Merger Off? Options

[YogusBearus]

Now if their donations have been down a bit because of all of this, should we consider reversing the trend to let them know that we appreciate their choice?

Is that what you are recommending bob?


-bear

[Pickle]

I don't want to get in trouble for soliciting. But, why not do that if the Lord impresses?

You may find it odd, but Gailon at present would really like to see some sort of merger happen (such as 3ABN being merged into AF where AF is the entity in charge). Given that I do not understand all the ramifications of all the issues involved, I don't know what to think.

[lowender]

Now if their donations have been down a bit because of all of this, should we consider reversing the trend to let them know that we appreciate their choice?

Amazing Facts listened and have remained an honest endeavor... I will purchase their products again... I wrote them an e-mail thanking them for their decision not to merge.

[Artiste]

Well, the merger between 3ABN and Amazing Facts may be off, but the warm friendship between Shelley Quinn and her husband, and Jerry and Janet Page continues as demonstrated on two hours of 3ABN Live tonight.

Jerry Page is the President of the Central California Conference. They were featured on the same program about a month ago but have returned tonght.

I am perplexed at what to think about the fact that Jerry Page, when asked how 3ABN was impacting their area, replied "I was just talking with Danny this afternoon..." and went on to say how many people were coming into the church as a result of watching 3ABN. He stated that he and Danny were discussing the wonderful deveopments world-wide with 3ABN. His wife mentioned all the prayer warriors in different areas that were praying for 3ABN.

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This post has been edited by Artiste: Aug 3 2007, 02:03 AM

[lowender]

The end of this merger has to be a slap in Danny's face... But we know that it can't be a surprise for him. Danny is still looking for approval & he wants his influence back... So he's got more up his sleeve...

Imagine this scenario...

>Danny announces his "retirement". Steps down, but nominally...

> Wintley Phipps, 3ABN board member, steps up to be President of 3ABN.

> Wintley's close association with Oprah Winfrey gets her to pledge support to fledgling 3ABN.

>Danny still operates the whole thing, but never acknowledges it.


Think about that... Oprah with her statements like.. "The Bible is an outdated book." and her strong support for gay-marriage & sex outside of marriage...

But hey, why not? It's business!

[maggiecttr]

Now if their donations have been down a bit because of all of this, should we consider reversing the trend to let them know that we appreciate their choice?

Definitely! I just e-mailed the AF site to say I'd be resuming my donations.
Blessings,
maggie

[watchbird]

You may find it odd, but Gailon at present would really like to see some sort of merger happen (such as 3ABN being merged into AF where AF is the entity in charge). Given that I do not understand all the ramifications of all the issues involved, I don't know what to think.

...... .... Yes, I do indeed find it "odd". But did Gailon perhaps give a clue as to the way his mind works in the letter he sent out last night soon after the announcement came out? Since he has given full permisson to anyone who receives his mailings to post them anywhere they want... I'll quote in full the comment he made in presenting a picture of Doug and the official announcement that we have already seen.

It with regret that we pass this along. It is with sincere concern that we would encourage a reconsideration of some transfer of the assetts to the hands of the denomination before they are squandered.

Gailon Arthur Joy
AUReporter

Now who might the hero be who would accomplish such a "transfer of the assets"?

Well, the merger between 3ABN and Amazing Facts may be off, but the warm friendship between Shelley Quinn and her husband, and Jerry and Janet Page continues as demonstrated on two hours of 3ABN Live tonight.

Jerry Page is the President of the Central California Conference. They were featured on the same program about a month ago but have returned tonght.

I am perplexed at what to think about the fact that Jerry Page, when asked how 3ABN was impacting their area, replied "I was just talking with Danny this afternoon..." and went on to say how many people were coming into the church as a result of watching 3ABN. He stated that he and Danny were discussing the wonderful deveopments world-wide with 3ABN. His wife mentioned all the prayer warriors in different areas that were praying for 3ABN.

*****************************************

It has been very obvious that NAD has not been united behind the GC requests for restriction of appearances on 3abn "until things are settled" to the same extent that the SPD, for example, has been.

What has not been given prominence... or hardly mentioned, at least recently...is the love affair between certain denominational entities and Shelly Quinn nor how this fits into the growing fascination of many in our church with Pentecostal beliefs and practices ... especially those that are seen to give power for control of those things we want to control... supernatural power even. With this love affair with Shelly so obvious in denominational quarters... including Pacific Press Publishing Assn... and the expressions we have heard of her being the "heir apparent" if Danny were removed.... Pentecostal Adventists must be positively glowing with anticipation of 3abn becoming a world wide influence for spreading Pentecostal forms of Adventism all around the globe.

[mikell]

...... .... Yes, I do indeed find it "odd".
What has not been given prominence... or hardly mentioned, at least recently...is the love affair between certain denominational entities and Shelly Quinn nor how this fits into the growing fascination of many in our church with Pentecostal beliefs and practices ... especially those that are seen to give power for control of those things we want to control... supernatural power even. With this love affair with Shelly so obvious in denominational quarters... including Pacific Press Publishing Assn... and the expressions we have heard of her being the "heir apparent" if Danny were removed.... Pentecostal Adventists must be positively glowing with anticipation of 3abn becoming a world wide influence for spreading Pentecostal forms of Adventism all around the globe.

I tell you this, if that is the case, 3ABN becomes, "A world wide influence for spreading Pentecostal form of Adventism all around the globe," that is much worse a situation and a greater spiritual corruption then what of ds had done and is doing over there at 3ABN.
PS. What am I thinking, "Pentecostal from of Adventism," would not be an oxymoron?
Also, about the merger being called off, it seems to me that Gailon Joy and Bob Pickle are both the bottom line for the real reason why it was called off, not only due to they being the victims of an unwarranted punitive lawsuit, but also I am sure Doug must have read over their site, save3abn.com, jmo.

This post has been edited by mikell: Aug 3 2007, 07:56 AM

[SoulEspresso]

I don't want to get in trouble for soliciting. But, why not do that if the Lord impresses?

You may find it odd, but Gailon at present would really like to see some sort of merger happen (such as 3ABN being merged into AF where AF is the entity in charge). Given that I do not understand all the ramifications of all the issues involved, I don't know what to think.

I felt an urge to write and support AF too but I'm still waiting to see more of how this all unfolds. For example, it would be best for all if Doug moved his stuff to Hope Channel (after the September event, for example; logistically it'd be too much to change right now, I bet).

A merger would have been good if and only if 3ABN were brought to denominational standards of employment and financial transparency, rather than AF losing theirs. Along with that would have been some auditing of past books, which would probably have brought more, uh, "thingies" into daylight and oxygen.

Doug B has never struck me as being the crook Danny apparently is (if there is evidence to the contrary, would someone please put it somewhere on the Internet?! Ian?!), but the photo op at the initial announcement made me think, here's a man who likes the idea of his own satellite channel waaay too much.

The tricky thing for church leaders to learn about themselves is this: how much power can I be trusted with? Like I said, I don't think Doug B is a crook (how much less so now that the merger is off! ) but all the other consolidating he wants to do makes me nervous.

The best thing about the merger is this: someone somewhere told somebody-with-money, "Thus far and no further shalt thou go." Strike up the band ...

[Shepherdswife]

The best thing about the merger is this: someone somewhere told somebody-with-money, "Thus far and no further shalt thou go." Strike up the band ...

What was that about feet part of iron and part of clay--"they shall not mingle..."

Yeah, I know--out of context....

But you gotta admit, that merger had trouble written all over it. Or so it seemed to me...

shepherdswife

[SoulEspresso]

...... .... Yes, I do indeed find it "odd". But did Gailon perhaps give a clue as to the way his mind works in the letter he sent out last night soon after the announcement came out? Since he has given full permisson to anyone who receives his mailings to post them anywhere they want... I'll quote in full the comment he made in presenting a picture of Doug and the official announcement that we have already seen.

It with regret that we pass this along. It is with sincere concern that we would encourage a reconsideration of some transfer of the assetts to the hands of the denomination before they are squandered.

Gailon Arthur Joy
AUReporter

Now who might the hero be who would accomplish such a "transfer of the assets"?

I didn't understand this post at first until I went back and read it. Excellent point. The evidence on Danny's character is that he'd burn 3ABN down around him before giving up control of it. Which is a real shame. Too bad he doesn't want to save 3ABN enough to do the right thing, drop his lawsuit, and retire.

It has been very obvious that NAD has not been united behind the GC requests for restriction of appearances on 3abn "until things are settled" to the same extent that the SPD, for example, has been.

Too bad that people get preoccupied with seeing themselves on television ...

What has not been given prominence... or hardly mentioned, at least recently...is the love affair between certain denominational entities and Shelly Quinn nor how this fits into the growing fascination of many in our church with Pentecostal beliefs and practices ... especially those that are seen to give power for control of those things we want to control... supernatural power even. With this love affair with Shelly so obvious in denominational quarters... including Pacific Press Publishing Assn... and the expressions we have heard of her being the "heir apparent" if Danny were removed.... Pentecostal Adventists must be positively glowing with anticipation of 3abn becoming a world wide influence for spreading Pentecostal forms of Adventism all around the globe.

Most Adventists aren't well enough informed to know Pentecostal theology if it bit them, esp since it's become more and more widespread. Maybe we could discuss the problems with Shelly's teaching on the Theology threads?

A way bigger problem with Quinn taking the helm is the fact that she shilled for Danny all this time, to the point of accusing certain precious souls of being caught "in a web of deceit" on international television. That by itself is enough, in my mind, to have her exiled to a pig ranch in a far country until she publicly repents ...

This post has been edited by SoulEspresso: Aug 3 2007, 08:09 AM

[watchbird]

I tell you this, if that is the case, 3ABN becomes, "A world wide influence for spreading Pentecostal form of Adventism all around the globe," that is much worse a situation and a greater spiritual corruption then what of ds had done and is doing over there at 3ABN.
PS. What am I thinking, "Pentecostal from of Adventism," would not be an oxymoron?

No, unfortunately, Mikell, there are not only many Adventists... and some whole churches... who openly classify themselves as "Pentecostal Adventists", but in general, both the vocabulary of Pentecostalism and a good many of its primary beliefs have been accepted one piece at a time over the last 30 years to the point where it is almost impossible to discuss Pentecostalism at all in Adventist circles, there has been that much "blending" with traditional Adventist vocabulary and beliefs. Sorting out Pentecostal beliefs from Adventist is on the level of separating a strawberry banana milk shake into its original constituent parts.

Most Adventists aren't well enough informed to know Pentecostal theology if it bit them, esp since it's become more and more widespread. Maybe we could discuss the problems with Shelly's teaching on the Theology threads?

Your first sentince I agree with wholeheartedly. The second... doesn't work.... for reasons above. Discussions of this nature almost have to be on a one-on-one basis, for it is essential that each completely understands the "dictionary" used by the other, or communication simply doesn't "happen".

And in these areas, connotation is much more important than definition... for words are but labels ... and they can cover a multitude of thoughts behind each word. Words that are unfamiliar are only a minor problem.. for it soon becomes obvious that one must ask what the other means. But words that both are familiar with but use to represent different ideas are the real sticklers. Two can dialogue half of forever and not even realize that the one is using much different definitions than the other.

And then there is the problem of discrnment between "new light" and "old error"... even that which our church has been warned against.

[SoulEspresso]

But we could do it ... we'd just have to start with the definitions as used by each side ...

[Pickle]

>Danny announces his "retirement". Steps down, but nominally...

Retirement? Retirement?

Since when do executives in Seventh-day Adventist supporting ministries who get caught red-handed in the midst of scandal involving covering up child molestation allegations, getting over-valued cash donation receipts for donations of horses, and profiting by $129,000 in a single week due to a real estate deal/private inurement scheme get to retire? Since when?

If Danny retires, with whatever perks that involves, and does not voluntarily or is not required to pay back whatever he owes or ought to owe to the IRS and 3ABN, then the Danny Shelton Corruption Scandal ain't over yet.

[SoulEspresso]

Well, once he sued you, I think it was too far to go back. Now everybody knows Danny has something to hide.

Innocent people don't pull this kind of garbage, not in the church they don't.

But you and I both know that lowender's being facetious. What kind of fantasy universe would it be for Danny to retire voluntarily?