3abn Diverts Tithe From The Sda Church, ... and admits it on air! Options

[Brick Step]

It is wrong for supporting ministries to gain membership with ASI based upon the understanding that they do not accept tithe, when they do. But maybe it is time for another look at inspired counsels which show that a church rule requiring that supporting ministries not accept tithe, is out of order in the first place. This article was written many years ago, but could be read again with benefit.

THE OTHER SIDE OF TITHE
By James Standish M.B.A.
(Article published in The Anchor, September 1992)

INTRODUCTION
During 1991, the Review and Herald Publishing Association printed a widely distributed pamphlet written by Roger Coon and entitled Tithe: Ellen G. White’s Counsel and Practice. This pamphlet was distributed with the Adventist Review and the Australasian Record. The conclusion of this pamphlet was that the only appropriate place to pay tithe is to the organized Seventh-day Adventist church. There are a number of reasons why this mandate for the unique support of the organized church should be examined closely. Before this is done, however, an introduction is necessary.

There are two simple sayings which speak volumes about the conclusions of editorial articles and research papers: You get what you pay for, and you find what you’re looking for. In other words, the conclusion of a report is usually determined by the views of those sponsoring it, or the views which are held by the reporter at the outset of the research. With this in mind, and in the spirit of openness, it is important for you to read this report with the knowledge that the writer is a conservative Adventist, who has a family member who is a self-supporting minister. It is also important to keep in mind that the “Tithe” paper to which this is a response, was published under the auspices of a church leadership increasingly concerned about the loss of revenue and in its lack of control over the world church.

This paper will deal with the following issues:-
What is God’s storehouse?
Who is responsible for how the tithe is used?
What constitutes a loyal self-supporting ministry?

WHAT IS GOD’S STOREHOUSE?

We are all familiar with the exhortation in Malachi to bring the tithe into the storehouse, but who or what is this storehouse? We are told by Roger Coon in his “Tithe” paper that “for Ellen White, ‘treasury’ or ‘treasure house’ were synonymous with the denominational treasury”.1 The standpoint that the Seventh-day Adventist church treasury is God’s one and only appropriate storehouse on earth is promulgated by Roger Coon, as Sister White’s viewpoint. This point of view causes a number of problems.

The first problem is that, while Sister White may refer to the conference treasury as God’s storehouse, this certainly does not imply that this is God’s only appropriate storehouse on earth. Sister White’s own practice of giving and allocating her tithe and the tithe of others, independent of the church’s treasury, indicate that her view of God’s storehouse was wider than a church organization. There is no dispute that Sister White allocated her tithe, and tithe given to her, independently of the conference. Roger Coon states that “She mentioned that from time to time she had used some of her own tithe as well as the tithe of a few others, to help certain individuals…”.2 Ellen White stated “Some cases have been kept before me for years, and I have supplied their needs from the tithe, as God has instructed me to do, and if any person shall say to me, ‘Sister White, will you appropriate my tithe where you know it is most needed’ I shall say, ‘Yes’, and I will; and I have done so.” In the same letter, Ellen Then advised conference leaders to “keep cool and not become stirred up’ about people giving her their tithe to allocate independently of the conference.3

It has been argued that Mrs White’s example was no example at all to church members in our times because:
(1) She was a prophet and we are not.
(2) The causes to which she gave tithe directly no longer need tithe,
(3) God did not directly appoint independent ministries to collect tithe.

While individual church members may not be prophets, it is incorrect to assert that we are unable to be lead by God in a similar way to Mrs. White. The God who moved on her heart and conscience, is the same God who desires to move on our hearts and direct us in all our ways. After all these arguments are examined, there is one point which remains irrefutable: Ellen White approved of church members allocating their tithe independent of the conference. These church members were not prophets, but rather church members like you or me. Speaking of these members, she noted: “I commend those sisters who have placed their tithe where it is most needed to help to do a work that is being left undone.”4

While the need which Mrs White supported may now no longer be in such desperate need of support, there are, as ever, many worthy projects which the church is not able or willing to support at this time.

Finally, the question is put forward whether God has directly appointed independent ministries to collect tithe. The answer is ‘yes’, providing the ministry uses the tithe for its God-ordained purposes. Ellen White stated:

"Those who have had experience in the work of God should be encouraged to follow the guidance and counsel of the Lord. Do not worry lest some means shall go direct to those who are trying to do missionary work in a quiet and effective way. All the means is not to be handled by one agency or organization…. To those in our conferences who felt that they had authority to forbid the gathering of means in a certain territory I now say; this matter has been presented to me again and again. I now bear my testimony in the name of the Lord to those whom it concerns. Wherever you are, withhold your forbiddings. The work of the Lord is not to be thus trammelled. God is being faithfully served by these men whom you have been watching and criticizing. They fear and honor the Lord; they are laborers together with Him. God forbids you to put any yokes on the necks of His servants. It is the privilege of these workers to accept gifts or loans that they may invest them to help in doing an important work that greatly needs to be done. This wonderful burden of responsibility which some suppose God has placed upon them with their official position, has never been laid upon them.5

The leaders of Madison School were encouraged by Ellen White to collect church means. She stated that “Brethren Sutherland and Magan [leaders in the school] should be encouraged to solicit means for the support of their work. It is the privilege of these brethren to receive gifts from any of the people whom the Lord impresses to help. They should have means—God’s means with which to work.”6

Dr Coon expresses the opinion that statements like this refer exclusively to offerings, not to tithe. However, this is difficult to support, as Webster’s Dictionary defines means as synonymous with financial resources.9

It is dangerous to assert that a particular organization is God’s one and only institution deserving of financial support through tithe funds. This demands that, no matter what the state or work of the institution, we are always to further the work with financial support. Clearly this places our church organization in a unique position: No matter whether they further the cause with the laity approval or whether they work directly against it, we are bound to support them. Through this policy, the church hierarchy become immune to the desires of their constituents. This is in direct contradiction to the principles of Protestantism, and the doctrine of the priesthood of every believer. It is, in fact, an example of a demand for unquestioning obedience of the laity at the implied behest of God as interpreted by church leaders who are the most likely to benefit from the policy!

Dr Coon uses a number of Mrs White’s quotes to prove that we are to unfailingly support the organized church with our tithes. These quotes include: “Cannot you see that it is not best under any circumstances to withhold your tithes and offerings because you are not in harmony with everything your brethren do?…* Unworthy ministers may receive some of the means thus raised; but dare any one, because of this, withhold from the treasury, and brave the curse of God, I dare not.”10 (*The sentence omitted from this quotation reads: “The tithes and offerings are not the property of any man, but are to be used in doing a certain work for God.” The omission of this sentence contradicts EGW’s viewpoint that the use to be made of the tithe is “in doing the work of God” rather than belonging to one man or group of men.) A number of similar quotes have been used to prove that we are to pay our tithe directly to the SDA church organization, or fear God’s retribution. There is a world of difference, however, between withholding tithe from God’s treasury and in giving a faithful tithe through independent channels. To suggest these quotes are directed against those who pay a faithful tithe to support God’s work, but choose to do this independently of the church organization, is clearly a misuse. Do we suggest that Mrs White was withholding tithe from God’s treasury when she independently allocated tithe? Of course not. It is equally unfair to state that those who follow this example are disobeying God’s requirement for 10% of our increase.

Ellen White stated that: “I have myself appropriated my tithe to the most needy cases brought to my notice. I have been instructed to do this, and as the money is not withheld from the Lord’s treasury, it is not a matter that should be commented upon…”11

In practice, God’s storehouse not only includes the SDA conferences, but also all those organizations or individuals who are spreading God’s word as ministers12, Bible instructors, Bible teachers13, minister/physicians14, retired Bible workers15, and the needs of mission fields16. God’s storehouse is not an organization, it is a group of messengers, working to prepare the world for Christ’s second coming. Sister White stated: “The tithe… it is to be especially devoted to the support of those who are bearing God’s message to the world, and it should not be diverted from this purpose.”17 The lone criteria for tithe support should not be the organizational credentials possessed but rather, if the worker or institution is true to the law and to the testimony, and bearing this message to the world. “The tithe should go to those who labor in word and doctrine, be they men or women.”18 “Even so hath the Lord ordained that they which preach the gospel should live of the gospel.” 1 Cor. 9:14.

Roger Coon notes that Sister White stated: “A great mistake is made when tithe is drawn from the object for which it is to be used – the support of the ministers.”19 This point ignores the possibility of a so-called “self-appointed minister” being appointed by the one entity that counts—God. One might wonder whether John the Baptist, William Miller and Christ Himself were worthy of tithe support under Dr Coon’s criteria! Surely we should follow Sister White’s example by allocating tithe based upon work being done, rather than conference credentials. She noted that she personally would create a tithe fund for female workers who were not paid or recognized by the official church, let alone possessing official church credentials:

“I will feel it in my duty to create a fund from my tithe money, to pay these women who are accomplishing just as essential work as the ministers are doing, and this tithe I will reserve for work in the same line as that of the ministers, hunting for souls, fishing for souls.”22

It is time to reverse the increasing emphasis on church authority and to return to judging the merits of support on the actual work which is done. If self-supporting ministers are “hunting for souls”, “let every man, if he is wise, hold his peace”, if faithful Christians, after beseeching God’s will, decide to support them.

WHO IS RESPONSIBLE FOR HOW TITHE IS USED?

The Example of the widow’s mite is cited by Dr Coon, and many who subscribe to his viewpoint, as a proof that we are to give to the church organization regardless of the purpose for which the funds are being used. After all, the widow gave money to the very organization which was soon to incite the slaying of God’s only Son, yet Christ used her as an example of faithful stewardship. It is concluded from this example that we are individual members are only responsible to give money to the organization; we are not responsible for how that money is used. Mark 12, Luke 21, DA 614, 615 indicate that Jesus was showing from this incident that ‘it is the motive that gives character to our acts, stamping them with ignominy or with high moral worth’.

This abrogation of responsibility is clearly a dangerous one. Mrs White stated:

“We are not to merge our individuality of judgment into any institution in our world. We are to look to God for wisdom, as did Daniel. Age after age Jesus has been delivering his goods to his church. At the time of the first advent of Christ to our world, the men who composed the Sanhedrin exercised their authority in controlling men according to their will. If men’s wills were always submerged into God’s will, this would be safe; but when men are separated from God and their own wisdom is made a controlling power, the souls for whom Christ has given his life to free from the bondage of Satan, are brought under bondage to him in another form.

“Do we individually realize our true position that as God’s hired servants we are not to bargain away our stewardship; but that before the heavenly universe we are to administer the truth committed to us by God? Our own hearts are to be sanctified, our hands are to have something to impart as occasion demands, of the income that God entrusts to us.”23

The result of a policy which requires church members to give unquestionably, is the unchecked use of God’s funds by men and women who are in positions of authority. This is neither a service to the receiver nor to the giver, as God has placed in the hands of each individual the responsibility for the results of their support. There is a world of difference between giving faithfully to an organization which to the best of our knowledge is doing God’s work, as the widow did, and giving to an organization which the church members may know is hampering God’s work.

“There are fearful woes for those who preach the truth, but are not sanctified by it, and also for those who consent to receive and maintain the unsanctified to minister to them.”24

“It would be poor policy to support from the treasury of God those who really mar and injure His work, and who are constantly lowering the standard of Christianity.”25

“The churches must arouse. The members must awake out of sleep and begin to inquire, how is the money which we put into the treasury being used? The Lord desires that a close search be made.”26

This is not to say that individuals are responsible for the misuse of funds, which they have given in good faith. Ellen White stated that

“Unworthy ministers may receive some of the means thus raised: but dare any one, because of this, withhold from the treasury and brave the curse of God? I dare not.”27

We live in a sinful world, and it would be unlikely if one could give tithe to any organization without having a portion of it used in a way which they may feel is inappropriate. This does not, however, take away the individual’s responsibility to do all in their power to ensure that tithe is used appropriately, as Ellen White encouraged:

“Make your complaint… Send in your petitions for things to be adjusted and set in order.”28

The question is inevitably raised, who are we to judge who is and who is not doing God’s work? It is true that pursuing a path of individual responsibility is a more difficult path then blind faith, but it is not an impossible path. Once again, if the work of the organization or the individual is to the law and to the testimony, it is worthy of tithe support. If it is not, tithe should not be diverted for its use. Who is to make the decision? The individual church member, who humbly beseeches God’s guidance. The same individual who decides which God to serve, which day to worship, which faith to profess and which love to share. The individual and only the individual is responsible for each action. To negate this responsibility is to deny the basic principle of Protestantism and Adventism.

It is important to note that individual responsibility accompanies the individual choice. No matter to which organization we give tithe, we are responsible to ensure that money is used appropriately. If the organization or individual does not provide adequate financial data, which indicates their sources and uses of funds, it would be wise to cease providing funds to them. We have all learned the hard way that tithe has been misused both in self-supporting ministries and within the organized church. It is also important to examine financial date closely, and ensure an independent body has reviewed the statements. While this may not catch all misuses, it is a minimum standard required.

WHAT CONSTITUTES A LOYAL SELF-SUPPORTING MINISTRY?

The major focus of Dr Coon’s paper is to discourage tithe-paying to self-supporting ministries (also known as supporting ministries and independent ministries). This has also been a focus of a presentation by Pr Folkenberg, GC president. In this environment, it is important for each church member to examine the issue of self-supporting ministries.

Dr Coon quotes Wayne Dull’s list of seven items, which he presents as identifying points of a loyal self-supporting ministry:
1. They accept the challenge to ministers as self-supporting missionaries.
2. They are willing to sacrifice.
3. They unite their efforts with the church.
4. They help carry God’s last message to the world.
5. They recognize and respect the church.
6. They will be well-balanced in principles and lifestyle.
7. They will bring all the tithes into God’s appointed “storehouse”.

If this is to be used as the criteria, it is useful to examine it closely. In particular, items 3, 6 and 7 need to be examined. It sounds reasonable to require a self-supporting ministry to work closely with the organized church, but this co-operation is a two-way street. In other words, for the self-supporting ministry to unite their efforts with the organized church, the organized church must be willing to work closely with self-supporting ministries. This is not always the case. In this situation, is it fair to label a self-supporting ministry “disloyal” on this point? Clearly it is not.

The sixth point, that the ministry be well-balanced is clearly one which is hard to judge. Exactly what is and what is not balanced depends on what is considered the norm. Finally, as previously discussed, there is no evidence that self-supporting ministries should not receive tithe funds to support ministers’ salaries, Bible teachers’ salaries and other God-ordained uses. While most, if not all self-supporting ministries would agree with item 7, it would be surprising if they all agreed with Dr Coon’s interpretation of “God’s appointed storehouse” with its limitation to the organized church’s treasury. To make handing over tithe funds to the conference a test of loyalty is to ignore the example which we have been provided. It is also to subjugate the will of the individuals (who give tithe funds to self-supporting ministries for the express purpose of supporting these ministries) to the will of conference officials. Ellen White specifically condemned this manner of authoritarian control from church hierarchy which should be resisted by the laity:

“God grant that the voices which have been so quickly raised to say that all the money invested in the work must go through the appointed channel at Battle Creek, shall not be heard. The people to whom God has given his means are amenable to Him alone. It is their privilege to give direct aid and assistance to missions.”30

We need just one criterion for judging the loyalty of self-supporting ministries: Are they loyal to the law and to the testimony? If they are, they most certainly are loyal to the church. Whether the church leaders love them or disdain them, is not an issue. Whether the church organization chooses to work with them is not an issue. By being true to God’s word, the ministry is being loyal to our church. If this is not true, the problem is not with the ministry, but with those who perceive otherwise.

It is ironic that the Matthew 18 injunction is as often neglected by those condemning individuals for speaking about problems in the church, as it is by the people who are speaking out themselves.

Recently there has been a lot of discussion about the disloyalty of Adventists who publicly disagree with the actions of church leaders. It is often asserted that these church members or ministries are working against the church. Once again it is important to remember that we are a church of individuals, none of whom is more or less important than the next. “The Church” is not an organization of particular leaders; it is each one of us. It is therefore, just the same to disagree with one member as another. Dr Coon points out that often the key factor to judging the right of a church member to disagree is “not what is done, but how it is done”.31 From this point he admonishes church members to follow the injunction in Matthew 18 (first go to the individual, then to a small group, then to the entire church). What is missed in this argument is, that many who have been out-spoken against the problems within our church, have followed this injunction. There is a point at which it is time to open issues to the entire church. Should these people be criticized for doing this?

A minister recently made a point which is particularly pertinent to our present situation. He stated that “We can talk about the evils in the church in the past, and be sure to get a host of amens. We can talk about the evils to come, and once again receive an enthusiastic response, but woe unto the pastor or layman who talks about the problems in our church today! He will be hounded out of the church for being critical!” How true this is! We are like the children of Israel at Christ’s time who claimed they wouldn’t have persecuted the prophets if they had been alive in their time, but later killed Christ.

If Ezekiel, Isaiah, John the Baptist or even Mrs White were alive today, I wonder how many church members would ignore or repudiate their message because it was “unloving”, or done in the “wrong way”. How much further does the church need to drift towards compromise before the Churchills in our midst are listened to when they warn of a coming catastrophe? Ignoring problems in our church will not make them go away. Attempting to stigmatize those who have the courage to speak out about the problems in our church will not bring about unity of purpose. Denying the extent of the problems in the church, will never bring about the needed reforms.

CONCLUSION

Tithe is to be used for supporting workers who are spreading the Adventist message to the world. The organizational credentials are not as important as the results of the work performed. It is up to the individual member to decide to whom they give their tithes and offerings. “The Jewish rulers recognized the obligation of tithing, and this was right; but they did not leave the people to carry out their own convictions of duty.” Desire of Ages, p.616. No matter which organization one chooses, it is vital to keep in mind that the world is coming to a crisis point. Dare any member of God’s church refuse funds to finish the work, and hamper the final message to the world? I surely hope not. At a time of unprecedented wealth, it is a terrible shame that giving is at an all-time low. Most assuredly it is time for us as a church to begin the work of cooperating with the Saviour in cleansing the camp, and regain our mission to the world. Let us thank God for those who still give a faithful tithe to God, whether independently or through the church organization, and pray for so many members who are robbing God and cheating themselves of great blessings by not returning tithe to God at all!

BIBLIOGRAPHY
1 Coon, Roger, Tithe: Ellen G. White’s Counsel and Practice p. 3.
2 Ibid p. 5.
3 White, Ellen G., Letter to Elder Watson, January 22, 1905
4 Ibid.
5 White, Ellen, To Those Bearing Responsibilities in Washington and Other Centers, Jan. 6, 1908
6 White, Ellen G., An Appeal for the Madison School, May 25, 1908.
9 White, Ellen, Special Testimonies, Series A, No. 1, p.27; emphasis added.
10 Ibid.
11 White, Ellen Letter to Elder Watson, January 22, 1905.
12 White, Ellen G., Evangelism, p. 492.
13 White, Ellen G., Testimonies, Vol. 6, p. 215.
14 White, Ellen G., Medical Ministry, p. 245.
15 White, Ellen G., MS-82, 1904 in Manuscript Releases, Vol. 1, p. 189.
16 White, Ellen G., MS-11, 1908 in Manuscript Releases, Vol. 1, p. 192.
17 White, Ellen G., Welfare Ministry, p. 277.
18 White, Ellen G., Evangelism, p. 492.
19 White, Ellen G., Testimonies, Vol. 9, p. 249.
22 White, Ellen G., Spaulding-Magan Collection, p. 117.
23 White, Ellen G., Special Instructions Relating to the Review and Herald Office and the Work in Battle Creek, 1896,
p. 42.
24 White, Ellen G., Testimonies, Vol. 1, p. 249.
25 White, Ellen, Testimonies, Vol. 3, p. 553.
26 White, Ellen, The Kress Collection, p. 120.
27 White, Ellen G., Special Testimonies, Series A, No. 1, p.27.
28 White, Ellen G., Testimonies, Vol. 9, p. 249.
30 White, Ellen G., Spalding-Magan Collection, pp. 176-177.
31 Coon, Roger, Tithe: Ellen G. White’s Counsel and Practice, p. 9.

[Clay]

so you posted that long paper to suggest its okay for 3abn to receive tithe money, is that correct?

[Rosyroi]

"Dr Coon quotes Wayne Dull’s list of seven items, which he presents as identifying points of a loyal self-supporting ministry:
1. They accept the challenge to ministers as self-supporting missionaries.
2. They are willing to sacrifice.
3. They unite their efforts with the church.
4. They help carry God’s last message to the world.
5. They recognize and respect the church.
6. They will be well-balanced in principles and lifestyle.
7. They will bring all the tithes into God’s appointed “storehouse”."

Note the bolded statements.

Now according to Joy and Pickle statements obtained from different sources found in save3ABN.com wouldn't this be a problem within 3ABN admin problem, Especially the Shelton family?

IJMO
Rosyroi

[Brick Step]

I am torn two ways on the 3ABN saga. If there is dirty bathwater at 3ABN—as allegations and some evidence suggests—I don’t merely concede that it should be drained out, I want it drained out. It MUST be drained out. But I also see a treasured baby in there. Equally, I do not want the baby lost with the dirty water. Perhaps I could bypass the waiting time while the dirty water drains out, and somehow zap it from afar. Perhaps some of you are in position to do some zapping. But I admit it: sometimes I on my part am not sure where dirty water ends and baby begins. So I am one who must wait.

But how can alleged corruption be justly judged, if the law by which it is assessed is not represented correctly, or forgotten, or maybe not even known? I am aware the article I posted was long. I felt that posting it was what I was meant to do in the circumstances, and pray at least some will read it, and maybe read it again. 3ABN is obviously a mega sized ministry with many parts. If 3ABN is to be condemned for accepting tithe, it must be because its pastors are not ministering for Jesus and doing the work of the everlasting gospel in the context of the three angels’ messages, - not because the Ten Commandments cover a law or a principle which says, “It is a sin for independent ministries to accept tithe.” The Ten Commandments cover no such law.

I still believe that the God who loves and died for us all, is allowing this 3ABN saga to play out so that attention can be drawn to truths and principles we each as individuals desperately need to understand as we face the future.

[Pickle]

Brick Step,

You may have missed one of the main points regarding tithe. My understanding is that ASI requires its members not to knowingly accept tithe and/or solicit tithe. There are organizations that have lost their membership at least in part over that issue. (Someone can correct me if I am wrong on that.)

How then can ASI continue to promote 3ABN to the extent that they do if Danny Shelton openly acknowledges that they knowingly accept tithe, and does it in a way that comes across to some viewers as solicitation?

Perhaps one lesson that we will all learn from this is that if you take too long getting rid of the bathwater, you run the risk of drowning the baby.

Tomorrow makes 52 weeks to the day since I asked those simple questions of Hal Steenson. Doesn't that sound a bit long?

[Brick Step]

It seems to me to be a tragedy that some noble and effective ministries are denied membership in ASI because they knowingly accept tithe, when there is a very good case from Inspiration to say that for a dedicated ministry to knowingly accept tithe is not a sin. You are in a better position than I to understand how the counsels affect the relationship between ASI and 3ABN.

I have just read the latest post on Save 3ABN, containing a letter by ex-3ABN lawyer, Nick Miller (do I have that name right?). This does seem like a particularly telling piece of evidence against some management practices at 3ABN, and it seems will hasten the draining of that bathwater. We sure do not want to drown that baby.

Please know, Pickle, that our prayers are with you and all those seeking to front up to the facts, and work for justice and for the good of God's cause.

[reader]

I do not believe that DS will let the bath water drain out. I believe that he will blow up the
tub first. If DS cannot have it nobody will. So the only way the end of 3ABN will come is when money dries up and they cannot pay their bills, and have to turn out the lights

[Snoopy]

It seems to me to be a tragedy that some noble and effective ministries are denied membership in ASI because they knowingly accept tithe, when there is a very good case from Inspiration to say that for a dedicated ministry to knowingly accept tithe is not a sin. You are in a better position than I to understand how the counsels affect the relationship between ASI and 3ABN.

I have just read the latest post on Save 3ABN, containing a letter by ex-3ABN lawyer, Nick Miller (do I have that name right?). This does seem like a particularly telling piece of evidence against some management practices at 3ABN, and it seems will hasten the draining of that bathwater. We sure do not want to drown that baby.

Please know, Pickle, that our prayers are with you and all those seeking to front up to the facts, and work for justice and for the good of God's cause.

I agree with you, Brick Step, on the tithe issue. As of yet, no one has been able to show me the text in the Bible that says "thou shalt return ten percent of your income to the Seventh-day Adventist Church". BTJM...

[Pickle]

Please know, Pickle, that our prayers are with you and all those seeking to front up to the facts, and work for justice and for the good of God's cause.

That is VERY much appreciated.

He was led like a lamb to the slaughter, yet he opened not his mouth. And that was after not sleeping all night. And not eating anything since supper.

It is times like these that you realize how frail we are and how easy it is not to be like Him.

[amesj]

I agree with you, Brick Step, on the tithe issue. As of yet, no one has been able to show me the text in the Bible that says "thou shalt return ten percent of your income to the Seventh-day Adventist Church". BTJM...

I've been following the 3ABN thread since July 21 and have wondered when the "T" issue would come to the surface. Well, here it is. As I've read the comments some questions come to mind:

1. We talk about the "storehouse." Where was the "storehouse" during the 100+ years after Christ ascended? Where was the "storehouse" during the Dark Ages? The Reformation? And, finally, where was it from 1844 to 1863?

2. It is OK to ask a person if they tithe. But, isn't it a personal decision between God and the individual "where" the tithe is paid? The IRS asks us to list the organizations we give contributions to...if... we want to claim the contribution as a deduction. The church "requires" a "faithful" tithe in order to hold leadership/teaching positions within the church...if...a person wants to lead or teach.

3. Then there is the question of religious liberty. Does a person have liberty within a religious organization (an organization that prides itself in promoting religious liberty) to support a ministry that is not associated with the church of which they are a member?

4. In more than 4000 years of recorded Biblical history, can we show a single recorded example of tithing that is similar to what the church practices today?

[sister]

Before we delve too deeply into the topic of where is the “store house”, etc., it might be wise to return to the topic of the thread: 3ABN diverting tithe from the SDA Church.

• It is a fact that 3ABN knowing takes tithe from whomever is willing to give it to them, including members of the SDA Church (Danny has now publically confirmed that fact on air)

• The majority of 3ABN financial support is supplied from members of the SDA Church (Beartrap can back me up on this statement)

• To date all major 3ABN fund-raising “Rallies” have taken place at SDA Churches, at the facilities of SDA institutions, at SDA Camp meetings, etc.

• ASI members are not allowed to knowingly accept tithe from members of the SDA Church

Based upon the above statements, it follows that the answer is yes, 3ABN does divert tithe from the SDA Church.

Should 3ABN be a member, in good standing, of ASI. According to their official stand on accepting tithe: NO. So why are the leadership of ASI so supportive of 3ABN?

[runner4him]

Before we delve too deeply into the topic of where is the “store house”, etc., it might be wise to return to the topic of the thread: 3ABN diverting tithe from the SDA Church.

• It is a fact that 3ABN knowing takes tithe from whomever is willing to give it to them, including members of the SDA Church (Danny has now publically confirmed that fact on air)

• The majority of 3ABN financial support is supplied from members of the SDA Church (Beartrap can back me up on this statement)

• To date all major 3ABN fund-raising “Rallies” have taken place at SDA Churches, at the facilities of SDA institutions, at SDA Camp meetings, etc.

• ASI members are not allowed to knowingly accept tithe from members of the SDA Church

Based upon the above statements, it follows that the answer is yes, 3ABN does divert tithe from the SDA Church.

Should 3ABN be a member, in good standing, of ASI. According to their official stand on accepting tithe: NO. So why are the leadership of ASI so supportive of 3ABN?

Why are they giving 3ABN $150,000 this year??

[SoulEspresso]

Why are they giving 3ABN $150,000 this year??

Because ASI hasn't learned yet (as apparently the powers behind AF have ) that certain "interested laypersons" can be successfully stood up to.

[Johann]

so you posted that long paper to suggest its okay for 3abn to receive tithe money, is that correct?

[DeeJayTwo]

I've greatly appreciated being able to access BlackSDA for some months, and appreciate very much getting the information and points of view expressed here. I finally registered so I could reply to the tithe issue. This is something I feel strongly about, so here goes: The tithe is the Lord's, not ours. I do not "pay" "my" tithe. I "return it" to the Lord via His storehouse -- denominationally, the church. Viewed in this light I have a real problem with any ministry that knowingly accepts and uses tithe submitted by members of the Adventist Church. If I want to send offerings to other places the Lord has blessed my husband and me with the ability to return a second tithe in His name to missions and ministries. We have been praying for Him to move in a mighty way on His (not Danny's) ministry of 3ABN and hope the current news about AF/3ABN merger is a sign that He is doing so! Thanks for letting me vent!