Jim Gilley Takes Over As President Options

[Ian]

Is there any truth to 3ABN employees having their computers, phones, copy machines tapped? I've understood that their is a system that is set up within which certain words trigger an internal surveillance system. Apparently, the employees are aware of this & it keeps them from discussing certain matters which are sensitive to the 3ABN leadership.

Can any of you shed light on this?

I went on a tour of the 3ABN facilities during campmeeting, lots did. I saw nothing like that. There was a camera over the reception desk showing it and the front door. The other doors to the building required a keycard, that seems to be the extent of their security. There were no secret rooms, nothing hidden, and nothing unusual.

I tend to think what you are asking about is not the case. If it was, HOTY would have been fired long ago, as many of his posts seem to have been made during work hours.

[Ian]

Indeed! Ian, will you please contact your sources at 3abn and ask them if what Bob Pickle is claiming to have been told is true - that the new 3abn President is not going to be dealing with stuff from the past?

What sources at 3ABN? Why would you think I have sources at 3ABN?

As far as what Mr Pickle claims Mr Gilley told him, well that seems reasonable to me.

Here's my thoughts about it.

For Mr Gilley to attempt to get involved in all the issues of the past would only muddy the waters and be a waste of time as it is already being taken care of. He also has day to day responsibilities and duties concerning the present and future of 3ABN now that take up alot of time I am sure, and that is where his time, energy and focus should be. Advancing the undiluted 3angels messages to the world to counteract the false and uplift our Savior before the world. During his Sabbath sermon at campmeeting he talked about the importance of keeping to 3ABN's original calling and mission and not losing focus (my paraphrase).

Mr Pickle's concerns and criticisms and accusations are already being taken care of in a court of law, it seems to be a wise decision to allow that to continue and get resolved by an uninvolved and impartial 3rd party.

From what I have read here, Mr Joy, Mr Pickle and even Linda Shelton have called for everything to be out in the open and for the evidence to be made known. Now it can and will be, and we will see what the truth is and what the evidence proves. I would think, after all the failed attempts previously (direct communication, ASI etc) that they would be happy that all can now lay their cards on the table.

Further, if I were Mr Gilley I would not want to go into all this with Mr Pickle either.

Others before him tried, Dr Thompson, Danny Shelton, etc. Their letters were published by Mr Pickle often in edited and abbreviated form, and their words and explanation in answer to his questions and concerns was twisted out of context and just used to condemn them, and make further accusations against 3ABN.

No matter what any have said to him in the past it has been taken in the worst possible way. That is my personal opinion after reading Mr Pickles letters to them, theirs in reply and then seeing how he interpreted and presented it here, on other forums, and on that National Enquirer type website he thinks is doing God's will. It is also my opinion after seeing all the letters he has posted that once anyone answers him , he hounds and harasses them, and has even uncovered posters identities here and harassed them. I know at least two who have posted that.

Look what Mr Pickle has written about Jim Gilley here already. He even said if Gilley wasn't going to follow his (Pickle's) agenda rather then the boards, that he should be fired.

That is my interpretation and not an exact quote, but it indicates an arrogance and inability to see anything but his own point of view to me, otherwise he wouldn't be demanding repentance and public apologies.

If Gilley did investigate the past and all the accusations here as Pickle wants and found them to be without merit, as others have,what would Pickle and the others here say about him and that?

That he is in Danny's back pocket, that he is biased, that he is involved in a cover up or lying, that he believes what Danny tells him and only gets his info from him, that he admits Danny misled him, or that he didn't properly investigate?

That seems likely to me, as those are the accusations which have been made against the others so far.

My conclusion is that Jim Gilley is in a no win situation, he is damned if he does and damned if he doesn't where Pickle is concerned. I believe he is wise to leave it to the courts, who can not be accused of such.


Let's be grateful all will be revealed, and proven in a court of law, and the liars and false accusations made known, so that we can all move on.

This post has been edited by Ian: Oct 3 2007, 07:31 AM

[PeacefulBe]

Ian,

While I appreciate you taking the time to go into such detail about your conclusions and opinions, the point of my question/request was to get verification or rebuttal of Bob Pickle's claim that Jim Gilley told him he would not be dealing with past issues. Since many of us here on the 3abn Forum of BlackSDA.com have taken the position of giving Jim Gilley the benefit of the doubt in how he is going to proceed as the new president of 3abn, this claim is a bit of a bombshell in that it has the appearance of dismissing the real concerns held by many. Some here are not as trusting as others that this law suit will definitively settle issues, because legal finagling has already been evident and some expect the winner may be the craftiest finagler, as is often the case in the judicial system.

I will continue to seek verification or rebuttal of Bob Pickle's claim and will bring that clarification back here for those who might desire it.

[princessdi]

Ian, you wouldn't see anything like that either, I know that the present company I owrk for does surveilance to the point of being able to see who is coming through the doors, in our Berkeley office from HQ in MD. We found out one day when my co worker was sayign that her card key did not work int he front door to the building. She never worried about it becuase she never came int hat door, However one day when we came back from lunch she wanted to try it and maybe ask to get another card key is it still didn't work. It didn't, however when she got to her desk she got a call from security in HQ informing her that they saw her and I coming in the door, her card not working and would see to her getting another one. We stil havent' seen a thing.

Same coworker was dismissed a couple of months ago. They were able to pull ALL of her phone calls, along with her emails, et. Still have not seen a thing.

Neither would you. 3ABN is not doing anything that most cojmpanies today aren't doing which is monitoring their employees comings and goings, emails and phone calls. They usually inform the employees, but the employees rarely can see the people or equipment used for surveilllnece. This is definitely not part of the tour.

I went on a tour of the 3ABN facilities during campmeeting, lots did. I saw nothing like that. There was a camera over the reception desk showing it and the front door. The other doors to the building required a keycard, that seems to be the extent of their security. There were no secret rooms, nothing hidden, and nothing unusual.

I tend to think what you are asking about is not the case. If it was, HOTY would have been fired long ago, as many of his posts seem to have been made during work hours.

[awesumtenor]

Any length of time on this board would tell a person that personally insulting awesum is a recipe for a red-hot reply.

Lukewarm reply... they get the chafing dish... not the blast furnace... if I gave the red-hot reply we'd be talking nebuchadnezzar-esque " seven times hotter than normal" instant incineration...

I don't agree with what he writes in such a matter but I think he already knows that.

I do, and I ask that you continue to pray my strength in the Lord; the Holy Ghost is still working on me as far as what to do when I've run out of cheeks to turn...

In His service,
Mr. J

[Ian]

Ian, you wouldn't see anything like that either, I know that the present company I owrk for does surveilance to the point of being able to see who is coming through the doors, in our Berkeley office from HQ in MD. We found out one day when my co worker was sayign that her card key did not work int he front door to the building. She never worried about it becuase she never came int hat door, However one day when we came back from lunch she wanted to try it and maybe ask to get another card key is it still didn't work. It didn't, however when she got to her desk she got a call from security in HQ informing her that they saw her and I coming in the door, her card not working and would see to her getting another one. We stil havent' seen a thing.

Same coworker was dismissed a couple of months ago. They were able to pull ALL of her phone calls, along with her emails, et. Still have not seen a thing.

Neither would you. 3ABN is not doing anything that most cojmpanies today aren't doing which is monitoring their employees comings and goings, emails and phone calls. They usually inform the employees, but the employees rarely can see the people or equipment used for surveilllnece. This is definitely not part of the tour.

How do you know I wouldn't see anything like that? How would you know what I saw and where I went on the tour I went on? I assure you I saw every single room, in the main building and even the sound studio etc. including the room with monitors from the security cameras, Danny's office covered in a wall of family pictures, mostly grandchildren, and the largest office which was formerly Linda's..

You speak here as if you know for a fact what you are saying.. How is that possible? Have you ever been to 3ABN, been on a tour there, or personally talked to any employed there?

Forgive me, and correct me if I am mistaken but I thought you previously posted somewhere that you hadn't, and don't know anyone personally , and don't or or didn't even watch 3ABN.

We should at least be able to agree that where you work and 3ABN are two different and unrelated places and organizations, and what one does is unrelated to the other.

Why do you think HOTY continues work at 3ABN and give his slanted reports if all that you say is going on? Does that make sense to you?

It doesn't to me.

[LaurenceD]

Some here are not as trusting as others that this law suit will definitively settle issues, because legal finagling has already been evident and some expect the winner may be the craftiest finagler, as is often the case in the judicial system.

I remember a case recently being reversed after the innocent party had spent 40 years in prision. So, even if 3abn loses the case, there's still hope.

They appear to be mixing spiritual guidance with legal aggression now after losing the last suit (Il. tax case), and apparently losing a former appeal. And, since they have appealed the Il. tax case, chances are they'll appeal this one if they lose. They seem unable to accept it when they are wrong. And with all the prayers and all those daily repeated affirmations, and their own spiritual guide at the compound, how can they be wrong?

What a wakeup call it can be sometimes when one comes out from under the cloud!

[watchbird]

Lukewarm reply... they get the chafing dish... not the blast furnace... if I gave the red-hot reply we'd be talking nebuchadnezzar-esque " seven times hotter than normal" instant incineration...
I do, and I ask that you continue to pray my strength in the Lord; the Holy Ghost is still working on me as far as what to do when I've run out of cheeks to turn...

In His service,
Mr. J

I have come to the studied conclusion that Mr J is of Irish heritage... evidence? He has a warm Irish heart, a better than Irish tenor voice.... and he loves to jig with the best of them.... BUT.... as the song so elequently says about Casey.....

Oh that Casey
Oh that Casey
Whenever he gets his Irish up
Casey lowers the boom..... boom... boom.... boom
Whenever he gets his Irish up
Casey lowers the boom....

............................

ps.... so sorry about your scarcity of cheeks, awesome.....

[LaurenceD]

There were no secret rooms, nothing hidden, and nothing unusual.

That's how princessdi knows. Duh!

What must the other tourists thought--you down on your kness, lifting every picture frame and mirror, taking apart every exhaust fan in the bathrooms, disassembling the light fixtures, examining all those wires in the soffits and attic spaces!

You must have done a better than the FBI could ever have dreamed of doing! Duh!

[Ian]

Ian,

While I appreciate you taking the time to go into such detail about your conclusions and opinions, the point of my question/request was to get verification or rebuttal of Bob Pickle's claim that Jim Gilley told him he would not be dealing with past issues. Since many of us here on the 3abn Forum of BlackSDA.com have taken the position of giving Jim Gilley the benefit of the doubt in how he is going to proceed as the new president of 3abn, this claim is a bit of a bombshell in that it has the appearance of dismissing the real concerns held by many. Some here are not as trusting as others that this law suit will definitively settle issues, because legal finagling has already been evident and some expect the winner may be the craftiest finagler, as is often the case in the judicial system.

I will continue to seek verification or rebuttal of Bob Pickle's claim and will bring that clarification back here for those who might desire it.

I don't know what else to tell you. You apparently think that Jim Gilley allowing the lawsuit against Pickle, Joy, et al to proceed, so that a unbiased and impartial 3rd party can resolve it all while he focusses on, and heads the ministry and tries to do the Lord's work; reflects a dismissal of issues, and is not responding to Pickle and Joy and the legion of accusers, and accusations.

All I can say is I personally think the accusations are being dealt with where it counts, and in the only way left to 3ABN when other attempts failed. I do think it a shame that it had to get to this point.

I'm sorry I couldn't satisfy your needs, or answer your questions the way you wanted. May I suggest that you e-mail Jim Gilley personally and directly and ask him to answer your questions? He is obviously the most suited to answer them, and the best qualified to verify or rebut anyone or anything related to what Mr. Pickle posted.

This post has been edited by Ian: Oct 3 2007, 09:00 AM

[Observer]

I went on a tour of the 3ABN facilities during campmeeting, lots did. I saw nothing like that. There was a camera over the reception desk showing it and the front door. The other doors to the building required a keycard, that seems to be the extent of their security. There were no secret rooms, nothing hidden, and nothing unusual.

I tend to think what you are asking about is not the case. If it was, HOTY would have been fired long ago, as many of his posts seem to have been made during work hours.

To set the record straight:

1) I have no knowledge of security measures at 3-ABN.

2) I have no knowledge of the tour that Ian recently went on at 3-ABN.

3) I know nothing about what he saw, or did not see on that tour, other than what he told us here.

I do have a limited knowledge of security systems.

1) If the system is set up to do so, the key cards that Ian mentioned can track individual employees as they enter and exit such doors.

2) Monitering devices can be hidden to the extent that they will not be seen.

3) Software can by used to track employee use of telephones, fax machines, and computeres, and without employee knowledge. In regard to computers, the software is comprehensive and can take a screen shot which can be mailed elsewhere.

[awesumtenor]

How do you know I wouldn't see anything like that? How would you know what I saw and where I went on the tour I went on? I assure you I saw every single room, in the main building and even the sound studio etc. including the room with monitors from the security cameras, Danny's office covered in a wall of family pictures, mostly grandchildren, and the largest office which was formerly Linda's..

You speak here as if you know for a fact what you are saying.. How is that possible? Have you ever been to 3ABN, been on a tour there, or personally talked to any employed there?

Forgive me, and correct me if I am mistaken but I thought you previously posted somewhere that you hadn't, and don't know anyone personally , and don't or or didn't even watch 3ABN.

We should at least be able to agree that where you work and 3ABN are two different and unrelated places and organizations, and what one does is unrelated to the other.

Why do you think HOTY continues work at 3ABN and give his slanted reports if all that you say is going on? Does that make sense to you?

It doesn't to me.

Ian, 3ABN is no more going to show the length and breadth of their security on a tour than the White House would. You may see something... a guard station with monitors for instance... but if you know anything about security, the you know Di is right and security is like an iceberg... and what is visible to the uninitiated, like people such as yourself on tours, is not close to the entirety of what they do. Those who work with the stuff you didnt see are probably under a non-disclosure/ non-compete agreement as part of the terms of their employment... and I am sure your tour did not cover their electronic surveillance capability in it's entirety because in security, effectiveness is tied to not divulging where the holes are in the net... case in point... last Christmas season, my son was working at a local Best Buy and while he was there there was a big issue with employee theft... it turns out that Best Buy uses real and dummy cameras in it's stores which, on observation look identical... but some managers knew which cameras were real and which were dummies and exploited that knowledge to steal merchandise from the store.

As for HOTY or any other's posting without being 'caught'... a laptop with a mobile broadband card that is not on 3ABN's network would be sufficient to do that; a GoToMyPC remote desktop of his home computer would be as well... anyone who has a high level of understanding of systems and networks could find a number of ways around the security... if they know what is in place and what they are trying to evade.

In His service,
Mr. J

[LaurenceD]

I think this is the point being made: the extent of research being done (going on a general tour), before arriving at conclusions, is all that's necessary. Please trust my other conclusions being made about 3abn.

[Ian]

And Appletree... what is there about the question that upset you so much? Is there some reason you can't simply answer it... and if there is a change in 3abn's participation in the festival this year tell us what has caused that change?

Maybe I'm confused, and maybe you just missed it, but FWIW I thought Appletree did answer previously, twice.

1st time post #163
"It is untrue, useless comments like this that make you guilty of perpetuating a false image of 3abn.

second time post 169
"the very heart of the questions leads one to think that maybe the practice had been put into effect before. It hasn't. End result, It is a misleading question, that paints a false image in the mind of the reader.

This post has been edited by Ian: Oct 3 2007, 09:44 AM

[Delford]

It doesn't matter if 3ABN has good security or not. Frankly in the world we live in today, I wouldn't blame them if they did. But big deal. Who cares.

As far as the suit from 3ABN--if 3ABN wins, many on this forum won't believe it anyway even if the Lord were to appear to them Himself to tell them. Reminds me of a Bible story about the owner who kept sending his servants only to have them killed one by one, so he sent His Son.....and they killed him too. What does this prove? Killers will keep killing. They have no respect for anyone.