An Unauthorized History Of 3abn, Continues Options

[Clay]

Thanks for the clarification, Clay. I hadn't realized the rules had changed. So now it is basically take off the gloves and no holds barred? I was still sparing under "fair play". At least I now know where we all stand...

Sister

and I thought that's what both sides had been doing for some time.....

[Ian]

...Why would he take the vote on the nominating committee as a personal attack if Danny didn't want the job as an elder or was inclined to refuse it in the first place? It just doesn't add up for me why he would care so much...

Good question. You're right it doesn't make sense to me either, and nobody who I heard from said that.

You'll have to ask sister your question. She's the one who claimed that about Danny being so upset.

This post has been edited by Ian: Jan 27 2008, 07:39 AM

[calvin]

Are you speaking as an administrater or a member? If as an administrater, I bow to your judgement. If as a member, I remember when you had problems with comments made about Melody Shelton because she was not considered a principle in this saga and defended her. Doesn't Mrs. Fiscalini deserve the same consideration as Melody? You do realize I am speaking to you as member to member, right?

I assume the administrator said, "carry on......"

I am speaking as the owner. No more untouchables, the gloves are off. After four years I am tired and through playing referee, I have better things to do with my time, like enjoying the rest of BSDA. Too much gamesmanship on both sides for most anybody to complain about anything.

[Pickle]

I don't understand how 3ABN would be left holding the bag regarding finances if the chruch and 3ABN are separate.

In every story or event, there are different viewpoints or recollections, not necessarily right or wrong, just different because of what that person may have seen or heard, or known at the time. I asked some questions regarding all this, and got answers slightly different from Sisters novelized account. Actually I did not hear anything like her version aka the Fiscalini version.
Granted I did not talk to every single person who was a member of the Thompsonville Church at that time.

I myself wasn't there, and can't necessarily vouch for any of this on a personal level, nor can I give the names here, but I do feel these quotes are enough to demonstrate to the members here and the readers, that the truth is not always found by listening to one side of the story no matter how much it tickles your ears. Ask questions of as many as you can, and try to see something from all sides before making up your mind about something, and really if it can't be verified and proven, discretion is the best course, simply reserve judgment.

There's no cliffhaning suspense or drama, or eloquent language, in wha follows. I don't pretend to be a story teller, but I do hope and pray that this is helpful to some.


Here's one account:
When the Fiscalini's were at 3ABN we were at the old church. 3ABN owned the church building and let the SDA church use the building for free. Rick Odle was the Pastor. He wanted, rather gently insisted that Danny remain an elder and be on the church board, over Danny's objections that because of his work at 3ABN and travel's around the world.he could hardly ever be there and would not attend very many meetings, .

What were the reasons for asking Danny to be Elder?

Out of respect for his position at 3ABN and the work he did in the ministry.

Danny took the responsibility of being an elder all through the week, not just on Sabbath's or once in a while as others do,

Their were people like the Fiscalinis who constantly voting to remodel, paint, etc without the church having the money to do so. Danny's presence on the board, even when not there, reminded people that they could not spend 3ABN money without 3ABN agreeing to it.

There were people like Henry and Sandra and the Fiscalini's who constantly wanted to remind people that the SDA church was not 3ABN's church, but that it was a Conf. church. That was fine with Danny. The problem is that they acted like the building was their to do with as they wanted, without any money to pay for any changes. Also, they would vote for the church to have evangelistic outreach for the community, but did not have any money to pay for it, so it would leave 3ABN holding the bag. They had to be reminded that they couldn't have it both ways.

They wanted to act independantly but didn't have the money to back it up!

Danny being on the board, in Rick's words, would nip that kind of thinking in the "bud". When someone was pushing some such agenda he would always remind them that they would have to get 3ABN's permission before spending 3ABN's money.


And another:
"The part about Danny went like this. He was nominated by the nominating committe to be an elder. He told the pastor that he could not be an active elder due to the obvious...... The pastor said it was important because 3abn owned the church building. Danny let the "church" use the building rent free but here was the problem. There were several couples including Linda's couple [Henry and Sandra Juarez] that would get ideas about painting or wall papering the church which was fine with Danny. Only trouble is, they thought 3abn should pay for any improvements. Danny said he didn't agree. They got to use the church for free and it was fine with him to do whatever as far as decorating but they would have to use their own money, not 3ABN's."

and another:
"The nominating committee via the Pastor told danny that he needed to be an elder since 3abn owned the building and decisions might need to be made accordingly..also (and more importantly) felt that Danny was an active elder everyday, not just Sabbaths because of the ministry work he was doing and should hold that office. Danny said he would be able to come to very few board meetings and whatnot. "


Personal note: 3 people were talked to about this couple and the mere mention of their names caused rolling of the eyes and sighs all around.

One said, "the year or so they were involved was a year of hell."

and more:
"When the church went to vote in the officers Mr. F. stood up and said he had some questions about one of the nominees. He insisted that the present elders, the pastor and Danny go to a private room to discuss it. By calling Danny back there, everyone immediately knew that Danny was the one in question. Pretty embarrasing huh?

He told Danny that he didn't think he should be an elder ...and Danny told him that he didn't ask to be and really didn't want to accept it but the pastor and other elders insisted. The pastor then talked to Mr. F. and said he was the only one objecting and no one else had a problem and that he felt, that Danny had the role of elder everyday. Danny was voted in. Mr & Mrs. F were furious."

"I think part of the time Fiscilinis were there the Samuel Thomas was pastor. No one that I knew of had any respect for Fiscalini as he was always wanting to be 'in charge' "

"I understood that he held the title of pastor before coming here and wanted badly to be appointed as such between Rick Odle and Samuel Thomas's pastorship's. That was a hope of his own that had nothing to do with reality."

"Fiscalini tried to start a coup so he could be pastor. You should ask "sister" how they felf about Rick as the pastor of the church. I could go on but it would be a waste of time."

"If he was fired from 3abn, ...that had nothing to do with the T'ville church, that's a conference church."

" Once again in her ["Sister"] evil ways she is taking some seeds and making lies out of them. Always confusing facts with fiction."

[Ozzie]

I don't understand how 3ABN would be left holding the bag regarding finances if the chruch and 3ABN are separate.

'IF' would be the qualifying word there Bob. 'IF' they were separate, 3abn would not be left holding the bag.

[sister]

"Fiscalini tried to start a coup so he could be pastor. You should ask "sister" how they felf about Rick as the pastor of the church. I could go on but it would be a waste of time."

I asked the Fiscalini’s about how they felt about Rick Odle, I am paraphrasing, but this is basically what they said:

Pastor Fiscalini and Pastor Odle shared an office together in the Pastoral Department of 3ABN until Rick accepted a call to Pastor a district in the Illinois Conference. They both said how much they liked and respected Rick and were so sorry to hear when his wife had passed away. Jean said he remembered how Rick used to joke and tell stories about Danny, Linda and the early days of 3ABN and how they laughed about it together.

When Rick accepted the call to Pastor he suggested to Jean that there were other openings in the Illinois Conference and he might consider applying, too. Jean thanked Rick for the suggestion, but said that his heart was with the European work and the reason he had come to 3ABN was because he and his wife believed that there was potential for television evangelism in Europe, following his experience with the Net ‘98 program in Switzerland. He told Rick that he had received a call from the German Swiss Conference to return home and pastor a district, but had turned it down, believing the planning he was making for a 3ABN promotional tour in Europe was more important at that time. Pastor Fiscalini’s fluency in a number of European languages would be an asset in returning to Europe to promote 3ABN. Also, should the time come again to be a district pastor, Jean felt he would be more effective returning to Switzerland. Which is where he is today.

Mrs. Fiscalini has especially fond memories of the times Pastor Rick sang and played the keyboard at the Thompsonville Church for special music. She said his singing brought her great joy and it was a shame viewers at 3ABN didn’t have the opportunity of experiencing it, too.

[beartrap]

Jean is very Swiss in every way. Being Swiss, he is very strict about going by the rules, particularly the rules of the church he serves. things that muddy the waters or cloud the lines between church and something else seem to be anathema to people who are that mathematical. This scientifically Swiss approach to life is alien to the emotional ("spirit driven") way that many Americans and others operate and I believe that culture played a big part in this fiasco, as it has in various others. I believe that Jean followed his conscience. I don't think he ever intended to effect a hostile takover of the church. Trying to eject Danny would be the stupidest move a man could have made, if that was his objective. I simply don't believe that Jean would be that stupid.

BTW, A gentleman donated a large supply of used brick to 3ABN to refinish the exterior of the church with, the interior was repainted, the bathrooms tiled, the santuary recarpeted, and the pews reupholsted by 3ABN.

[sister]

'IF' would be the qualifying word there Bob. 'IF' they were separate, 3abn would not be left holding the bag.

Good qualifier, Ozzie: "IF"

They are about as separate as the white and the yolk inside a chicken egg.

[princessdi]

Bear!!!!

[appletree]

Appletree,

You must be running scared if you are now stooping so low as to sling mud at Mrs. Fiscalini. She is not a principle in this saga. This is just another one of Danny's tactics: attack someone close to a preceived source of danger in order to silence them and detract from the truth of their testimony. You are not man enough to take on Pastor Fiscalini, you and Ian have sunk to bullying his wife instead and attempting to slander her reputation? Even for you this is a new low, Appletree. Besides bullying innocent women, I'll bet you also slap children and kick dogs. Do you abuse little boys, too?

Sister

Sister, in reading your post I had to wonder about your own stability. You chose to (in your drama queen/king fashion) to call attention to your latest attempt at fiction with the central characters being the Fiscalini's. You and only you exposed their names and supposedly their story, to the public at large by posting it on the internet. The single reason for doing this was to try and make Danny look bad which seems to be your only objective in life. Sad. Anyway, having done this purely for reasons of hatred and revenge, do you actually think now that no one is supposed to comment about the "story" and the reputation that the Fiscalini's aquired in the short time they lived in the 3abn area? Oh Contraire my dear. Why should we just accept your little literary piece as truth, without questioning the credibility of those that are telling the story? Their background certainly makes all the difference in whether they can be taken with a grain of salt or taken seriously. In this case, after talking to a number of first hand witnessess, a grain of salt is the order of the day.

Oh and sister, hopefully you will learn from your mistakes. Don't ever expect to sling mud on anyone of your choosing without the story being investigated, the real truth told, and, know that if you offer to bring any other of your aquaintences and friends here to make accusations, they are certainly not off limits in these discussions. If you can't take it, don't dish it out.

PS...Danny's tactics???? I will try to repeat this slowly since you do not seem to grasp it....Danny....is...NOT...here...nor...does....he....come here....nor does he....tell...anyone....here ....to...post.... or ....what...to ...post.
If you want to attribute all of my posts of truth to Danny tactics then I guess we should attribute all of yours to yoursel...oh...I mean Linda tactics.

[appletree]

Jean is very Swiss in every way. Being Swiss, he is very strict about going by the rules, particularly the rules of the church he serves. things that muddy the waters or cloud the lines between church and something else seem to be anathema to people who are that mathematical. This scientifically Swiss approach to life is alien to the emotional ("spirit driven") way that many Americans and others operate and I believe that culture played a big part in this fiasco, as it has in various others. I believe that Jean followed his conscience. I don't think he ever intended to effect a hostile takover of the church. Trying to eject Danny would be the stupidest move a man could have made, if that was his objective. I simply don't believe that Jean would be that stupid.

BTW, A gentleman donated a large supply of used brick to 3ABN to refinish the exterior of the church with, the interior was repainted, the bathrooms tiled, the santuary recarpeted, and the pews reupholsted by 3ABN.

Exactly. So after the initial investment and improvements to the building any other rennovations needed to be the responsibility of the church who were getting to use it rent free.

[appletree]

I don't understand how 3ABN would be left holding the bag regarding finances if the chruch and 3ABN are separate.

That doesn't surprise me. There wasn't any "holding the bag." Its simple Bob. Certain ones that wanted to make adjustments to the church just assumed that 3abn should pay for it since it was "their" building. They were told that wasn't the case. Since the church used the building for free they would be expected to pay for any changes made.
Very simple.

[sister]

Sister, in reading your post I had to wonder about your own stability. You chose to (in your drama queen/king fashion) to call attention to your latest attempt at fiction with the central characters being the Fiscalini's. You and only you exposed their names and supposedly their story, to the public at large by posting it on the internet. The single reason for doing this was to try and make Danny look bad which seems to be your only objective in life. Sad. Anyway, having done this purely for reasons of hatred and revenge, do you actually think now that no one is supposed to comment about the "story" and the reputation that the Fiscalini's aquired in the short time they lived in the 3abn area? Oh Contraire my dear. Why should we just accept your little literary piece as truth, without questioning the credibility of those that are telling the story? Their background certainly makes all the difference in whether they can be taken with a grain of salt or taken seriously. In this case, after talking to a number of first hand witnessess, a grain of salt is the order of the day.

Oh and sister, hopefully you will learn from your mistakes. Don't ever expect to sling mud on anyone of your choosing without the story being investigated, the real truth told, and, know that if you offer to bring any other of your aquaintences and friends here to make accusations, they are certainly not off limits in these discussions. If you can't take it, don't dish it out.

PS...Danny's tactics???? I will try to repeat this slowly since you do not seem to grasp it....Danny....is...NOT...here...nor...does....he....come here....nor does he....tell...anyone....here ....to...post.... or ....what...to ...post.
If you want to attribute all of my posts of truth to Danny tactics then I guess we should attribute all of yours to yoursel...oh...I mean Linda tactics.

As usual Appletree, you are factually challenged in every way. What first hand witnesses? No names, nothing except your word—which is suspect at best—to prove that your facts are anything more than the musings of an idle mind. If idle hands are the devil’s workshop, how much more the false accusations, innuendos and outright lies of an idle mind such as yours?

And by the way, I was not speculating on your identity when I mentioned “Danny’s tactics” merely suggesting that you and he use the same despicable maneuvers in presenting falsehoods as truth in attempting to murder the reputations of honest individuals who are willing to stand for conscience and expose Danny Shelton’s true character and what goes on behind the scenes at 3ABN.

Go ahead, Appletree, keep suggesting that I am Linda or Sandra or anyone else of your choosing, it just makes it easier for me to move unobserved, witnessing and writing about what goes on in Dannyland...

This post has been edited by sister: Jan 27 2008, 01:27 AM

[Johann]

Thank you Ian for your account of the story. I suspect the truth is somewhere in between your's and Sister's account. Well as least I did not have to grab my handkerchief with your account in comparison to Sister's over-melodramatic rendition.

Calvin,

You remind me of the time I was doing graduate studies at a Lutheran theological faculty. There I was exposed to all kinds of theories, also the work of de-mythologizing. In the following I am NOT stating my opinion, but the opinion of certain de-mythologizers of whom there are various shades.

Don't grab your hankerchief when reading the melodramatic renditions of the miracles of Christ nor the story of Joseph. It is all fiction, but useful fiction. This fiction inspires faith, and that is why you have to keep dramatizing it from your pulpit. You just have to keep in mind for yourself that these things never happened the way it is told in the Bible.

Neither did some of the good Lutheran theologians believe in all the dramatic stories told from the reformation and the life of Luther. Just fiction to instill faith in the hearers.

So is truth somewhere in between? Should we balance our faith and stay away from the either or created by our 3ABN - and other - evangelists?

I will have some more comments later.

[Pickle]

That doesn't surprise me. There wasn't any "holding the bag." Its simple Bob. Certain ones that wanted to make adjustments to the church just assumed that 3abn should pay for it since it was "their" building. They were told that wasn't the case. Since the church used the building for free they would be expected to pay for any changes made.
Very simple.

Maybe you could help me out, then.

• When did the Thompsonville Church move onto 3ABN's campus?
• When did Fiscalini get fired?
• Before the move of the congregation to the 3ABN campus took place, who held the title of the church building they had then?
  • The conference?
  • 3ABN?
  • The Thompsonville Church?

Once I have a little more info I can respond accordingly.