressed , there was a cloud hanging over what could have been a blessing because the words applied to the errors of 3 ABN but was not meant for reproof.

Revival in our churches [DB] among our people is being called for but how can the Holy Spirit use vessles that are not empty?

If i remember council, the "finishing of the work" will not be by famous evangelists but by the humble quiet meek person that is willing for God to set him on fire. When the work is finished in our own hearts.....He will finish the work in the world. He will have a people whose mind is stayed on Him, not on the immpressive resume of man.
When we stop doing evangelism "our way"....God can use those that are willing to follow His way.

[runner4him]

This is my first post.
I have read and reread all that is on this 3 ABN topic. Read it here and on save 3ABN and on Maritime. I just shake my head. It is hard to believe this is happening in my church. I am disappointed in many ways that the handling of this matter has been treated as if nothing has gone wrong in this ministry.

I watched the "ten Commandments" presentation Sabbath and Sunday, I feel distressed , there was a cloud hanging over what could have been a blessing because the words applied to the errors of 3 ABN but was not meant for reproof.

Revival in our churches [DB] among our people is being called for but how can the Holy Spirit use vessles that are not empty?

If i remember council, the "finishing of the work" will not be by famous evangelists but by the humble quiet meek person that is willing for God to set him on fire. When the work is finished in our own hearts.....He will finish the work in the world. He will have a people whose mind is stayed on Him, not on the immpressive resume of man.
When we stop doing evangelism "our way"....God can use those that are willing to follow His way.

Welcome FineArt and thank you for your words. I agree and say Amen!

R4H

[LaurenceD]

When we stop doing evangelism "our way"....God can use those that are willing to follow His way.

Good post, FineArt. And welcome!

Isn't that wonderful that Jesus was there to make that miracle happen. But, as it is now, events such as these cost a great deal of money. Thankfully we know though, that no price can be put on the souls that will be won and the hearts that will be changed through the messages of this TCW.

Christ and His disciples are out ministering according to Luke 10. Nothing has changed in soul-saving. In this chapter, Christ tells his disciples they won't need money, but to work person to person. Paul understood this too when he took the gospel to the "whole world" (Rom 1:8) with hardly any monetary support at all.

But this isn't to say there are other types of ministries. Genuine methods tend to follow Christ though. It's much more meaningful...like night and day.