A Time For Action Options

[calvin]

Many have called for this a time to pray for God’s intervention into 3ABN, put it in the Lords hand and let His will be done. There is a time to pray and then there is a time to act! So what are we going to do? Sit passively by and post another couple thousand messages on the subject? Anyone that reads this letter has to give pause and concern about the leadership of 3ABN, about what has been distributed as the official spin from them.

Why don’t we in a grassroots effort distribute this letter to our church pastor, members, conferences, union and GC leadership; Breath of life, Amazing Facts, AR, friends, family, etc, etc. 3ABN is a private independent ministry that is not answerable to the Adventist church in any official capacity, but 3ABN needs the church to survive. We need to get the donors, and church leaders and others of influence to ask questions and seek answers from 3ABN in light of this letter, possibly call for an independent investigation.

Daryl, will MSAOL join us in this effort, Observer and others at CA will you help?

Here is my opening paragraph. Feel free to use it or any part.

Here is a letter that was first published on blacksda.com, an independent Adventist virtual online community. 3ABN has been a tremendous asset and invaluable resource in spreading the Advent message. However, this letter brings to light some unChrist-like practices of the 3ABN leadership. The management of BlackSDA is calling for 3ABN to answer these allegations and submit to an independent investigation.

[sonshineonme]

Many have called for this a time to pray for God’s intervention into 3ABN, put it in the Lords hand and let His will be done. There is a time to pray and then there is a time to act! So what are we going to do? Sit passively by and post another couple thousand messages on the subject? Anyone that reads this letter has to give pause and concern about the leadership of 3ABN, about what has been distributed as the official spin from them.

Why don’t we in a grassroots effort distribute this letter to our church pastor, members, conferences, union and GC leadership; Breath of life, Amazing Facts, AR, friends, family, etc, etc. 3ABN is a private independent ministry that is not answerable to the Adventist church in any official capacity, but 3ABN needs the church to survive. We need to get the donors, and church leaders and others of influence to ask questions and seek answers from 3ABN in light of this letter, possibly call for an independent investigation.

Daryl, will MSAOL join us in this effort, Observer and others at CA will you help?

Here is my opening paragraph. Feel free to use it or any part.

Here is a letter that was first published on blacksda.com, an independent Adventist virtual online community. 3ABN has been a tremendous asset and invaluable resource in spreading the Advent message. However, this letter brings to light some unChrist-like practices of the 3ABN leadership. The management of BlackSDA is calling for 3ABN to answer these allegations and submit to an independent investigation.

I have been thinking all day long (and really for months now) what I could do about this - little o'l me. I am a friend of Linda's, and have hurt for her for some time. After this letter was finally out, I wondered what I could do with it. Our campmeeting starts this next week, and I thought I would get copies of it and leave them in various hand picked places, also try to watch people's reaction. I also considered leaving them somewhere in the 3abn tent...hmmm...not cool I suppose. I know it should go to the "leaders", but it's the "little" people that need to see it. They are the ones that can make the heat under the leaders, I am afraid the leaders are to AFRAID to do anything - especially when they won't work together. No one wants to stand up. When a little person stands up, they treat you like your nuts. Hence, all my thought about what to do...
I like your thinking Calvin, I think you are on to something. I think it will take some combined effort and pressure and not letting up to really shake this up, the people deserve it - Linda deserves it too. And, with prayer, God will give us the best ideas.

[Johann]

Many have called for this a time to pray for God’s intervention into 3ABN, put it in the Lords hand and let His will be done. There is a time to pray and then there is a time to act! So what are we going to do? Sit passively by and post another couple thousand messages on the subject? Anyone that reads this letter has to give pause and concern about the leadership of 3ABN, about what has been distributed as the official spin from them.

Why don’t we in a grassroots effort distribute this letter to our church pastor, members, conferences, union and GC leadership; Breath of life, Amazing Facts, AR, friends, family, etc, etc. 3ABN is a private independent ministry that is not answerable to the Adventist church in any official capacity, but 3ABN needs the church to survive. We need to get the donors, and church leaders and others of influence to ask questions and seek answers from 3ABN in light of this letter, possibly call for an independent investigation.

Daryl, will MSAOL join us in this effort, Observer and others at CA will you help?

Here is my opening paragraph. Feel free to use it or any part.

Here is a letter that was first published on blacksda.com, an independent Adventist virtual online community. 3ABN has been a tremendous asset and invaluable resource in spreading the Advent message. However, this letter brings to light some unChrist-like practices of the 3ABN leadership. The management of BlackSDA is calling for 3ABN to answer these allegations and submit to an independent investigation.

Calvin, I am very grateful for your courageous stand, and I am fully behind what you are doing. We already see the world-wide vibrations taking place as evidenced by messages from concerned people in different parts of the world.

[Daryl Fawcett]

This has become really hot topics over at MSDAOL with what is also to me new damaging information to Danny Shelton, that I haven't yet read anywhere else, from a first hand person, a pastor's wife, who with her pastor husband, worked at 3ABN.

We are also discussing what can be done and how, therefore, I will take this "a time for action" idea over there.

[Clay]

yep... I will spread the word.....

[sonshineonme]

This has become really hot topics over at MSDAOL with what is also to me new damaging information to Danny Shelton, that I haven't yet read anywhere else, from a first hand person, a pastor's wife, who with her pastor husband, worked at 3ABN.

We are also discussing what can be done and how, therefore, I will take this "a time for action" idea over there.

Please lead me to this new information - unless you want to copy it here - but I would be happy to read it for myself - is it open to anyone to read? On second hand, I have registered at your site, if it is open to anyone to read on your site, once registered, I can locate it with a search of 3abn? If not, please advise.

This post has been edited by sonshineonme: Jul 15 2006, 08:45 PM

[watchbird]

Many have called for this a time to pray for God’s intervention into 3ABN, put it in the Lords hand and let His will be done. There is a time to pray and then there is a time to act! So what are we going to do? Sit passively by and post another couple thousand messages on the subject? Anyone that reads this letter has to give pause and concern about the leadership of 3ABN, about what has been distributed as the official spin from them.

Why don’t we in a grassroots effort distribute this letter to our church pastor, members, conferences, union and GC leadership; Breath of life, Amazing Facts, AR, friends, family, etc, etc. 3ABN is a private independent ministry that is not answerable to the Adventist church in any official capacity, but 3ABN needs the church to survive. We need to get the donors, and church leaders and others of influence to ask questions and seek answers from 3ABN in light of this letter, possibly call for an independent investigation.

Daryl, will MSAOL join us in this effort, Observer and others at CA will you help?

Here is my opening paragraph. Feel free to use it or any part.

Here is a letter that was first published on blacksda.com, an independent Adventist virtual online community. 3ABN has been a tremendous asset and invaluable resource in spreading the Advent message. However, this letter brings to light some unChrist-like practices of the 3ABN leadership. The management of BlackSDA is calling for 3ABN to answer these allegations and submit to an independent investigation.

I'd like to suggest something which would at the same time be more simple and more comprehensive. The letter from Arild, as valuable as it is to us and to those who have already been following the events, is not going to be nearly so meaningful to those who might be getting it for the first time. What I would like to suggest is to each of us print simple little cards--calling card size--which we can hand out in our churches, our campmeetings, and wherever else people gather. These would say something very simple, like for example,

Have you ever had questions about the changes
that have occurred at 3ABN over the last two years?
If so, BSDA is the place for you.
http://www.blacksda.com/forums/index.php?showforum=48
Free access to all, with or without registration.

This idea could also be combined with Calvin's, except rather than sending the whole AA letter, one might just send a very short resume of the problem and what we see needing to be done ... but again urging the reader to come to BSDA for more reading.

Can you get churches to run something like this in their newsletters?
Can you get conferences to run this in their conference comuniques?
(I know some that wouldn't ... I think there are some that would.)
How about churches who have websites?
How many of those can we get to run a short blurb for BSDA?
Can some "take a page" from those who in past years have tucked flyers under car
windshield wipers during mass meeting or who kept piles of brochures in church restrooms?

And what we also need to keep in mind is this -- that there truly are those in high places who are afraid to move on this because they fear the strength of the 3ABN supporters. Anything we can do to first of all cause those supporters to change, and secondly to communicate to conference officials that this has happened, will strengthen the hands of those who really want to cleanse the camp and disentangle the Church from 3ABN.


As for keeping on here? Well, we maybe don't need to put up the same number of posts per day, but we do need to hang around to answer questions or comments that new visitors will have.

But besides that, the story is not all told. There are more questions to ask. More answers to give. More stories to tell.

Stay tuned....

[Daryl Fawcett]

Please lead me to this new information - unless you want to copy it here - but I would be happy to read it for myself - is it open to anyone to read? On second hand, I have registered at your site, if it is open to anyone to read on your site, once registered, I can locate it with a search of 3abn? If not, please advise.

You asked here, therefore, I will answer you hear by telling you that the new information is in the "Dr. Arild Abrahamsen speaks out for himself and Linda Shelton" topic over at MSDAOL.

This post has been edited by Daryl Fawcett: Jul 15 2006, 09:17 PM

[LadyTenor]

[sister]

Many have called for this a time to pray for God’s intervention into 3ABN, put it in the Lords hand and let His will be done. There is a time to pray and then there is a time to act! So what are we going to do? Sit passively by and post another couple thousand messages on the subject? Anyone that reads this letter has to give pause and concern about the leadership of 3ABN, about what has been distributed as the official spin from them.

Why don’t we in a grassroots effort distribute this letter to our church pastor, members, conferences, union and GC leadership; Breath of life, Amazing Facts, AR, friends, family, etc, etc. 3ABN is a private independent ministry that is not answerable to the Adventist church in any official capacity, but 3ABN needs the church to survive. We need to get the donors, and church leaders and others of influence to ask questions and seek answers from 3ABN in light of this letter, possibly call for an independent investigation.

Daryl, will MSAOL join us in this effort, Observer and others at CA will you help?

Here is my opening paragraph. Feel free to use it or any part.

Here is a letter that was first published on blacksda.com, an independent Adventist virtual online community. 3ABN has been a tremendous asset and invaluable resource in spreading the Advent message. However, this letter brings to light some unChrist-like practices of the 3ABN leadership. The management of BlackSDA is calling for 3ABN to answer these allegations and submit to an independent investigation.

Calvin,

It was exactly three months ago today when I made the first post in the thread “An Unauthorized History of 3ABN”. The Lord impressed me that I had information to share and that BSDA was the right place and it was the right time. We have struggled twice over the closing of thread and reopening it. Both times, even though you were personally not convinced of the truth contained in all of my narratives, you still upheld my right to continue to speak freely within certain agreed upon boundaries. And it was you who approached me in regard to gathering all the 3ABN threads together in their own section, including the chapter divisions of “An Unauthorized History of 3ABN” in order to make the information more easily accessible. Personally, I believe that it was the Lord’s leading. And now with the testimony of Dr. Arild Abrahamsen, you have publicly confessed that you no longer stand on the fence, but accept the truth of his witness.

Calvin, I want to personally thank you for spearheading this call for action. Like the good Samaritan, you have seen the victims lying at the side of the road—battered, bruised and bleeding—and instead of merely stopping with a look of sadness on your face and shaking your head at the iniquity of it all and then going on—you knelt down. Not worrying about the victims blood staining your clothing, you gently began to minister to their needs—with no thought for yourself. Your actions speak loudly and I am sure that they are registered in the Lamb’s Book of Life. God bless you, Calvin, for following your conviction to do what is just.

Sister


This post has been edited by sister: Jul 15 2006, 11:37 PM

[Observer]

The question has been asked: "Daryl, will MSAOL join us in this effort, Observer and others at CA will you help?" The follow-up question is: How can one effect a change at 3ABN?

In my thinking, the answers fall into the following categories:

1) God will need to bring about change.

This answer suggests two possibilities. One might do nothing and simply wait for God to act. Or, one might take some action, in an attempt to cooperate with God in bringing about change.

2) Someone steps forward to use civil institutions to effect that needed change.

This could be the filing of a civil lawsuit, or of criminal charges, is cause existed for such. It could include investigations by IRS authorities, if reason for such existed. There are probably other venues and methods that could be used to e effect change.

My personal opinion as to how we can effect change is:

a) I think that we are very limited in effecting change through the SDA denomination. I do not think that the SDA denomination has much "clout" in effecting change, contrary the thinking of others.

Those with inside information can work with the IRS to do forensic audits of 3ABN's books. But that is a long-shot. It is doubtful that anything could be discovered that would result in more than additional payments of taxes and potentially fines. Such would not likely "bring down" 3ABN, if that was desired.

c) Effecting change at 3ABN might require someone like Linda (Dr. A, and there are others) file a civil action for libel. Under the right circumstances this might get things out into the open that would bring about a change in 3ABN. But, such would come at a high cost to some people, such as Linda. The possibility exists that her "ministry" would be "dead in the water," so to speak. Only she (and the others) can make the decision as to whether or not they are wiling to pay that Cost.

d) Effecting change at 3ABN might require someone with in-depth personal involvement to come forward publicly. Let me give an example: Let us say that a leader at 3ABN (You may pick any person you wish.) had a sexual relationship with someone other than their marital spouse, and that this was an important issues in this discussion. That relationship might have been consensual. It might not have been consensual. But, it was a relationship. That person might need for come forward publicly. Doing so would result in paying a big price.

Folks, there may be innocent victims in this case. These "innocent victims" may not be willing to pay the price.

The above is simply my personal opinion as to what it may take to effect change at 3ABN.

[Clay]

The question has been asked: "Daryl, will MSAOL join us in this effort, Observer and others at CA will you help?" The follow-up question is: How can one effect a change at 3ABN?

In my thinking, the answers fall into the following categories:

1) God will need to bring about change.

This answer suggests two possibilities. One might do nothing and simply wait for God to act. Or, one might take some action, in an attempt to cooperate with God in bringing about change.

2) Someone steps forward to use civil institutions to effect that needed change.

This could be the filing of a civil lawsuit, or of criminal charges, is cause existed for such. It could include investigations by IRS authorities, if reason for such existed. There are probably other venues and methods that could be used to e effect change.

My personal opinion as to how we can effect change is:

a) I think that we are very limited in effecting change through the SDA denomination. I do not think that the SDA denomination has much "clout" in effecting change, contrary the thinking of others.

Those with inside information can work with the IRS to do forensic audits of 3ABN's books. But that is a long-shot. It is doubtful that anything could be discovered that would result in more than additional payments of taxes and potentially fines. Such would not likely "bring down" 3ABN, if that was desired.

c) Effecting change at 3ABN might require someone like Linda (Dr. A, and there are others) file a civil action for libel. Under the right circumstances this might get things out into the open that would bring about a change in 3ABN. But, such would come at a high cost to some people, such as Linda. The possibility exists that her "ministry" would be "dead in the water," so to speak. Only she (and the others) can make the decision as to whether or not they are wiling to pay that Cost.

d) Effecting change at 3ABN might require someone with in-depth personal involvement to come forward publicly. Let me give an example: Let us say that a leader at 3ABN (You may pick any person you wish.) had a sexual relationship with someone other than their marital spouse, and that this was an important issues in this discussion. That relationship might have been consensual. It might not have been consensual. But, it was a relationship. That person might need for come forward publicly. Doing so would result in paying a big price.

Folks, there may be innocent victims in this case. These "innocent victims" may not be willing to pay the price.

The above is simply my personal opinion as to what it may take to effect change at 3ABN.

All valid points.... in the end 3abn is a private .org and as I have said before maybe the only thing the church will do is distance itself from 3abn....

My issue from the start is that Linda was mistreated, should have been treated better... I hope she is able to get the marital assets that she is seeking....

[September]

How about writing to the various ABC's and sharing the letter with them while asking them to remove any of Danny's books or other 3ABN publications from their shelves...this would include music CD's, DVD's, from various 3ABN staff--including John Lomacang and others.

I know the manager of a local ABC and I will be sharing the letter with him this week.

[PrincessDrRe]

What about also sending copies of the letter to the various churches, and even posting it on the campus of our universities and colleges?

JMO

This post has been edited by PrincessDrRe: Jul 16 2006, 12:14 PM

[Observer]

How about writing to the various ABC's and sharing the letter with them while asking them to remove any of Danny's books or other 3ABN publications from their shelves...this would include music CD's, DVD's, from various 3ABN staff--including John Lomacang and others.

I know the manager of a local ABC and I will be sharing the letter with him this week.

You are suggesting the same method that 3ABN has used against Linda. Is it wrong for them, and right for us? Do we want to operate on the same level that we have condemned in them?

NOTE: If you were to do such, you would clearly open yourself up to a potential civil lawsuit.