A Viewer's Version, Another side of the story Options

[paleface]

That would be a good idea! I would be interested in reading them.

Also, let us not tease Johann too much about the forthcoming news as he allready has a clean sox in his mouth, and one arm tied behind his back to keep from telling the information too early.

[Lucyladye]

That would be a good idea! I would be interested in reading them.

Also, let us not tease Johann too much about the forthcoming news as he allready has a clean sox in his mouth, and one arm tied behind his back to keep from telling the information too early.

[PeacefulBe]

No, I never have...I was nervous, not knowing who visits here...but maybe I should...sounds like the proverbial fat is about to hit the fan there at 3ABN anyway though...

If folks want me to , and think it would be beneficial than I will, how's that?

Yes, September, I think it would be good. I guess Calvin and Clay would have the final say on it though, right?

[princessdi]

You should go ahead an PM the emails to Calvin and/or Admin team.

Yes, September, I think it would be good. I guess Calvin and Clay would have the final say on it though, right?

This post has been edited by princessdi: Sep 11 2006, 10:02 PM

[calvin]

Yes, September, I think it would be good. I guess Calvin and Clay would have the final say on it though, right?

Not a problem, I have posted emails to me from Danny here, all can to that.

[PeacefulBe]

He wanted to, but was adviced not to. If it means that much to you, you can write to me and I might be able to have him talk to you or write to you.

Write to

johann@dirkete.org

I see I got the wrong quote from you, but this one might fit even better!

Hi Johann,
I tried to email you but got a failure notice. Is the above your correct email?

[sonshineonme]

Hi Johann,
I tried to email you but got a failure notice. Is the above your correct email?

That is his email - it matches one I have for him.
Johann@direkte.org
Try again. Sometimes it's his server.

[country bumpkin]

We need people around like you, bumpkin, because you have a conviction. You must also permit us, whom the Good Lord has given another conviction to be around too. We feel we have followed what the Lord has told us, through Scripture, to do. We feel we need to pray about this whole thing, and that we also must know what to pray about. We actually invite you to join us in prayer, especially these days when so much is happening. Pray that 3ABN will remain an SDA institution and not one who preaches the church is Babylon, like som of those in control of 3ABN are teaching now. Would you like this TV network to work against our God?

Johann,
I have no problem with you all being around. As a matter of fact, when I first started reading on this site, I believed everything I read. Then I felt the accusations started going too far and I decided to post my original theory that I have had from the beginning. What shocked me was the venom I received at this site. So much so that I decide that this was not in any way the spirit of God, and that if Danny was guilty of what he was accused of, those that were posting malicious information on this site were also as guilty in the sight of God. If you have been given a commission by God to present a sin, it is not the responsibly of the messenger to trash all those that oppose that view. What amazed me was that I was not saying that Danny was innocent, but that “in my view” as to the initial break-up, Linda had become proud also. To be attacked as I was for such a statement was enough to let me see that God was the only one who had the sense, sincerity, or the justice to handle this situation. I just feel when the dust settles that more that Danny and his crew will get a spanking.


P.S. I am Praying, boy am I praying! Not only for the 3ABN Ministry, but for myself. I desperately need it!
CB

[country bumpkin]

Oh, by the way, maybe I’m reading something in here that was not intended, but I feel that it is being implied that I should be willing to accept the opposing views that are posted here without rebuttal. Well, as you know there are numerous sites on this 3ABN segment of this web page. I have made it a point not to post my views on any of those sites. As a matter of fact, it’s rare that I even look at them. But I do make it a point to defend on this site. I do believe everyone has a right to have at least one location where another viewpoint expressed and defended. So, no, I don’t mind you being around, you mustn’t mind me being around either.

[beartrap]

Dearest Bumpkin,

Whereas you seem to have not lived through 3ABN, as we have, Your opinions are interesting, but don't carry the weight of experience and personal knowledge, as do ours. I am happy for you that you seem to not have personal acquiantance with Danny Shelton. May you forever avoid such a horrifying experience.

[husbandoftheyear]

I am happy for you that you seem to not have personal acquiantance with Danny Shelton. May you forever avoid such a horrifying experience.

AMEN

[PeacefulBe]

We need people around like you, bumpkin, because you have a conviction. You must also permit us, whom the Good Lord has given another conviction to be around too. We feel we have followed what the Lord has told us, through Scripture, to do. We feel we need to pray about this whole thing, and that we also must know what to pray about. We actually invite you to join us in prayer, especially these days when so much is happening. Pray that 3ABN will remain an SDA institution and not one who preaches the church is Babylon, like som of those in control of 3ABN are teaching now. Would you like this TV network to work against our God?

Johann, I am surprised by this as I haven't seen it myself. I'm not saying it isn't happening, just that I'm surprised. I would like to know who is preaching this, how and where! Do you have examples?

It would be awful to have this network working against our God!

[country bumpkin]

Dearest Bumpkin,

Whereas you seem to have not lived through 3ABN, as we have, Your opinions are interesting, but don't carry the weight of experience and personal knowledge, as do ours. I am happy for you that you seem to not have personal acquiantance with Danny Shelton. May you forever avoid such a horrifying experience.

Dear Beartrap,
Thank you for the greeting, but how do I know that you are not of the same character, if given a chance at such power? It’s true that I don’t know Danny, but I also don’t know you. Would you be able to guarantee that there is no one in your life that would not talk about you in such a negative way if given the chance? “Pride goes before destruction and a haughty spirit before the fall.” If placed in the same circumstances can you guarantee that your pride would not be exalted? I don’t think so. As a matter of fact, it probably would have happened sooner. That’s why Danny and Linda were “called” and we weren’t. And yes, I do believe they was called. Why? Because I knew some of the old times who were the original investors. And trust me, (if you dare) they were not the gullible types. They were and are depression era folk who held on to their money and no one but the Lord would convince them to part with as much of their funds as they did in order to get the ministry started.

So I do believe Danny and Linda became proud and this is the result. But I also believe that, given the same circumstance, we would have been worse.

CB

[watchbird]

Johann said, "Pray that 3ABN will remain an SDA institution and not one who preaches the church is Babylon, like som of those in control of 3ABN are teaching now. Would you like this TV network to work against our God?"

Johann, I am surprised by this as I haven't seen it myself. I'm not saying it isn't happening, just that I'm surprised. I would like to know who is preaching this, how and where! Do you have examples?

It would be awful to have this network working against our God!

PB, Even from the beginning 3abn has positioned itself as being the judge of the church rather than as the helper of the church. At times the influences Johann mentions above have been less, and sometimes more, but they have always been there. If you will read the "Unauthorized History" threads carefully you will find references to some of this..... though here, as in every other area, all of us who are posting have been very selective and sparse in detail.

As an aid to finding specific information I constructed a "Guided Tour" to the history threads .... and Calvin posted it as an additional post in the thread in the Pinned section, which Clay had begun earlier. Since that has brief notations on it, you can scan down that one post to find specific topics. In this case look for references to Kenny Shelton, since he is the Shelton brother who was defrocked by the Adventist church because of the way he was doing exactly what Johann described above (as well as being closely linked with other "Independent Ministries" of like mind). But even though his Adventist credentials were removed, Kenny remained as pastor of his "offshoot" church, and was also on the outs with Danny for several years. As of last August, he returned to 3abn and is now being featured prominently as one of their speakers..... as well as traveling on some of their promotional tours. Both Beartrap and Sister posted specifically and descriptively of this, and perhaps others added to it. This is not to say that Kenny is the only one there who is of this ilk. But if you find posts about him, you will likely find others that bear on these concerns in the same general vicinity.

As to the present concerns that have been expressed that 3abn would be taken over..... or given over...... to one or more of the non-Adventist persons who hold high positions there (or to those who have but a thin veneer of Adventist doctrine on top of their previous Charismatic/Pentecostal belief systems) thus gradually taking it further away from being truly "Adventist"...... these have also been voiced in the History threads as well as elsewhere on this site. Look especially for references to Mollie Steensen and Shelly Quinn. It would also be well for you to examine the 3ABN website (newly designed early summer 2005) and note that they do not identify themselves as a supporting ministry of the Adventist church. They don't even identify themselves as an "Independent Ministry" of the Adventist church.

They plainly state there that. "3ABN is not owned, operated or funded by any church, denomination or organization, so people from all cultures and backgrounds appreciate 3ABN programming. Many of 3ABN's employees and volunteers are members of the Seventh-day Adventist Church."

As you read the Unauthorized History threads, also note what has been said about the Pentecostal influences at 3ABN.... not only now, but from the very beginning. Adventists were largely ignorant of the facts that there were so many Pentecostals ...... even former Pentecostal ministers..... who have exerted a great deal of influence on the thought patterns taught by 3ABN employees.

And on the other hand..... look for those things which give some glimpses of the contentions between 3ABN and Adventist church leaders. Some of those you will also find in the "Guided Tour".... in some cases as links to specific posts in other threads.

[watchbird]

Dear Beartrap,
Thank you for the greeting, but how do I know that you are not of the same character, if given a chance at such power? It’s true that I don’t know Danny, but I also don’t know you. Would you be able to guarantee that there is no one in your life that would not talk about you in such a negative way if given the chance? “Pride goes before destruction and a haughty spirit before the fall.” If placed in the same circumstances can you guarantee that your pride would not be exalted? I don’t think so. As a matter of fact, it probably would have happened sooner. That’s why Danny and Linda were “called” and we weren’t. And yes, I do believe they was called. Why? Because I knew some of the old times who were the original investors. And trust me, (if you dare) they were not the gullible types. They were and are depression era folk who held on to their money and no one but the Lord would convince them to part with as much of their funds as they did in order to get the ministry started.

So I do believe Danny and Linda became proud and this is the result. But I also believe that, given the same circumstance, we would have been worse.

CB

Bear is not one to defend himself..... and while he calls himself a "beartrap"..... a moniker such as "Gentle Ben" would have been much more appropriate. When it comest to standing for truth, however, Bear does indeed have all the tenacity and unyeildingness of a beartrap's tempered steel when it comes to standing for what is right..... no matter what it may cost to do so.

But of course you don't know me either, so maybe my witness to his character traits will be meaningless to you. So what I would suggest that you do is to get better acquainted with him through his extensive posting here on BSDA. If you click on his name, you will be taken to his "Viewing Profile". Once there, look to the right of the screen, and click on "Profile Options", and then choose "Find member's posts". You will next be confronted by a number of post excerpts..... which are listed in the order of "most recent first". (I don't know if it is possible to change this order or not.) In Bear's case, there will be many pages of such posts. So to start from the beginning, you will need to go to the very last page and the very last post on the page and work your way from the beginning to the end. Read carefully. You will find some things that may surprise you..... and I think that surely, once you read through all of those you will realize that no one could post that much over that long a period of time unless they were genuinely what they seem to be.

The thing about Bear is that he seldom talks about what it has cost him to "stand for the right though the heavens fall". And search as you will, you will find no more than a faint glimmer of insight into what he has endured..... and still has to endure. But I think there is enough here so you can see why it is that "when Beartrap speaks..... we listen" .... to quote an old TV ad that you just might be too young to even remember.

As to your other comments .... it is very possible that you will feel the need to change some of your "beliefs" in the near future. So I'd suggest that you speak very cautiously of them and give more thought to what others on here "believe" and why we believe it. And perhaps you could give a little more weight to those who speak from experience, and a little less to opinions you have formed from watching some actors on a TV screen.

And if you want to speak privately about these matters, you are welcome to PM me.