Assault On Danny Shelton, horses, horses and more horses Options

[PeacefulBe]

So let me understand this, your statement that it isn't conjecture is all anyone needs - nothing else is necessary? "Sister" says it isn't conjecture - therefore it isn't. I can't see that holding much weight with other than the faithful here.

A request for supportive evidence - something that will make your word credible - is off limits, or so it would seem as you keep avoiding this.

- fhb
Shall I post a series of laughing smiley faces to make my point? Interesting how there is so much written to claim you are not Linda S. or her proxy and yet, as you did once before in suggesting I was Danny because I requested more than your word, you suggest I am Larry W. So for all the guests reading this - nope, I am not Danny, nor am I Larry. And, isn't Larry a member of the board as opposed to an employee of 3ABN (at least that is the way I find in print.)

Again, your word isn't substantial enough for me, and possibly more who read here - either there is a way to substantiate your word, or there isn't. If there is and your claim is supported and verifiable then there is a issue needing redress. However, if there isn't then it would seem another red herring in an attempt to continue casting aspersions on the people at 3ABN.

Can you or can you not substantiate your accusations? And if you can but choose to keep it reserved, for whatever reason, how is that different than 3ABN saying it has "evidence" but refusing to share it with everyone who requests it?

- fhb

The lengthy silence after this back-and-forth is somewhat puzzling to me. FHB, you make some solid points here.

I believe that if there is not first-hand knowledge of an assault, reporting it is merely hearsay and would tend to make a thoughtful person wonder about motive. To ask others to accept it as fact without "substantiation" should only work with those who have a certain amount of gullability.

When I first started reading and posting here I innocently pushed somebody's paranoia button with a question and was swiftly accused of possibly being Danny Shelton. It caused me to giggle and brought a slightly more off-color reaction from my husband. It also caused me, as someone seriously and honestly looking for the truth in this situation, quite a bit of concern about the spirit that sometimes lashes out here.

The words we use are so important. Proverbs 19:9 says:

"A false witness will not go unpunished, and he who pours out lies will perish."

I'm not accusing anyone of lying or bearing false witness. I feel confident that some things I have learned here are truthful. There are other things I'm not sure of because there isn't any substantiation. There are conclusions that have been drawn that I don't think are supported by the evidence given. Thought is an individual process. What is wrong with that?

[sister]

So let me understand this, your statement that it isn't conjecture is all anyone needs - nothing else is necessary? "Sister" says it isn't conjecture - therefore it isn't. I can't see that holding much weight with other than the faithful here.

A request for supportive evidence - something that will make your word credible - is off limits, or so it would seem as you keep avoiding this.

- fhb
Shall I post a series of laughing smiley faces to make my point? Interesting how there is so much written to claim you are not Linda S. or her proxy and yet, as you did once before in suggesting I was Danny because I requested more than your word, you suggest I am Larry W. So for all the guests reading this - nope, I am not Danny, nor am I Larry. And, isn't Larry a member of the board as opposed to an employee of 3ABN (at least that is the way I find in print.)

Again, your word isn't substantial enough for me, and possibly more who read here - either there is a way to substantiate your word, or there isn't. If there is and your claim is supported and verifiable then there is a issue needing redress. However, if there isn't then it would seem another red herring in an attempt to continue casting aspersions on the people at 3ABN.

Can you or can you not substantiate your accusations? And if you can but choose to keep it reserved, for whatever reason, how is that different than 3ABN saying it has "evidence" but refusing to share it with everyone who requests it?

- fhb

1. I do not believe that you are Danny, nor have I ever seriously entertained that as a possibility, I know Danny's writing style and it is not the same as yours.

2. You are incorrect about Larry Welch, he is both an employee at 3ABN for many years and a member of the 3ABN Board. His current position is in the pastoral department, which you can verify quite easily on the 3ABN website. His 3ABN salary for 2005 was $40,989.00 not including perks. His salary is greater than the salary of Johnny Dinzey, head of the pastoral department and manager of 3ABN Latino and Larry is merely a member of the pastoral department. Larry Welch's salary has been stable at around $40,000.00 for a number of years, which is far above that of the average 3ABN employee (circa $15,000.00 per year). Why?

3. As far as the information concerning spousal abuse that came directly from the victim. If she chooses to substantiate what she has said privately in a signed affidavit it is her choice. As fas as corroborating testimony goes, who invites a third person to witness the abuse of their spouse? That only leaves the abuser for corroboration. I am certain that those familiar with spousal abuse will agree that the abuser seldom, if ever, is willing to claim responsibility for their actions.

[Ralph]

Thank you, Ralph. You do understand!

You are very welcome, Fran. I know a lot and I care a lot. I am one of the guys in the trenches who is often the primary responder when a woman looks for help. Just last night I had a call from a woman who had to leave home. I listened to her story through her sobs. I know the basic script for I have heard it told so often, but she needed to talk. She needed to know that I was a safe person and she needed affirmation that her decision to leave was correct. She will have emotional and financial support for she has grown children who are concerned and will be there for her. Many women are not that fortunate.

3. As far as the information concerning spousal abuse that came directly from the victim. If she chooses to substantiate what she has said privately in a signed affidavit it is her choice. As fas as corroborating testimony goes, who invites a third person to witness the abuse of their spouse? That only leaves the abuser for corroboration. I am certain that those familiar with spousal abuse will agree that the abuser seldom, if ever, is willing to claim responsibility for their actions.

Right on, Sister! It burns me when FHB and others want first hand documented proof for everything that is said. They do not accept the testimony of people in the know. Doesn't he realize that some of us who have experience in this tragic area are the ones who know how to put the pieces of the puzzle together?

What is incomprehensible to some readers is that all forms of abuse are also present among the affluent and respected families in our society.

[Skyhook]

I just figured that FHB must be a very important person with a tremendous amount of clout to be able to demand documentation and proof for what someone says as if he had a personal stake or responsibility in the situation. Otherwise in most situations he would be kindly but firmly and in a Christlike way to perhaps find something else to do. Or in another context, he would be told something similar in quite an unkindly and graphic way.

[caribbean sda]

I just figured that FHB must be a very important person with a tremendous amount of clout to be able to demand documentation and proof for what someone says as if he had a personal stake or responsibility in the situation.

...just a tremendous amount of doubt...but that's his prerogative I would imagine...

[princessdi]

I agree, Skyhook. He is spending way too much time trying to get Sister to "show her hand". Somebody needs to know who Sister is and needs to know it now. I have had a bad feeling about him from the beginning, which I believed I voiced at the time. He came in trying to identify everyone. In the words of Han Solo/Indianan Jones, "I got a bad feeling about this."

I just figured that FHB must be a very important person with a tremendous amount of clout to be able to demand documentation and proof for what someone says as if he had a personal stake or responsibility in the situation. Otherwise in most situations he would be kindly but firmly and in a Christlike way to perhaps find something else to do. Or in another context, he would be told something similar in quite an unkindly and graphic way.

[Skyhook]

Another thought I had is that in my experience on certain other forums, (although relatively limited) I have encountered people who seem to enjoy arguing and debating just for the sake of it. No matter what point or statement someone makes, they will come up with something contrary. If they cant, they demand chapter and verse, or specific SOP quote as if they were some kind of authority and people must comply with thier demands. I think some people join forums to pursue thier hobby of argumentation and debate.

[fallible humanbe...]

1. I do not believe that you are Danny, nor have I ever seriously entertained that as a possibility, I know Danny's writing style and it is not the same as yours.

This may be true enough, and having seen many posts responding to my inquires it is entirely possible that you didn’t, however others did as well as claim I was in 3ABN employ, or a plant, or the mouthpiece for Danny, yada, yada, yada. Now, Larry Welch, hhhmm, wish I still had that much hair.

2. You are incorrect about Larry Welch, he is both an employee at 3ABN for many years and a member of the 3ABN Board. His current position is in the pastoral department, which you can verify quite easily on the 3ABN website. His 3ABN salary for 2005 was $40,989.00 not including perks. His salary is greater than the salary of Johnny Dinzey, head of the pastoral department and manager of 3ABN Latino and Larry is merely a member of the pastoral department. Larry Welch's salary has been stable at around $40,000.00 for a number of years, which is far above that of the average 3ABN employee (circa $15,000.00 per year). Why?

I am not sure why you have made such a soap box of salaries of late, nor how you are privy to so much current financial information. I don't care what he makes. If he is employed there, then so be it.

3. As far as the information concerning spousal abuse that came directly from the victim. If she chooses to substantiate what she has said privately in a signed affidavit it is her choice. As fas as corroborating testimony goes, who invites a third person to witness the abuse of their spouse? That only leaves the abuser for corroboration. I am certain that those familiar with spousal abuse will agree that the abuser seldom, if ever, is willing to claim responsibility for their actions.

And now to the point of the matter. A poster, as I am sure was the reaction of other readers as well, sees an accusation that an employee and Board Member of 3ABN is a known wife abuser and voices concern over the severity of such a comment and wonders whether it is a truthful allegation or mere conjecture. You respond with, "It isn't conjecture." with all the assumption that nothing else is necessary than your pronouncement. Quite honestly that has a rather arrogant quality to it. Others chime in in your behalf that it is odd that another member of the forum is pursuing this, I must have a vested interest they speculate or I am trying to get you, "sister", to play a hand which will reveal your "true identity."

Quite honestly I can go to my grave never knowing who you truly are and be fine. Personally if you are not Linda S., then I do not believe that you are not getting your information from Linda S., at least through someone else enabling you to truthfully claim to not be communicating with her or getting your information from her - there is a disingenuousness in some of your postings that doesn't sit well with my skepticism which is why I continue to challenge you and others here. This doesn't mean I haven't found some things here to hold significant factual weight, instead it means I won't stop asking questions or challenging you until I am satisfied. I think this may be problematic however, because it seems to bother you that I just won't acquiesce and side with you accepting your ever word as gospel.

So my questions would continue this way. It seems as if you are claiming to have the word of the individual themselves, was this information shared with you first hand, or are you taking anthers word for it?

Were you given the authority to share such charges in a public forum?

If you have received it through a second, third, fourth party, have you corroborated it in any way?

- fhb

This post has been edited by fallible humanbeing: Nov 3 2006, 10:04 AM

[Skyhook]

FHB might just as well put Esq. after his name. Licensed to practice law in Illinois? Office in Chicago? Just guessing.

[husbandoftheyear]

Is there or isn't there? If there isn't then it is heresay and/or conjecture, possibly bordering on slander.

What about a sworn affidavit and coroborating testimony?

- fhb

blah, blah, blah

[sonshineonme]

blah, blah, blah

I love you HOTY!! LOL!!

[PeacefulBe]

FHB might just as well put Esq. after his name. Licensed to practice law in Illinois? Office in Chicago? Just guessing.

If FHB is an attorney, what of it? Any thinking person should not accept what another says without being certain it is the truth.

blah, blah, blah

Please, HOTY, don't devalue your credibility with folks anxious to find the truth by careless remarks. This is all very serious stuff and deserves to be carefully discussed and viewed from all angles. Right?

[Truly Blonde]

I think-maybe. Don't know if this means anything and I am sure others have checked this out before. I went to members and looked up fallible humanbeing and the information there says he is a member of the Florida Hospital Church. I don't know if Calvin can tell if people are telling the truth when they give out information. However if it is the truth I think fhb is connected with the medical work. Maybe he is the pastor of the Florida Hospital Church. Just a thought. Maybe he is truly trying to find out the truth-or-again maybe he is connected to Danny some other way. Does anyone know if there are Shelton relatives in the Orlando area?

Now back to your scheduled program of Assault on Danny Shelton or Horses, Horses and more Horses.

[Skyhook]

Whatever he is, he seems to be someone who trys to get what he wants by making demands, being aggressive and trying to intimidate. It seems to me to be a little beyond just seeking the truth.

[husbandoftheyear]

Please, HOTY, don't devalue your credibility with folks anxious to find the truth by careless remarks. This is all very serious stuff and deserves to be carefully discussed and viewed from all angles. Right?

According to FHB, I would have no credibility without posting my picture, social security number, and income tax reports anyway!

FHB - like so many others on here - are asking for proof because they know that none can be given in many of these situations. He claims to be here to find the truth and ask questions. What he's really doing is trying to divide opinions and blow smoke up the rears of people who aren't close to the situation.

He claims to know writing styles of people he doesn't know and doesn't watch on television in the hopes of antagonizing Sister. He conveniently adds remarks about the inner workings of 3ABN while saying he hasn't been there and definitely hasn't worked there. I'm not saying he's Danny or a counterpart - like I said before - he's here to divide.

...and to contradict himself...