Gailon Joy Files For Bankruptcy, CREDIBLE? HONEST? FINANCIAL COUNSELOR? Options

[appletree]

"Gailon Joy, Mister Financial Counselor himself, files chapter 7 bankruptcy!"

Mr. Joy who claims to have the business acumen to save 3ABN from disaster has made his own financial disaster public by filing Chapter 7 bankruptcy. One of our own Adventist Institutions as well as ,numerous individuals and businesses will be cheated out of the money owed them by Joy filing this action.
Could it be that he should leave the saving of 3ABN to God who started the ministry and worry about his own financial disaster? Maybe he should work on saving himself and his family from all the creditors who are screaming for some accountability from Joys wreckless spending habits. It is often said that truth will come out in the end! It seems we finally have it here. Gailon Joy saw $$$ signs when he heard rumors of misconduct etc. at 3ABN.

Gailons lack of integrity, embezzling, dishonesty, and greed are now all public record. The bible says that if a man throw a stone that it will come back to roll over him. It sure seems that Gailon Joy's stone is smack dab on top of him right now.
I find it ironic that many of the charges that Joy makes against Danny and 3ABN are the very things that HE is guilty of!
No, he can't use the excuse that he is so busy trying to clean up 3ABN that his own house got dirty. It certainly appears he had financial problems long before he became involved with 3abn. Let's take a look at how we came to be at this place in time.

All of these months Gailon Joy has claimed that his campaign is all about saving 3abn. It’s all about accountability to the “stockholders in the pews.” It is all about exposing alleged corruption at the top. He says it is his Christian duty to bring the supposed wrongs out in the open. He wanted nothing except for wrongs to be righted.

It is well known that Joy was convicted of embezzlement. No matter it wasn’t his fault. We have the words of an ex landlord that says Joy cheated him out of a good little chunk of money and knows other landlords that had the same experience with Joy. Again, no matter, just one man’s word. We know that he claims to be a reporter, when he holds no credentials to that affect. We know he claims to be a financial consultant yet had to close the doors to his own business. We know that he signed for a car that was repossessed. No matter. It was all happenstance and sad circumstances. Joy did nothing intentionally wrong. None of this reflects on his character or makes his claims against 3abn questionable. After all, he only wants a change in 3abn’s administration.

Recently, we start reading comments from his associate Bob Pickle on BSDA stating that, he intends to receive a settlement from 3abn when the lawsuit has ended. Next we have a letter from Joy saying in his own words that ... Danny can make an early contribution and I will credit it to the award in 2009 by 3ABN and Danny Lee Shelton, his board, et al, for the grotesque misuse of process that this action represents...

What is this? Awards? Settlements? I thought the motives were strictly to correct alleged wrongs. Why would these words even come into play?

It appears that the man that is so worried about 3abn cheating people out of their money, will be cheating the state as well as businesses and individuals. The man who, supposedly, has put the word ACCOUNTABILITY on the map, will have NO accountability for his own debts. No wonder there are high hopes of awards and settlements. Gailon is obviously over his head into debt. How is it that a financial counselor could end up in a financial mess? Did he not take his own advice?

Are things starting to make more sense as we go along? Does it sound as if Money could possibly be a motive for his save3abn campaign? Could it possibly be that he is less than truthful and not completely credible?

The big difference between this information and what Joy has been feeding the public is this; This is all a matter of public record VS Joy's rumors, gossip, edited emails, anonymous letters, and speculation to the highest degree.

A lot of you reading this will see an obvious pattern and may change your thinking on what has been happening here. For the rest of you…..Yes we know he only embezzled his own money, the car he signed for belonged to someone else, all the landlords are lying, who cares if his motives may be about money instead of Saving 3abn. And,what is so wrong with a financial counselor losing his own business? All of these excuses will go along nicely with the new ones that will arrive over his bankruptcy action. Please...feel free to go right along believing those too.

[ex3ABNemployee]

"Gailon Joy, Mister Financial Counselor himself, files chapter 7 bankruptcy!"

Mr. Joy who claims to have the business acumen to save 3ABN from disaster has made his own financial disaster public by filing Chapter 7 bankruptcy. One of our own Adventist Institutions as well as ,numerous individuals and businesses will be cheated out of the money owed them by Joy filing this action.
Could it be that he should leave the saving of 3ABN to God who started the ministry and worry about his own financial disaster? Maybe he should work on saving himself and his family from all the creditors who are screaming for some accountability from Joys wreckless spending habits. It is often said that truth will come out in the end! It seems we finally have it here. Gailon Joy saw $$$ signs when he heard rumors of misconduct etc. at 3ABN.

Gailons lack of integrity, embezzling, dishonesty, and greed are now all public record. The bible says that if a man throw a stone that it will come back to roll over him. It sure seems that Gailon Joy's stone is smack dab on top of him right now.
I find it ironic that many of the charges that Joy makes against Danny and 3ABN are the very things that HE is guilty of!
No, he can't use the excuse that he is so busy trying to clean up 3ABN that his own house got dirty. It certainly appears he had financial problems long before he became involved with 3abn. Let's take a look at how we came to be at this place in time.

All of these months Gailon Joy has claimed that his campaign is all about saving 3abn. It’s all about accountability to the “stockholders in the pews.” It is all about exposing alleged corruption at the top. He says it is his Christian duty to bring the supposed wrongs out in the open. He wanted nothing except for wrongs to be righted.

It is well known that Joy was convicted of embezzlement. No matter it wasn’t his fault. We have the words of an ex landlord that says Joy cheated him out of a good little chunk of money and knows other landlords that had the same experience with Joy. Again, no matter, just one man’s word. We know that he claims to be a reporter, when he holds no credentials to that affect. We know he claims to be a financial consultant yet had to close the doors to his own business. We know that he signed for a car that was repossessed. No matter. It was all happenstance and sad circumstances. Joy did nothing intentionally wrong. None of this reflects on his character or makes his claims against 3abn questionable. After all, he only wants a change in 3abn’s administration.

Recently, we start reading comments from his associate Bob Pickle on BSDA stating that, he intends to receive a settlement from 3abn when the lawsuit has ended. Next we have a letter from Joy saying in his own words that ... Danny can make an early contribution and I will credit it to the award in 2009 by 3ABN and Danny Lee Shelton, his board, et al, for the grotesque misuse of process that this action represents...

What is this? Awards? Settlements? I thought the motives were strictly to correct alleged wrongs. Why would these words even come into play?

It appears that the man that is so worried about 3abn cheating people out of their money, will be cheating the state as well as businesses and individuals. The man who, supposedly, has put the word ACCOUNTABILITY on the map, will have NO accountability for his own debts. No wonder there are high hopes of awards and settlements. Gailon is obviously over his head into debt. How is it that a financial counselor could end up in a financial mess? Did he not take his own advice?

Are things starting to make more sense as we go along? Does it sound as if Money could possibly be a motive for his save3abn campaign? Could it possibly be that he is less than truthful and not completely credible?

The big difference between this information and what Joy has been feeding the public is this; This is all a matter of public record VS Joy's rumors, gossip, edited emails, anonymous letters, and speculation to the highest degree.

A lot of you reading this will see an obvious pattern and may change your thinking on what has been happening here. For the rest of you…..Yes we know he only embezzled his own money, the car he signed for belonged to someone else, all the landlords are lying, who cares if his motives may be about money instead of Saving 3abn. And,what is so wrong with a financial counselor losing his own business? All of these excuses will go along nicely with the new ones that will arrive over his bankruptcy action. Please...feel free to go right along believing those too.

You just revealed your identity to many on this board. Only one person would write a post like that.

There are many reasons a person might file for bankruptcy. It doesn't mean they are a cheat or a bad money manager.

This is nothing more than a personal attack on someone who doesn't agree with you. It is one of the lowest things I've seen posted on this forum. What an un-Christian attitude.

[panther]

You mean to tell me this man does not plan to pay his debts? But he said this himself:

"6) Joy is not paid to represent himself, unlike Danny's Royalty problems, but Joy does intend to get paid quite handsomely by 3ABN and Danny Lee Shelton, his board, et al, for the grotesque misuse of process that this action represents... and Joy intends to collect sometime in 2009."

So Duane, who is appletree?

This post has been edited by panther: Sep 4 2007, 11:21 AM

[calvin]

Well, like I have said before. I am here in the 3abn threads strickly for the entertainment value. So carry on.

But I am curious as to why you did not post any evidence of Joy's bankuptcy? Or should we just be expected to take your word for it?

[panther]

But everyone takes Joy's "word for it" and Pickles "word for it" without any documentation.

I can say it is true. Perhaps asking Joy might help. I'm sure he will come up with some good excuses.

Lee

[appletree]

Well, like I have said before. I am here in the 3abn threads strickly for the entertainment value. So carry on.

But I am curious as to why you did not post any evidence of Joy's bankuptcy? Or should we just be expected to take your word for it?

Yes, like I would make all of that up and put myself at risk for being sued by Joy. Those who care enough will go to the trouble to find it themselves. Just like they have tried to find any scrap of anything against 3abn. If they are willing to work to try and prove the negative about 3abn they need to be willing to work to read the truth about someone who has influenced them to the hilt.

[YogusBearus]

It seems this information has been out for a few days. I was very impressed that one of the supporters of 3ABN knew about this and had the good sense to not try to sensationalize it. Those that are trying to capitalize on this sad situation need to be careful that they don’t get carried away with their own hyperbole. You aren’t helping your cause.

On the other hand, I don’t see this as any lower than scores of things that have been posted in this section by all camps.



-bear

[awesumtenor]

You just revealed your identity to many on this board. Only one person would write a post like that.

There are many reasons a person might file for bankruptcy. It doesn't mean they are a cheat or a bad money manager.

This is nothing more than a personal attack on someone who doesn't agree with you. It is one of the lowest things I've seen posted on this forum. What an un-Christian attitude.

Poisoning the Well
This sort of "reasoning" involves trying to discredit what a person might later claim by presenting unfavorable information (be it true or false) about the person. This "argument" has the following form:

1. Unfavorable information (be it true or false) about person A is presented.
2. Therefore any claims person A makes will be false.

This sort of "reasoning" is obviously fallacious. The person making such an attack is hoping that the unfavorable information will bias listeners against the person in question and hence that they will reject any claims he might make. However, merely presenting unfavorable information about a person (even if it is true) hardly counts as evidence against the claims he/she might make. This is especially clear when Poisoning the Well is looked at as a form of ad Homimem in which the attack is made prior to the person even making the claim or claims. The following example clearly shows that this sort of "reasoning" is quite poor.

Before Class:
Bill: "Boy, that professor is a real jerk. I think he is some sort of eurocentric fascist."
Jill: "Yeah."

During Class:
Prof. Jones: "...and so we see that there was never any 'Golden Age of Matriarchy' in 1895 in America."

After Class:
Bill: "See what I mean?"
Jill: "Yeah. There must have been a Golden Age of Matriarchy, since that jerk said there wasn't."

Examples of Poisoning the Well

1. "Don't listen to him, he's a scoundrel."
2. "Before turning the floor over to my opponent, I ask you to remember that those who oppose my plans do not have the best wishes of the university at heart."
3. You are told, prior to meeting him, that your friend's boyfriend is a decadent wastrel. When you meet him, everything you hear him say is tainted.

So... who's the next contestant on "Guess the logical fallacy"?

In His service,
Mr. J

[ex3ABNemployee]

Poisoning the Well
This sort of "reasoning" involves trying to discredit what a person might later claim by presenting unfavorable information (be it true or false) about the person.

That's exactly my point. I witnessed this countless times while I was employed at 3ABN. Anytime anyone "rocked the boat" they were attacked.

[panther]

Put your head in the sand then! Keep denying everything you should see clearly because you are blind.
Keep believing Joy and Pickle no matter what. Your choice and your decision. Even if it is not smart.

[Clay]

is there a link? an article to read? where did this info come from?

[awesumtenor]

Yes, like I would make all of that up and put myself at risk for being sued by Joy. Those who care enough will go to the trouble to find it themselves. Just like they have tried to find any scrap of anything against 3abn. If they are willing to work to try and prove the negative about 3abn they need to be willing to work to read the truth about someone who has influenced them to the hilt.

It would be far easier... and far more effective if you would just refute the claims presented against Danny and 3ABN... if you can.. rather than looking for a larger bucket with which to sling mud.

If you cannot refute the claims against Danny and 3ABN, then it wont matter if you rent a steam shovel to sling mud at Joy and/or Pickle.

Not one iota.

Another poster asked for your side to prove what you claim to be truth... and has, to date, had no takers...

No, not one... and if you think trying to make Pickle or Joy look bad is going to make the readers let that glaring omission on your part pass, then you haven't been paying attention at all...like a bystander might do...

In His service,
Mr. J

[awesumtenor]

Put your head in the sand then! Keep denying everything you should see clearly because you are blind.
Keep believing Joy and Pickle no matter what. Your choice and your decision. Even if it is not smart.

Pot. Kettle. Black...

C'mon Lee... or Panther... or whatever you'll be calling yourself next week... surely you can do better than this.

Your mission... should you choose to accept it... is to refute the claims against Danny... trying to slime Pickle and Joy and maligning the readers of this forum does not accomplish that... or anything else save to make you look petty.

The ball is and has been in your camp's court.

you say it's all lies? Prove it.

In His service,
Mr. J

[beartrap]

It would be far easier... and far more effective if you would just refute the claims presented against Danny and 3ABN... if you can.. rather than looking for a larger bucket with which to sling mud.

If you cannot refute the claims against Danny and 3ABN, then it wont matter if you rent a steam shovel to sling mud at Joy and/or Pickle.

Not one iota.

Another poster asked for your side to prove what you claim to be truth... and has, to date, had no takers...

No, not one... and if you think trying to make Pickle or Joy look bad is going to make the readers let that glaring omission on your part pass, then you haven't been paying attention at all...like a bystander might do...

In His service,
Mr. J

SMO, JMO. Oh well.

[Pickle]

That's exactly my point. I witnessed this countless times while I was employed at 3ABN. Anytime anyone "rocked the boat" they were attacked.

Care to make a list?

But everyone takes Joy's "word for it" and Pickles "word for it" without any documentation.

Care to make a list of the things I have said without providing documentation? And to be fair, could you also provide a list of the things I have said with documentation, so we can compare the two?

One of our own Adventist Institutions ... will be cheated out of the money owed them by Joy filing this action.

And what Adventist Institution might this be?

Recently, we start reading comments from his associate Bob Pickle on BSDA stating that, he intends to receive a settlement from 3abn when the lawsuit has ended.

Would you care to quote what I did say, along with a little context?

As far as "receiving a settlement" goes, according to what Danny and 3ABN filed with the court, I was to receive a demand to settle by August 31, was I not? How come I haven't received anything yet?
Why did Danny and 3ABN miss their self-imposed deadline, without any explanation whatsoever, as far as I know?

This post has been edited by Pickle: Sep 4 2007, 12:15 PM