A Viewer's Version, Another side of the story Options

[country bumpkin]

Is the book a EW compilation?

The book does have quite a few quotes, but it is not a compilation. The author is telling her story of how she had been raised in a good Adventist Home and how she and her husband were both missionaries and had be workers for the Lord. One day, her father realized at the age of 78 that he hadn't overcome, and that having fought the good fight of faith all his life, he was not ready to meet his Savior in peace. She goes on to say that when he asked her for help, she had no answers for him. That shocked her so much that she and her husband went on a search and this is what they found.

[PeacefulBe]

A Little “Food For Thought”!

Evilspeaking is a twofold curse, falling more heavily upon the speaker than upon the hearer. He who scatters the seeds of dissension and strife reaps in his own soul the deadly fruits. How miserable is the talebearer, the surmiser of evil! He is a stranger to true happiness.--5T 176. {VSS 139.2}
Oh, how much time is worse than wasted by evilspeaking. Because of this sin, not half is accomplished that might be accomplished. Men and women become mischief makers for Satan, and, going to this one and that one, place in their minds the leaven of evil, prejudicing them against a brother or a sister who, they say, has done wrong. The thoughts of those thus influenced are disturbed, their peace is destroyed, and their confidence in their brethren is weakened. {18MR 198.1}
Those who do this evil work are departing from Christ to follow one who is teaching them to love and make a lie. Whatever their position in the service of God, they are dishonoring Him, and Christ says to them, "I have somewhat against thee, because thou hast left thy first love." All their qualifications and capabilities, however commendable they may apparently be, will not supply the deficiency resulting from the lack of Christ like love. {18MR 198.2}
I feel so saddened, so discouraged, by the thought that my brethren are willing to listen to and circulate hearsay. I know that the Spirit of God will not cooperate with those who, by their criticisms, their evil-surmising, and their hardheartedness are helping Satan. God says to them, "Thou hast left thy first love. . . . Repent, and do the first works; or else I will come unto thee quickly," that is, "I will not bear long with your perverse spirit, which leads you to cherish envy and evil-surmising." {18MR 198.3}
Seeds of Doubt a Service of Satan--Let us guard against speaking words that discourage. Let us resolve never to engage in evilspeaking and backbiting. Let us refuse to serve Satan by implanting seeds of doubt. Let us guard against cherishing unbelief, or expressing it to others. Many, many times I have wished that there might be circulated a pledge containing a solemn promise to speak only those words that are pleasing to God. There is as great need for such a pledge as there is for one against the use of intoxicating liquor. Let us begin to discipline the tongue, remembering always that we can do this only by disciplining the mind, for "out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaketh." Matt. 12:34.--OHC 291. {VSS 158.2}

If you will notice, she did not qualify this by saying that it was alright if the things that were being said were true.

CB, I agree that these quotes speak clearly to those who are gossiping, using hearsay, lies and evil surmising. I have even seen some of this very type gossip posted here. And as I said earlier, Calvin and Clay generally come on and give some gentle words of rebuke to direct away from such statements. What I disagree with is your statement that she did not qualify these even if they were true. She is clearly speaking of hearsay, lies and evil surmisings that are intended to destroy someone's reputation. That's how I read these wonderful statements anyway.

[country bumpkin]

Peacfully,
I can’t dispute that as I am not an extensive reader of Sis White. What I have found though is that she has admonished us to go to the individual, the again with one or two others and then to the church. If that does not get the desired affect, we are to treat the person as a heathen and a publican, Matthew 18. She does not instruct us to broadcast their sins to all that will listen. I don’t know if you noticed in the second quote what she said, but it seems to me that she is saying that not only does it do damage to the speaker, but to the hearer. The thoughts of those thus influenced are disturbed, their peace is destroyed…

I found that happening to me. Not only that, I found my anxiety level increased when I say that certain people had posted to the site. It wasn’t until I read the quote that I understood why.

[PeacefulBe]

Peacfully,
I can’t dispute that as I am not an extensive reader of Sis White. What I have found though is that she has admonished us to go to the individual, the again with one or two others and then to the church. If that does not get the desired affect, we are to treat the person as a heathen and a publican, Matthew 18. She does not instruct us to broadcast their sins to all that will listen. I don’t know if you noticed in the second quote what she said, but it seems to me that she is saying that not only does it do damage to the speaker, but to the hearer. The thoughts of those thus influenced are disturbed, their peace is destroyed…

I found that happening to me. Not only that, I found my anxiety level increased when I say that certain people had posted to the site. It wasn’t until I read the quote that I understood why.

CB, I understand what you are saying. It would be interesting to see what Sister White would make of the internet and the technology we have today as opposed to back at the turn of the century!

[lurker]

Some of Sister White's rebukes were published and sent out so everyone could read them. We are supposed to learn from others' mistakes and not repeat them. She was very blunt about Kellogg and others. Was this evil speaking or bearing a straight testimony?

This is a public forum and Danny and his people are free to read what is here and to tell their side of things. It is hardly talking about them behind their backs. I frankly think she would use the internet and every other means to keep the church on course.

[husbandoftheyear]

Those folks who judged me saw the facts:
1. I had spent the weekend alone with a person of the opposite sex
2. The man had a reputation for being promiscuous (a fact I was not privy to, tho I was later to find out that most Peace Corps of the era were doing the same thing)
3. Therefore, I must be having sex with the man.

I have to disagree here PB.

Your first point was the fact
Your second point was only fact to some who had more information about this man.
Your third point was an assumption.


An example:

Women have brown hair.
John has brown hair.
John must a woman
I think not!

As the accusations are hurtled at Linda stating that phone card records show she spoke on the phone with Dr. Abrahamsen, how about requesting Danny's Verizon mobile phone records for 618-218-**** showing how many hours he spent on the phone with Brenda's 865-776-**** mobile phone during that very same period of time. Seems that what applies to the goose should apply to the gander, shouldn't it?

How could you say such a thing, Bear. And here I thought you to be a logical man!

The implementation of said rules only applies to geese that fly with the flock, not those up on the mountain alone with God.

[country bumpkin]

Some of Sister White's rebukes were published and sent out so everyone could read them. We are supposed to learn from others' mistakes and not repeat them. She was very blunt about Kellogg and others. Was this evil speaking or bearing a straight testimony?

This is a public forum and Danny and his people are free to read what is here and to tell their side of things. It is hardly talking about them behind their backs. I frankly think she would use the internet and every other means to keep the church on course.

Well, Lurker,
I’m glad to know that Sonshineonme and the crew were call of God as his special messenger to expose the dirty linen in the 3ABN ministry. If I recall correctly, the only reason Sis White heavily exposed Dr. Kellogg was because he was spreading heresy. Correct me if I’m wrong, but she was not going into details about his life or other aspects of his operations of the Sanitarium. She did warn him as to what would happen if he did not downsize and have smaller institutions in multiple locations. I know she also gave that information to the leaders of the church, but to the best of my knowledge, she did not start a letter writing campaign (internet) to combat anything he did. The only thing she openly fought was his promoting pantheism.

CB

[PeacefulBe]

Some of Sister White's rebukes were published and sent out so everyone could read them. We are supposed to learn from others' mistakes and not repeat them. She was very blunt about Kellogg and others. Was this evil speaking or bearing a straight testimony?

This is a public forum and Danny and his people are free to read what is here and to tell their side of things. It is hardly talking about them behind their backs. I frankly think she would use the internet and every other means to keep the church on course.

I agree!

I have to disagree here PB.

Your first point was the fact
Your second point was only fact to some who had more information about this man.
Your third point was an assumption.
An example:

Women have brown hair.
John has brown hair.
John must a woman
I think not!

HOTY, this was exactly my point - taking one irrefutable fact and ending up with an assumption that masquerades as a factual conclusion! Thanks for seeing it!

This is what we all need to take care to avoid.

[lurker]

Sister White did indeed give very intimate detail of the lives of some whom she gave testimonies to and their identities were not always hidden to protect them from embarrassment. I know you are bein cynical when you speak of Sunshineonme and crew being called to expose dirty linen in the 3ABN ministry but hey, if the dirty linen wasn't there, nobody could have exposed a thing. I too am glad to know they were at the call of God.

It was not just because of pantheism that Sister White struggled against Kellogg. He was on an ego trip and was intent on enlarging the San and the work at Battle Creek when this work was supposed to be spread instead into new areas. He wanted his large extravagant and grandiose projects to go forward. HIS PROJECTS. Lets see now, I believe that Danny wanted to find the ark of the covenant. I heard him say that he wanted to produce a hollywood type religious movie, to have an old folks home or retirement type community whose residents could do volunteer work at 3ABN, to set up a sanctuary etc, etc etc. Can anyone add another project that you have heard him mention?

And I believe watchbird is concerned about pentecostalism taking hold at 3ABN.

I firmly believe that Danny is the Omega of the thing of which Kellogg was the Alpha.

[sonshineonme]

Peacfully,
I can’t dispute that as I am not an extensive reader of Sis White. What I have found though is that she has admonished us to go to the individual, the again with one or two others and then to the church. If that does not get the desired affect, we are to treat the person as a heathen and a publican, Matthew 18. She does not instruct us to broadcast their sins to all that will listen. I don’t know if you noticed in the second quote what she said, but it seems to me that she is saying that not only does it do damage to the speaker, but to the hearer. The thoughts of those thus influenced are disturbed, their peace is destroyed…

I found that happening to me. Not only that, I found my anxiety level increased when I say that certain people had posted to the site. It wasn’t until I read the quote that I understood why.

If you are uncomfortable with knowing the details and happenings at an independant mininstry that affects us all in more negative ways by it's very existance then people realize, and it will get worse, then you should not stay and read here. Many people, and you may or may not be one of them, would rather not know things that are going on - I for one would not like to be one that was deceived and minipulated to give my hard earned money to them so they could mis-use it (that is putting it VERY nicely). I have very strong opinons about people being minipulated, lied too, and made to think through word pictures that certain things are true when they are clearly false. Do you like that? Would you be happy knowing that people KNEW and did nothing? Would you be happy knowing that not only people knew, but did nothing about it for the WRONG reasons? Some people are happier with their "head in the sand" thinking - they don't like their uptopia destroyed. They would rather make their "judgements" and be done with it. That to me makes you more of a target for deceiption then to openly talk and discuss very serious issues that are among us - and 3abn is one of those. You really have no idea how serious it is - but if you would put your concerns into prayer, and ask God to show you what you can learn from these times and situations, maybe you would find more them just "anxiety" from hearing things that aren't so pleasant. JMO, of course.

[Lucyladye]

Well, Lurker,
I’m glad to know that Sonshineonme and the crew were call of God as his special messenger to expose the dirty linen in the 3ABN ministry. If I recall correctly, the only reason Sis White heavily exposed Dr. Kellogg was because he was spreading heresy. Correct me if I’m wrong, but she was not going into details about his life or other aspects of his operations of the Sanitarium. She did warn him as to what would happen if he did not downsize and have smaller institutions in multiple locations. I know she also gave that information to the leaders of the church, but to the best of my knowledge, she did not start a letter writing campaign (internet) to combat anything he did. The only thing she openly fought was his promoting pantheism.

CB

I could be wrong CB, but I don't think they had internet in her day.

[husbandoftheyear]

I agree!
HOTY, this was exactly my point - taking one irrefutable fact and ending up with an assumption that masquerades as a factual conclusion! Thanks for seeing it!

This is what we all need to take care to avoid.

I believe people see what they want to see. I'm sorry if your reputation was affected by this!

[country bumpkin]

I could be wrong CB, but I don't think they had internet in her day.

That's why the ()

[country bumpkin]

Sonshineonme and “Sister and crew”,

I know I owe you an apology for targeting you in these last few postings. I shouldn’t have done so and I am sorry. In my heart I try to excuse myself because of how I felt reading you messages, but I know that is no excuse. I found myself falling into the same trap I was disapproving of.

I’m sorry. Please forgive me.

Country Bumpkin

P.S. I know this sounds a bit staged. When I read it, I felt that way at least, but hey, apologizing is not one of my strong suits. I’m going to have to start my book all over again.

CB

[howdy]

If you are uncomfortable with knowing the details and happenings at an independant mininstry that affects us all in more negative ways by it's very existance then people realize, and it will get worse, then you should not stay and read here. Many people, and you may or may not be one of them, would rather not know things that are going on - I for one would not like to be one that was deceived and minipulated to give my hard earned money to them so they could mis-use it (that is putting it VERY nicely). I have very strong opinons about people being minipulated, lied too, and made to think through word pictures that certain things are true when they are clearly false. Do you like that? Would you be happy knowing that people KNEW and did nothing? Would you be happy knowing that not only people knew, but did nothing about it for the WRONG reasons? Some people are happier with their "head in the sand" thinking - they don't like their uptopia destroyed. They would rather make their "judgements" and be done with it. That to me makes you more of a target for deceiption then to openly talk and discuss very serious issues that are among us - and 3abn is one of those. You really have no idea how serious it is - but if you would put your concerns into prayer, and ask God to show you what you can learn from these times and situations, maybe you would find more them just "anxiety" from hearing things that aren't so pleasant. JMO, of course.

How about the flip side of the Kellog saga? Perhaps it was a power struggle for control and the Shelton thing the same.

howdy