Save3abn Website Uses Blackmail Tactics, 3abn better not go to Court! |
Save3abn Website Uses Blackmail Tactics, 3abn better not go to Court! |
Feb 27 2007, 04:19 PM
Post
#106
|
|
500 + posts Group: Members Posts: 970 Joined: 16-December 06 Member No.: 2,683 Gender: f |
After comments made by a poster in another thread regarding the State of Illinois tax exemption case, I decided it was time to read it for myself. http://www.revenue.state.il.us/legalinform...s/pt/pt04-1.pdf There were a couple points that I think were of interest to some of the above discussions which for some reason neither of my browsers will let me quote at the moment. First. In the decision, the ALJ stated at the bottom of page 7 (item 16) that "Danny Shelton founded applicant in 1984". No such comment is made regarding Linda in the next item at the top of the next page. The decision refers to transcript pages of what must have been a hearing. I do not know if this was an accurate statement of the facts presented or was a point made at hearing. It is also correct that 4 people signed the incorporation documents and were listed as directors (which would have been to comply with the law regarding creating the legal entity). However, this would not be synonymous with the concept of "founder" as used above. I also thought it was most interesting that the ALJ made the following statements: "This case is not about applicant’s beliefs, contrary to what was asserted consistently at the hearing....." and "The case is also not about whether or not what the applicant is doing is good for people. " Reading the case and how the ALJ viewed the "religious" activities of 3abn as contrast to how the typical SDA may view the same activities was enlightening. nw -------------------- “I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen: not only because I see it, but because by it I see everything else.” C.S. Lewis
"To love means loving the unlovable. To forgive means pardoning the unpardonable. Faith means believing the unbelievable. Hope means hoping when everything seems hopeless." G. K. Chesterton |
|
|
Feb 27 2007, 05:27 PM
Post
#107
|
|
500 + posts Group: Members Posts: 696 Joined: 20-February 07 Member No.: 3,035 Gender: m |
Thanks for the link, nw. Just yesterday I was thinking of reviewing this case. There are several interesting points in the document. One is the function and priviledges of the president, w/o board review of approval. These kind priviledges, such as contracting and price setting, w/o board approval, are not normal in any legit organization, esp not for profit.
This one kind of popped out at me, having seen it discussed in AT.
-------------------- Disclaimer Notice: You are hereby cautioned that the information contained within these posts are for the sole purpose of provoking thought, adding fair comment on matters of public interest, and not providing factual information. These posts do not reflect the actual thoughts or intentions of the person writing under this username since said person is not in any position to know. No effort has been made to ensure the accuracy of any personal view, opinion, or hyperbole presented. Therefore, by disclosing, copying, or distributing these posts to others, such information must subsequently be confirmed in writing, signed and dated, by the actual person, or persons, posting behind username LaurenceD.
|
|
|
Feb 27 2007, 06:54 PM
Post
#108
|
|
500 + posts Group: Members Posts: 696 Joined: 20-February 07 Member No.: 3,035 Gender: m |
Here's some highlights for those who can stomach it.
***************** Applicant is advocating a way of life but it is a lifestyle that applicant favors, not a religion. there is discrepancy in the testimony of Linda Shelton. She stated she did not receive royalty payments for the CDs (Tr. pp. 595, 617) and later admitted that she did According to applicant’s 2001 financial statement, applicant’s assets have accumulated to over forty-two million dollars ($42,000,000), approximately three times the total revenue for 2001 of slightly under fourteen million dollars ($14,000,000). The income raised and accumulated by applicant has allowed it to purchase an airplane, a state-of-the art recording studio, and other audio/video production facilities and tools. The airplane is a business airplane that is used to promote the Shelton’s commercial enterprises and expand the target audience areas I must conclude from the evidence of record, that applicant is controlled by Danny and Linda Shelton, and all final decisions are made by them and not by a disinterested impartial board of directors. Applicant has failed to establish that it is not charging everyone that purchases or uses its products, facilities, and programs at prices above the cost of operation. On the contrary, these appear to be armslength transactions producing fees no different than a non-exempt business enterprise would generate. Programming and broadcasting are done for profit on this property, as clearly shown by applicant’s financial statements. The operation of 3ABN on the property in question generates a significant profit for applicant. The nature of applicant’s programming and CDs is the encouragement of a healthy lifestyle, for a price. Although there may be religious overtones in applicant’s use of the property, that is not sufficient to qualify for a religious property tax exemption. Were I to recommend a grant of tax exemption for the majority of the property at issue, which is clearly a commercial enterprise, it would give applicant an unfair commercial advantage over other commercially owned and operated radio and television stations. Applicant has accumulated sufficient wealth that it is currently in the process of setting up its own music label and has purchased additional properties for various uses not contemplated under the not-for-profit statutes. Applicant has, therefore, not established that it does not profit from the enterprise conducted on the subject property, a fatal flaw to its exemption claim. Applicant has not established that it conducts charitable activities when it clearly has the resources to extend the use of the property and equipment on the property to charitable and/or religious entities at no cost. The record does not indicate that it did so. Danny and Linda Shelton have control of applicant. They regulate the amount they are paid. They have control of programming. They regulate all contracts. Applicant uses this property to produce television programs, to sell equipment, radio and television time, and to sell merchandise, and, absent evidence to the contrary, sales are made at commercially competitive prices. For the aforementioned reasons it is recommended that Franklin County Parcel Index No. 174-116-11 remain on the tax rolls for the 2000 and 2001 assessment years and be assessed to the applicant, the owner thereof, except for the two pastor’s offices, each measuring 14 feet by 18 feet, on the second floor of the administrative production center building, and a corresponding amount of land. That area, I recommend, be granted a property tax exemption as used for religious purposes without a view to profit Barbara S. Rowe Administrative Law Judge January 28, 2004 -------------------- Disclaimer Notice: You are hereby cautioned that the information contained within these posts are for the sole purpose of provoking thought, adding fair comment on matters of public interest, and not providing factual information. These posts do not reflect the actual thoughts or intentions of the person writing under this username since said person is not in any position to know. No effort has been made to ensure the accuracy of any personal view, opinion, or hyperbole presented. Therefore, by disclosing, copying, or distributing these posts to others, such information must subsequently be confirmed in writing, signed and dated, by the actual person, or persons, posting behind username LaurenceD.
|
|
|
Feb 27 2007, 07:47 PM
Post
#109
|
|
Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 246 Joined: 10-January 07 Member No.: 2,794 Gender: m |
QUOTE(LaurenceD @ Feb 27 2007, 06:54 PM) [snapback]181090[/snapback] Here's some highlights for those who can stomach it. ***************** Applicant is advocating a way of life but it is a lifestyle that applicant favors, not a religion. there is discrepancy in the testimony of Linda Shelton. She stated she did not receive royalty payments for the CDs (Tr. pp. 595, 617) and later admitted that she did Barbara S. Rowe Administrative Law Judge January 28, 2004 Isn't this the same case that 3abn appealed and is in the court of appeals now? And isn't this the case that many sda leaders and leaders of other denominations were interested in because the outcome cold affect every church, church school, religious facility, christian networks, etc. etc. Also noted in this verdict was that Linda was every bit as responsible for any decisions made as Danny. Also as in any court case, there would hundreds maybe thousands of pages of testimony and evidence brought to the attention of the court that is not on this site, and of course never could be. So, my question is to you, how and why would you just pick out these few things that appears to make 3abn look bad? And then, by doing so, you make Linda look just as bad. |
|
|
Feb 27 2007, 08:02 PM
Post
#110
|
|
500 + posts Group: Members Posts: 696 Joined: 20-February 07 Member No.: 3,035 Gender: m |
Perhaps you would be so kind as to point out the most positive statements, if there are any, wwjd.
-------------------- Disclaimer Notice: You are hereby cautioned that the information contained within these posts are for the sole purpose of provoking thought, adding fair comment on matters of public interest, and not providing factual information. These posts do not reflect the actual thoughts or intentions of the person writing under this username since said person is not in any position to know. No effort has been made to ensure the accuracy of any personal view, opinion, or hyperbole presented. Therefore, by disclosing, copying, or distributing these posts to others, such information must subsequently be confirmed in writing, signed and dated, by the actual person, or persons, posting behind username LaurenceD.
|
|
|
Feb 27 2007, 08:21 PM
Post
#111
|
|
500 + posts Group: Members Posts: 894 Joined: 18-September 06 Member No.: 2,262 Gender: m |
QUOTE(LaurenceD @ Feb 27 2007, 06:54 PM) [snapback]181090[/snapback] Here's some highlights for those who can stomach it. ***************** Applicant is advocating a way of life but it is a lifestyle that applicant favors, not a religion. *snip* For the aforementioned reasons it is recommended that Franklin County Parcel Index No. 174-116-11 remain on the tax rolls for the 2000 and 2001 assessment years and be assessed to the applicant, the owner thereof, except for the two pastor’s offices, each measuring 14 feet by 18 feet, on the second floor of the administrative production center building, and a corresponding amount of land. That area, I recommend, be granted a property tax exemption as used for religious purposes without a view to profit Barbara S. Rowe Administrative Law Judge January 28, 2004 Wow. Thanks for the highlights. I tootled on over to the pdf site ... for those who have the time it might be worth reading in its entirety ... -------------------- "The entire world is falling apart because no one will admit they are wrong." -- Don Miller, Blue Like Jazz. |
|
|
Feb 27 2007, 08:33 PM
Post
#112
|
|
1,000 + posts Group: Members Posts: 2,756 Joined: 10-September 06 Member No.: 2,231 Gender: m |
This stuck out in my reading of this synopsis:
QUOTE I must conclude from the evidence of record, that applicant is controlled by Danny and Linda Shelton, and all final decisions are made by them and not by a disinterested impartial board of directors. Just as some have been saying, Danny rules, the board is there for looks (my words BTW) |
|
|
Feb 27 2007, 08:40 PM
Post
#113
|
|
500 + posts Group: Members Posts: 696 Joined: 20-February 07 Member No.: 3,035 Gender: m |
QUOTE(wwjd) And then, by doing so, you make Linda look just as bad. Wist ye not that justice is impartial? -------------------- Disclaimer Notice: You are hereby cautioned that the information contained within these posts are for the sole purpose of provoking thought, adding fair comment on matters of public interest, and not providing factual information. These posts do not reflect the actual thoughts or intentions of the person writing under this username since said person is not in any position to know. No effort has been made to ensure the accuracy of any personal view, opinion, or hyperbole presented. Therefore, by disclosing, copying, or distributing these posts to others, such information must subsequently be confirmed in writing, signed and dated, by the actual person, or persons, posting behind username LaurenceD.
|
|
|
Feb 27 2007, 09:07 PM
Post
#114
|
|
PrincessDrRe Group: Financial Donor Posts: 9,028 Joined: 8-November 04 Member No.: 712 Gender: f |
-------------------- *"Some folks use their ignorance like a umbrella. It covers everything, they perodically take it out from time to time, but it never is too far away from them."*
PrincessDrRe; March, 2007 ~"Blood = Meat, Face = Meat, Internal "Organs" = Meat - you can try to make it cuter; but it's still meat...."~ PrincessDrRe; September, 2007 *(NOTE: Any advice given by Re' Silvey, MSW is not to be taken as medical/mental health advice. Although trained to be a counselor, currently employed as a therapist, and currently pursuing her PhD in Counseling Psychology (ABD/I) - she is not your assigned therapist. Please consult a mental health professional of your choice for a face-to-face consultation.)* |
|
|
Feb 27 2007, 09:55 PM
Post
#115
|
|
Advanced Member Group: Financial Donor Posts: 334 Joined: 7-January 07 Member No.: 2,782 Gender: m |
QUOTE(wwjd @ Feb 27 2007, 05:47 PM) [snapback]181095[/snapback] Isn't this the same case that 3abn appealed and is in the court of appeals now? And isn't this the case that many sda leaders and leaders of other denominations were interested in because the outcome cold affect every church, church school, religious facility, christian networks, etc. etc. Also noted in this verdict was that Linda was every bit as responsible for any decisions made as Danny. Also as in any court case, there would hundreds maybe thousands of pages of testimony and evidence brought to the attention of the court that is not on this site, and of course never could be. So, my question is to you, how and why would you just pick out these few things that appears to make 3abn look bad? And then, by doing so, you make Linda look just as bad. WWJD, Guess what if it makes linda look bad, that is ok we all know linda and danny are sinners and make mistakes. we forgive those that mess up the same way that god forgives all of us when we mess if admit we have messed up. but all i hear from the danny camp is danny good and perfect linda bad and evil. Erik QUOTE(LaurenceD @ Feb 27 2007, 04:54 PM) [snapback]181090[/snapback] Here's some highlights for those who can stomach it. ***************** Applicant is advocating a way of life but it is a lifestyle that applicant favors, not a religion. there is discrepancy in the testimony of Linda Shelton. She stated she did not receive royalty payments for the CDs (Tr. pp. 595, 617) and later admitted that she did According to applicant’s 2001 financial statement, applicant’s assets have accumulated to over forty-two million dollars ($42,000,000), approximately three times the total revenue for 2001 of slightly under fourteen million dollars ($14,000,000). The income raised and accumulated by applicant has allowed it to purchase an airplane, a state-of-the art recording studio, and other audio/video production facilities and tools. The airplane is a business airplane that is used to promote the Shelton’s commercial enterprises and expand the target audience areas I must conclude from the evidence of record, that applicant is controlled by Danny and Linda Shelton, and all final decisions are made by them and not by a disinterested impartial board of directors. Applicant has failed to establish that it is not charging everyone that purchases or uses its products, facilities, and programs at prices above the cost of operation. On the contrary, these appear to be armslength transactions producing fees no different than a non-exempt business enterprise would generate. Programming and broadcasting are done for profit on this property, as clearly shown by applicant’s financial statements. The operation of 3ABN on the property in question generates a significant profit for applicant. The nature of applicant’s programming and CDs is the encouragement of a healthy lifestyle, for a price. Although there may be religious overtones in applicant’s use of the property, that is not sufficient to qualify for a religious property tax exemption. Were I to recommend a grant of tax exemption for the majority of the property at issue, which is clearly a commercial enterprise, it would give applicant an unfair commercial advantage over other commercially owned and operated radio and television stations. Applicant has accumulated sufficient wealth that it is currently in the process of setting up its own music label and has purchased additional properties for various uses not contemplated under the not-for-profit statutes. Applicant has, therefore, not established that it does not profit from the enterprise conducted on the subject property, a fatal flaw to its exemption claim. Applicant has not established that it conducts charitable activities when it clearly has the resources to extend the use of the property and equipment on the property to charitable and/or religious entities at no cost. The record does not indicate that it did so. Danny and Linda Shelton have control of applicant. They regulate the amount they are paid. They have control of programming. They regulate all contracts. Applicant uses this property to produce television programs, to sell equipment, radio and television time, and to sell merchandise, and, absent evidence to the contrary, sales are made at commercially competitive prices. For the aforementioned reasons it is recommended that Franklin County Parcel Index No. 174-116-11 remain on the tax rolls for the 2000 and 2001 assessment years and be assessed to the applicant, the owner thereof, except for the two pastor’s offices, each measuring 14 feet by 18 feet, on the second floor of the administrative production center building, and a corresponding amount of land. That area, I recommend, be granted a property tax exemption as used for religious purposes without a view to profit Barbara S. Rowe Administrative Law Judge January 28, 2004 Well i guess it goes to show you can make money and win souls to the truth, maybe the SDa church should study Dannys methods( i say this since linda ahas been kicked out) so the church can learn how to fund the work the church needs to do. By the way this ruling is just the type of thing i had in mind when i warned the 3 abn crowd that going to court does not always work out the way you think it will. erik |
|
|
Feb 27 2007, 10:10 PM
Post
#116
|
|
500 + posts Group: Members Posts: 696 Joined: 20-February 07 Member No.: 3,035 Gender: m |
QUOTE(erik) (i say this since linda ahas been kicked out) I heard on 3abn yesterday that the Kingdom of Heaven does not use the principle of force, but rather voluntary action. Forced to voluntarily leave, perhaps? Really have to rack your brain to think of something God didn't mention. QUOTE(erik) By the way this ruling is just the type of thing i had in mind when i warned the 3 abn crowd that going to court does not always work out the way you think it will. If your read this judgement summary carefully, you can plainly see it would be ill-advised to file an appeal. The only ones to benefit will likely be the lawyers. -------------------- Disclaimer Notice: You are hereby cautioned that the information contained within these posts are for the sole purpose of provoking thought, adding fair comment on matters of public interest, and not providing factual information. These posts do not reflect the actual thoughts or intentions of the person writing under this username since said person is not in any position to know. No effort has been made to ensure the accuracy of any personal view, opinion, or hyperbole presented. Therefore, by disclosing, copying, or distributing these posts to others, such information must subsequently be confirmed in writing, signed and dated, by the actual person, or persons, posting behind username LaurenceD.
|
|
|
Feb 27 2007, 10:47 PM
Post
#117
|
|
Advanced Member Group: Financial Donor Posts: 334 Joined: 7-January 07 Member No.: 2,782 Gender: m |
QUOTE(LaurenceD @ Feb 27 2007, 08:10 PM) [snapback]181116[/snapback] I heard on 3abn yesterday that the Kingdom of Heaven does not use the principle of force, but rather voluntary action. Forced to voluntarily leave, perhaps? Really have to rack your brain to think of something God didn't mention. If your read this judgement summary carefully, you can plainly see it would be ill-advised to file an appeal. The only ones to benefit will likely be the lawyers. you are correct. |
|
|
Feb 27 2007, 11:49 PM
Post
#118
|
|
500 + posts Group: Members Posts: 696 Joined: 20-February 07 Member No.: 3,035 Gender: m |
I'd like to read more of their by-laws. My impression is that they need to change their little form of gov't. It's way top heavy. Perhaps they wouldn't even consider a Separation of Powers Doctrine. It could improve their image though, vastly. Someone needs to prepare a small booklet called "Did You Know?" about the modus of operandi within the compound, and distribute it far and wide.
Now there's an idea for a best seller. I know many folks have no idea the corporation has assests probably well over the $42million of 2001, and charge local stations $1200 p/hour to downlink their programs. Probably more now. Plus, the corporation makes a profit of nearly a mil p/yr--at least in 2001--if I remember correctly. No wonder they don't seem to mind litigation. Study the budget, study the by-laws, study the personnel manual, study the comprhensive planning dept docs, study their building and land-use issues, but the most important? The budget. Follow the money. -------------------- Disclaimer Notice: You are hereby cautioned that the information contained within these posts are for the sole purpose of provoking thought, adding fair comment on matters of public interest, and not providing factual information. These posts do not reflect the actual thoughts or intentions of the person writing under this username since said person is not in any position to know. No effort has been made to ensure the accuracy of any personal view, opinion, or hyperbole presented. Therefore, by disclosing, copying, or distributing these posts to others, such information must subsequently be confirmed in writing, signed and dated, by the actual person, or persons, posting behind username LaurenceD.
|
|
|
Feb 27 2007, 11:55 PM
Post
#119
|
|
Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 178 Joined: 29-July 06 Member No.: 1,957 Gender: f |
LaurenceD, 3ABN is NOT paying for litigation out of any donated money that 3ABN has received from donors. It is being paid for by one person who has taken it upon himself/herself to pay for the whole litigation process.
|
|
|
Feb 28 2007, 12:08 AM
Post
#120
|
|
500 + posts Group: Members Posts: 696 Joined: 20-February 07 Member No.: 3,035 Gender: m |
Thanks Lee. That may be true. I'd have to look at the auditor's parting notes. Any related interfund revenues, professional services, or administrative service fees in the budget?
-------------------- Disclaimer Notice: You are hereby cautioned that the information contained within these posts are for the sole purpose of provoking thought, adding fair comment on matters of public interest, and not providing factual information. These posts do not reflect the actual thoughts or intentions of the person writing under this username since said person is not in any position to know. No effort has been made to ensure the accuracy of any personal view, opinion, or hyperbole presented. Therefore, by disclosing, copying, or distributing these posts to others, such information must subsequently be confirmed in writing, signed and dated, by the actual person, or persons, posting behind username LaurenceD.
|
|
|
Lo-Fi Version | Time is now: 27th March 2008 - 12:53 PM |