3abn Diverts Tithe From The Sda Church, ... and admits it on air! Options

[PeacefulBe]

You know I was thinking the same thing about the passage of time. Makes you wonder what has happened to our backbone the last couple of decades don't it?

Somehow I believe Loma Linda will accept the money.

It's one thing to follow an ethical, reasoned and principled path and whole other thing to follow a rigid and uppity one. Is it really a bad thing to go from a church with an attitude that somehow gives a deacon the feeling that he is doing God's will by ripping the earring out of the fleshy part of a young man's ear, or members feeling it appropriate to shun those who don't dress as nice as they do themselves, and start to become a church that welcomes with open arms those who have not yet reached perfection.

Perhaps our backbone has changed for the better in the last couple of decades.

[Artiste]

It's one thing to follow an ethical, reasoned and principled path and whole other thing to follow a rigid and uppity one. Is it really a bad thing to go from a church with an attitude that somehow gives a deacon the feeling that he is doing God's will by ripping the earring out of the fleshy part of a young man's ear, or members feeling it appropriate to shun those who don't dress as nice as they do themselves, and start to become a church that welcomes with open arms those who have not yet reached perfection.

Perhaps our backbone has changed for the better in the last couple of decades.

PB, I feel that you have made an important point.

In experiencing both types of local churches myself, I've decided that I would rather be a part of a church that goes overboard on the liberal side than the conservative (since the liberal ones are often more warm and accepting). The staunchly conservative ones can do some highly unpeasant things to people at times.

I hope that the SDA church as a whole could at some point take the best from both sides.

***************************************************

This post has been edited by Artiste: Jul 31 2007, 12:34 PM

[Artiste]

...subsequently answered a question about tithe by stating, "The tithe given to 3ABN is used to support the pastors working for 3ABN."

This statement, while seeming to give a noble purpose for the accepting of tithe by 3ABN, might actually indicate something more problematic.

If pastors are working for 3ABN and getting paid by tithe coming to 3ABN (that has been diverted from the SDA church, incidently) doesn't that demonstrate that 3ABN is somehow starting its own church?

*************************************************

This post has been edited by Artiste: Jul 31 2007, 12:47 PM

[GrammieTana]

3ABN, the non-denominational TV ministry that has some SDA employees, has referred on-air to the tithe it has received from an individual.

3ABN insiders have reported that this has been the working policy of the 3ABN financial department since its inception, even though it has been officially denied by 3ABN leadership.

See the latest posts on Save3ABN.com for the details of this information. At least one ASI member has communicated concern over the practice.
*********************************

Just a thought on this tithe question. Is it possible that the offering designated as 'tithe' was received from someone other than a Seventh-day Adventist? There would be no restriction on receiving that as 'tithe' from a person who has no denomination or fellowship membership would there?

GT

[GrammieTana]

3ABN, the non-denominational TV ministry that has some SDA employees, has referred on-air to the tithe it has received from an individual.

3ABN insiders have reported that this has been the working policy of the 3ABN financial department since its inception, even though it has been officially denied by 3ABN leadership.

See the latest posts on Save3ABN.com for the details of this information. At least one ASI member has communicated concern over the practice.
*********************************

Just a thought on this tithe question. Is it possible that the offering designated as 'tithe' was received from someone other than a Seventh-day Adventist? There would be no restriction on receiving that as 'tithe' from a person who has no denomination or fellowship membership would there?

GT

[Artiste]

Just a thought on this tithe question. Is it possible that the offering designated as 'tithe' was received from someone other than a Seventh-day Adventist? There would be no restriction on receiving that as 'tithe' from a person who has no denomination or fellowship membership would there?

No, there would be no reason for the SDA church to object to tithe coming from someone else's organization ... I don't think ... but there are indications that most of 3ABN's viewers and supporters are SDAs, and what has been reported is that 3ABN has had a long term policy of accepting tithe, marked as such.

If that's true, then most of the tithe would have been diverted from the Seventh-day Adventist church.

*********************************************

This post has been edited by Artiste: Aug 1 2007, 12:24 AM

[Pickle]

Linda said that the tithe went toward the pastors, plural. Is that correct? And thus we are to assume that they are recognized and credentialed by the conference or union or division or GC?

If not, and if 3ABN decided to pay up all the tithe they've knowingly accepted contrary to ASI guidelines, would that mean that their record breaking income that they reported to the IL AG's office for 2006 wouldn't be as high?

[Richard Sherwin]

Not sure where you are going with this thought. Most Christians have thought through the years that gambling is a sin, therefore the proceeds would also be sin. I don't see this as either a liberal or conservative issue. If we accept the winnings from sinning we are condoning that sin. Would we accept tithe from a drug dealer?

Richard

It's one thing to follow an ethical, reasoned and principled path and whole other thing to follow a rigid and uppity one. Is it really a bad thing to go from a church with an attitude that somehow gives a deacon the feeling that he is doing God's will by ripping the earring out of the fleshy part of a young man's ear, or members feeling it appropriate to shun those who don't dress as nice as they do themselves, and start to become a church that welcomes with open arms those who have not yet reached perfection.

Perhaps our backbone has changed for the better in the last couple of decades.

[Artiste]

delete

This post has been edited by Artiste: Aug 1 2007, 12:38 AM

[Artiste]

Linda said that the tithe went toward the pastors, plural. Is that correct? And thus we are to assume that they are recognized and credentialed by the conference or union or division or GC?

If not, and if 3ABN decided to pay up all the tithe they've knowingly accepted contrary to ASI guidelines, would that mean that their record breaking income that they reported to the IL AG's office for 2006 wouldn't be as high?

That would be an interesting development!

****************************************

[Artiste]

Replying to Richard's post about gambling and accepting the proceeds of sin--

I think there is precedent for accepting funds that come from activities which we SDAs commonly consider sinful. In Jesus time, the Jews worshipped in the temple that had been beautified and embellished by funds furnished by Herod, who was considered a great sinner of his time. Jesus was not recorded as saying anything against worshipping in the temple for that reason; on the contrary he called it His Father's house.

*********************************************

This post has been edited by Artiste: Aug 1 2007, 12:58 AM

[PeacefulBe]

Not sure where you are going with this thought. Most Christians have thought through the years that gambling is a sin, therefore the proceeds would also be sin. I don't see this as either a liberal or conservative issue. If we accept the winnings from sinning we are condoning that sin. Would we accept tithe from a drug dealer?

Richard

Richard,

My point was that some of the changes in the "backbone" have been good ones. I am not saying the church should condone sin, just have a Christ-like attitude towards the sinner, something we have failed miserably at in the past due to having a rigid backbone, IMO.

PB

[Brick Step]

Here is a link to the saga of a fairly affluent Adventist dentist who was involved in handling his affluent father's finances as his father became very old--like over 100 yrs old. The father left a lot of money and property to the church with stipulations as to how it would be divided by the church for various purposes. The dentist also has given large amounts to the church. The story documents the behavior of the various conference trust service people and conference president as well as General Conference
people in relation to the aged father and mother and the dentist. It is only by the grace of God that the dentist did not become embittered and disillusioned at the incompetance and negligence and deviousness of some of these church officials in dealing with people and money.

http://www.advmca.org/articles/Truth%20Decay.html

Interesting point, Skyhook. I could not get in to the precise link you provided, but did find Members for Church Accountability at http://www.advmca.org/

[Richard Sherwin]

Interesting point. I'll chew on that for awhile.

Replying to Richard's post about gambling and accepting the proceeds of sin--

I think there is precedent for accepting funds that come from activities which we SDAs commonly consider sinful. In Jesus time, the Jews worshipped in the temple that had been beautified and embellished by funds furnished by Herod, who was considered a great sinner of his time. Jesus was not recorded as saying anything against worshipping in the temple for that reason; on the contrary he called it His Father's house.

*********************************************

[Richard Sherwin]

I agree, sometimes we have a backbone over the most stupid things and then other times we let un-Biblical marriages, attempted tax cheating and inappropriate paster/member relationships slide without batting a eye.

Richard

Richard,

My point was that some of the changes in the "backbone" have been good ones. I am not saying the church should condone sin, just have a Christ-like attitude towards the sinner, something we have failed miserably at in the past due to having a rigid backbone, IMO.

PB