Jim Gilley Takes Over As President Options

[beartrap]

The real question is why does such a system produce such hurt, bitterness, dysfunction and pain. Why is it so toxic when it's supposed to be the "the truth"?

The truth was that the German people, Europe, and the world, needed what was at the foundation of Adolph Hitler's rhetoric. The truth was that the Russian people needed what was at the foundation Of Lenin's rhetoric. Yet, those systems imposed such hurt, bitterness, dysfunction and pain. The truth was not toxic, it was what came along with the truth and sublimated it. Adherents don't follow in order to have pain and misery, they simply keep their eyes on the accompanying sales pitch that carries the points they truly want to hear and see. When to the people a person, through religion or government, becomes the embodiment of something good, evil almost invariably follows. The most effective way for a con artist, despot, or megalomaniac to build a following is to become the champion for what those people want, need, or hold dear. Then the pain begins.

[watchbird]

The real question is why does such a system produce such hurt, bitterness, dysfunction and pain. Why is it so toxic when it's supposed to be the "the truth"?

It isn't the "system" that produces such.... but people who hurt each other for one reason or another. And there are probably nearly as many different reasons as there are people involved. In my case.... cases, actually.... I conflated two experiences widely separated in time.... though overlapping in healing.... it involved ignorance, jealousy, anger, on the part of some people.... and a variety of motives. Sometimes, though, those who wish to push people into their narrow little molds get together and form a "system" within the System..... and in those cases especially it can seem as though it is a result of the things that the narrow little minds call truth.

Happy is he/she who can step back and find within their range of vision others who exemplify the real Truth... not only in their teaching but in their living as well. And when that range of vision also includes those who have "been there" and have been able to not only to survive but to thrive.....that makes healing and growth come to look like something that might be possible for "me too". It was, I think, meeting such a person that made my eventual healing possible, for in her early story I recognized my own experience... and in her success in rising above it I got a glimmer of hope that I, too, could become something different than what I had been labeled.

[Johann]

Linda is obviously receiving quite a few letters voicing different opinions. What do you think of this post she received a few days ago:

Linda,

I have watched 3ABN for many years. This ministry is clearly blessed by God. I have Enjoyed your contribution to the ministry especially your "Someone once said" ministry along with your music ministry. When I heard of a apparent problem and separation between you and Danny, I did not want to know the details. I knew the enemy (Satan) Was working.



To be perfectly honest with you I was very disappointed when I ran across your website in my search engine. Even if everything you say in your website is true, it is best left unsaid. The damage caused by your speaking out to save your name will undoubtedly cost the lives of many who will be put to rest in Christless graves for loosing or never gaining the trust of SDA organizations such as 3ABN due to ill spoken words. Would it be better for you to suffer the fiery darts and suffer along with Jesus and save many souls as a result? Or should you save face and loose many souls to the Kingdom as a result?



After reading from your site I think I understand why Danny has stepped down as 3ABN'S President. If you are going to take this stand It will be better for 3ABN if he is not the President. Then you can attack him personally and keep 3ABN out of the picture.



If you disagree with me, please pray earnestly for the leading of the Holy Spirit. If you stay your course, you will be operating against God's Kingdom.



Please don't think I am against you and for Danny. I do not know either of you other than seeing you both on 3ABN. You gave Danny some good advice some years ago when he was ready to attack someone for falsly asccusing him for something. You stepped in and asked Danny if he was a garbage collector or teacher of the Gospel. You spoke with wisdom, I ask you to consider following your own advice.



My Prayers are with you and 3ABN,

May God bless you abundantly,



R. . .

[Skyhook]

Linda is obviously receiving quite a few letters voicing different opinions. What do you think of this post she received a few days ago:

Linda,

I have watched 3ABN for many years. This ministry is clearly blessed by God. I have Enjoyed your contribution to the ministry especially your "Someone once said" ministry along with your music ministry. When I heard of a apparent problem and separation between you and Danny, I did not want to know the details. I knew the enemy (Satan) Was working.



To be perfectly honest with you I was very disappointed when I ran across your website in my search engine. Even if everything you say in your website is true, it is best left unsaid. The damage caused by your speaking out to save your name will undoubtedly cost the lives of many who will be put to rest in Christless graves for loosing or never gaining the trust of SDA organizations such as 3ABN due to ill spoken words. Would it be better for you to suffer the fiery darts and suffer along with Jesus and save many souls as a result? Or should you save face and loose many souls to the Kingdom as a result?



After reading from your site I think I understand why Danny has stepped down as 3ABN'S President. If you are going to take this stand It will be better for 3ABN if he is not the President. Then you can attack him personally and keep 3ABN out of the picture.



If you disagree with me, please pray earnestly for the leading of the Holy Spirit. If you stay your course, you will be operating against God's Kingdom.



Please don't think I am against you and for Danny. I do not know either of you other than seeing you both on 3ABN. You gave Danny some good advice some years ago when he was ready to attack someone for falsly asccusing him for something. You stepped in and asked Danny if he was a garbage collector or teacher of the Gospel. You spoke with wisdom, I ask you to consider following your own advice.



My Prayers are with you and 3ABN,

May God bless you abundantly,



R. . .

The person who wrote the above obviously believes that truth should not be defended or spoken in the face of lies and bearing false witness because of an outcome that is merely imagined. That logic if taken farther could reach absurd lengths. Jesus said we must take up our crosses and follow Him, but he did not say we shouldn't defend ourselves from evil. Paul defended himself from the slanderous lies of the Jewish leaders all the way to the Roman "Supreme Court." It would actually be presumption on our part to just roll over and pray that God will take care of the problem with no effort on our part. I believe Linda should have screamed loudly as she was being taken outside the camp and figuratively stoned by the gang at 3abn.

This post has been edited by Skyhook: Oct 14 2007, 04:36 PM

[Seraphim7]

The person who wrote the above obviously believes that truth should not be defended or spoken in the face of lies and bearing false witness because of an outcome that is merely imagined. That logic if taken farther could reach absurd lengths. Jesus said we must take up our crosses and follow Him, but he did not say we shouldn't defend ourselves from evil. Paul defended himself from the slanderous lies of the Jewish leaders all the way to the Roman "Supreme Court." It would actually be presumption on our part to just roll over and pray that God will take care of the problem with no effort on our part. I believe Linda should have screamed loudly as she was being taken outside the camp and figuratively stoned by the gang at 3abn.

Amen, AMEN and

[Panama_Pete]

Linda is obviously receiving quite a few letters voicing different opinions. What do you think of this post she received a few days ago:

Linda,
Even if everything you say in your website is true, it is best left unsaid...If you disagree with me, please pray earnestly for the leading of the Holy Spirit. If you stay your course, you will be operating against God's Kingdom.....
R. . .

The devil is a liar, and the father of it. Therefore, keeping quiet and allowing people to believe lies is to be in league with the devil.


John 8:31, 32, 44

31 So Jesus was saying to those Jews who had believed Him, “If you continue in My word, then you are truly disciples of Mine;

32 and you will know the truth, and the truth will make you free.”

44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.

[Fran]

Linda is obviously receiving quite a few letters voicing different opinions. What do you think of this post she received a few days ago:

Linda,

I have watched 3ABN for many years. This ministry is clearly blessed by God. I have Enjoyed your contribution to the ministry especially your "Someone once said" ministry along with your music ministry. When I heard of a apparent problem and separation between you and Danny, I did not want to know the details. I knew the enemy (Satan) Was working.



To be perfectly honest with you I was very disappointed when I ran across your website in my search engine. Even if everything you say in your website is true, it is best left unsaid. The damage caused by your speaking out to save your name will undoubtedly cost the lives of many who will be put to rest in Christless graves for loosing or never gaining the trust of SDA organizations such as 3ABN due to ill spoken words. Would it be better for you to suffer the fiery darts and suffer along with Jesus and save many souls as a result? Or should you save face and loose many souls to the Kingdom as a result?



After reading from your site I think I understand why Danny has stepped down as 3ABN'S President. If you are going to take this stand It will be better for 3ABN if he is not the President. Then you can attack him personally and keep 3ABN out of the picture.



If you disagree with me, please pray earnestly for the leading of the Holy Spirit. If you stay your course, you will be operating against God's Kingdom.



Please don't think I am against you and for Danny. I do not know either of you other than seeing you both on 3ABN. You gave Danny some good advice some years ago when he was ready to attack someone for falsly asccusing him for something. You stepped in and asked Danny if he was a garbage collector or teacher of the Gospel. You spoke with wisdom, I ask you to consider following your own advice.



My Prayers are with you and 3ABN,

May God bless you abundantly,



R. . .

Sounds to me like the 3ABN crowd wrote this! They R-E-A-L-L-Y N-E-E-D to keep her quiet! Linda, speak LOUDLY AND CLEARLY! The only way to heal a scar is to share it with others. Then the scars will be diamonds for Jesus. As others see how you have suffered at the hand of one that promised to love and cherish you until death do you part. Silence is not the truth. Silence is what Satan and Danny want.

None of this is your fault IMO!

[Brick Step]

Linda is obviously receiving quite a few letters voicing different opinions. What do you think of this post she received a few days ago:

Linda,

I have watched 3ABN for many years. This ministry is clearly blessed by God. I have Enjoyed your contribution to the ministry especially your "Someone once said" ministry along with your music ministry. When I heard of a apparent problem and separation between you and Danny, I did not want to know the details. I knew the enemy (Satan) Was working.

To be perfectly honest with you I was very disappointed when I ran across your website in my search engine. Even if everything you say in your website is true, it is best left unsaid. The damage caused by your speaking out to save your name will undoubtedly cost the lives of many who will be put to rest in Christless graves for loosing or never gaining the trust of SDA organizations such as 3ABN due to ill spoken words. Would it be better for you to suffer the fiery darts and suffer along with Jesus and save many souls as a result? Or should you save face and loose many souls to the Kingdom as a result?

After reading from your site I think I understand why Danny has stepped down as 3ABN'S President. If you are going to take this stand It will be better for 3ABN if he is not the President. Then you can attack him personally and keep 3ABN out of the picture.

If you disagree with me, please pray earnestly for the leading of the Holy Spirit. If you stay your course, you will be operating against God's Kingdom.

Please don't think I am against you and for Danny. I do not know either of you other than seeing you both on 3ABN. You gave Danny some good advice some years ago when he was ready to attack someone for falsly asccusing him for something. You stepped in and asked Danny if he was a garbage collector or teacher of the Gospel. You spoke with wisdom, I ask you to consider following your own advice.

My Prayers are with you and 3ABN,

May God bless you abundantly,

R. . .

(I have edited the letter above just by removing some of the space between paragraphs.)

I am with R... in feeling deep concern for the overall on-screen witness of 3ABN. Praise God for the leadership Adventist believers in USA have given in taking the gospel to the world. But there are times also when I wonder if some persons in USA half understand the needs and heart-cries of thousands in the far-flung places of this earth, and the light and hope (even if human imperfections are there) 3ABN brings to them. Praise God for the work both Danny and Linda have done in setting up 3ABN. It is obvious they have been owned of God in this work, and it is indeed to be expected that the "angry red dragon" will be all-out to undermine, misrepresent and destroy this ministry. I do not wish to aid him in that endeavour.

But the hard, sorry facts are that Linda has suffered divorce, separation from her home and friends, loss of employment and reputation, a fall from being a high profile television personality almost into oblivion, with thousands asking questions and seeking her out, all of this impacting upon the lives of her children and loved ones, to say nothing of her own life, health and experience. It IS aiding the angry red dragon to deny Linda and her friends any right to speak to the situation, while affirming Danny by granting him the freedom to be and say and do and carry on.

Did the writer (R...) of this letter, requesting Linda to be silent, deliver similar counsel to Danny? If not, why not?

R... sounds like a church officer who has allowed the 3ABN management structure to become equated with God/Truth in his/her thinking, and they identify with and find security in that concept of structure. Many, it appears, regard the structure of the worldwide SDA church in the same unbiblical, unProtestant way. The structure of a ministry or church becomes an idol and a tyrant if the cry is “they can do no wrong”, and allegations of sin, abuse and unjust judgments by its leaders and members are not and cannot be addressed by responsible members and supporters at large. Even if Linda has now become ultra-liberal (I pray she has not, and find it hard to believe she has) it does not prove she is the guilty party in the divorce, or deserves the treatment she has received. Though there is a time to remain silent in regard to a controversy, there is also a time to speak to it. Christ is always "greater than the temple." The Bible nowhere counsels us to defend "the temple" in a way that violates Christ's witness through one of His children.

Could it be one reason God is allowing this terrible 3ABN drama to play out is because there are parallels to be drawn with the situation of the church as a whole, and He is urgent that it be ready to receive the latter rain? Church structure has its place. But God cannot lead as the True Shepherd if members everywhere feel they will be severely punished if they dare to think, move or breathe before a ministry or Conference committee has granted them permission. .......No! That is a mis-statement! God WILL EVEN THEN lead as the True Shepherd of His people! And He will lead home! But there will be terrible persecution along the way.

[appletree]

(I have edited the letter above just by removing some of the space between paragraphs.)

I am with R... in feeling deep concern for the overall on-screen witness of 3ABN. Praise God for the leadership Adventist believers in USA have given in taking the gospel to the world. But there are times also when I wonder if some persons in USA half understand the needs and heart-cries of thousands in the far-flung places of this earth, and the light and hope (even if human imperfections are there) 3ABN brings to them. Praise God for the work both Danny and Linda have done in setting up 3ABN. It is obvious they have been owned of God in this work, and it is indeed to be expected that the "angry red dragon" will be all-out to undermine, misrepresent and destroy this ministry. I do not wish to aid him in that endeavour.

But the hard, sorry facts are that Linda has suffered divorce, separation from her home and friends, loss of employment and reputation, a fall from being a high profile television personality almost into oblivion, with thousands asking questions and seeking her out, all of this impacting upon the lives of her children and loved ones, to say nothing of her own life, health and experience. It IS aiding the angry red dragon to deny Linda and her friends any right to speak to the situation, while affirming Danny by granting him the freedom to be and say and do and carry on.

Did the writer (R...) of this letter, requesting Linda to be silent, deliver similar counsel to Danny? If not, why not?

R... sounds like a church officer who has allowed the 3ABN management structure to become equated with God/Truth in his/her thinking, and they identify with and find security in that concept of structure. Many, it appears, regard the structure of the worldwide SDA church in the same unbiblical, unProtestant way. The structure of a ministry or church becomes an idol and a tyrant if the cry is “they can do no wrong”, and allegations of sin, abuse and unjust judgments by its leaders and members are not and cannot be addressed by responsible members and supporters at large. Even if Linda has now become ultra-liberal (I pray she has not, and find it hard to believe she has) it does not prove she is the guilty party in the divorce, or deserves the treatment she has received. Though there is a time to remain silent in regard to a controversy, there is also a time to speak to it. Christ is always "greater than the temple." The Bible nowhere counsels us to defend "the temple" in a way that violates Christ's witness through one of His children.

Could it be one reason God is allowing this terrible 3ABN drama to play out is because there are parallels to be drawn with the situation of the church as a whole, and He is urgent that it be ready to receive the latter rain? Church structure has its place. But God cannot lead as the True Shepherd if members everywhere feel they will be severely punished if they dare to think, move or breathe before a ministry or Conference committee has granted them permission. .......No! That is a mis-statement! God WILL EVEN THEN lead as the True Shepherd of His people! And He will lead home! But there will be terrible persecution along the way.

I appreciate some of the sentiments in your post. Some I agree with, some I don't. There seems to be a misunderstanding or maybe it is the "blinder" syndrome when it comes to the subject of Linda keeping quiet. It is clear that she has never kept quiet. There is much proof of that but none more deadly that the fact that Bob Pickle and Gailon Joy say they are Linda's representatives. Look at the junk they have put out. True or not, does anyone think they did this without her permission when they are representing her? Where do you think they got the emails that were strictly between her and Danny? How do you think they have gotten in contact with certain people that have acts to grind with 3abn and or Danny?

It appears that sole responsibility for this internet mess that has wounded the ministry of 3abn and exposed the church to public scrutiny (which Mrs. White says specifically we are never to do) belongs to Linda. And yet, so many here say Danny has trashed her on the air, which no one has ever proven BTW, but if he had, that could not have done half of of the damage that she has done through Joy and Pickle.
It seems to me that Linda has done more damage to 3abn, Danny, the Shelton's and the Adventist Church than she is given credit for. Let's give credit where credit is due. She has never been quiet, meek or taken the High Road as some have tried to say. Those that truly live on the "high road" don't recruit the Bob and Gailons of this world.

[Johann]

It appears that sole responsibility for this internet mess that has wounded the ministry of 3abn and exposed the church to public scrutiny (which Mrs. White says specifically we are never to do) belongs to Linda.

Mr. Appletree. You often claim to have first hand knowledge, but on this point you don't, because you are not stating the truth in this matter. You think you have all the proofs, but you don't. So be more careful before you draw your conclusions.

This post has been edited by Johann: Oct 15 2007, 03:41 AM

[mystery- man]

I appreciate some of the sentiments in your post. Some I agree with, some I don't. There seems to be a misunderstanding or maybe it is the "blinder" syndrome when it comes to the subject of Linda keeping quiet. It is clear that she has never kept quiet. There is much proof of that but none more deadly that the fact that Bob Pickle and Gailon Joy say they are Linda's representatives. Look at the junk they have put out. True or not, does anyone think they did this without her permission when they are representing her? Where do you think they got the emails that were strictly between her and Danny? How do you think they have gotten in contact with certain people that have acts to grind with 3abn and or Danny?

It appears that sole responsibility for this internet mess that has wounded the ministry of 3abn and exposed the church to public scrutiny (which Mrs. White says specifically we are never to do) belongs to Linda. And yet, so many here say Danny has trashed her on the air, which no one has ever proven BTW, but if he had, that could not have done half of of the damage that she has done through Joy and Pickle.
It seems to me that Linda has done more damage to 3abn, Danny, the Shelton's and the Adventist Church than she is given credit for. Let's give credit where credit is due. She has never been quiet, meek or taken the High Road as some have tried to say. Those that truly live on the "high road" don't recruit the Bob and Gailons of this world.

Appletree. Linda did not make Danny do what he did??? The Shelton's are resposible for the things they did. The board and its members did what they did not edged on by Linda. What in the world are you talking about? And how do you know what the "high road" is? God has often sent rebuke in whatever form best fit the cause. It would seem to me that you would attribute some kind of virtue to Linda if she had been quiet and just stayed in the background, if that is what you believe you need to reread your bible. I have a question I would like for you to answer and if you do not answer I will consider everything you say a joke. Is Danny guilty of any wrong (meaning in your opinion are any of the things spoken against him right) if so what? In your opinion is Tommy guilty of any of the things he is accused of? Please just answer those few questions and it will help me get insight into how sincere you actually are.

[awesumtenor]

It appears that sole responsibility for this internet mess that has wounded the ministry of 3abn and exposed the church to public scrutiny (which Mrs. White says specifically we are never to do) belongs to Linda.

Appears to whom? Danny came here unsolicited telling lies when all he had to do is keep his big mouth shut. He and the 3ABN board did all they could to smear Linda in every possible public venue... whether it be on the air, on the internet or at the myriad churches where Danny's dog and pony show and begathon appeared. The way this whole ordeal has been handled by Danny and his minions from day one is why this "internet mess" as you put it is what it is and not once have you, Danny or anyone in your camp had the good sense to recognize that. For all your claims about Linda, the fact is that Danny needed cover for his relationship and subsequent marriage to Brandy because if he and Linda divorced for any reason other than her being unfaithful to him, he could not remarry and remain a member of the Seventh-day Adventist church in good and regular standing...

As for your saying Sis. White's saying we are not to expose the church to public scrutiny, again the blame for that lies at Danny's feet and has been exacerbated by persons such as yourself. Linda didn't make 3ABN send out letters casting aspersion on her; she didnt make 3ABN retape shows to make it seem like she never existed; she did not use the bully pulpit of the 3ABN broadcast to put out an unending stream of negative publicity about herself. It is you and those like you who have descended upon myriad internet forae like locusts spreading fear, uncertainty, doubt and outright lies who have exposed the church to public scrutiny. The high road you claim to have taken is a joke.... both collectively as supporters of Danny and individually, appletree; you couldn't find the high road with GPS; no, not one.

But if it helps you sleep at night believing a convenient lie rather than a number of hard truths so be it... but the fact remains that when you hear the the sound of the cornet, flute, harp, sackbut, psaltery, dulcimer, and all kinds of music, you are quick to prostrate yourself before the image of Danny Lee Nebuchadnezzar... and like certain Chaldeans in Daniel chapter 3 you are quick to condemn those of us who have not and who will not bow down.

Some things never change, I reckon.

In His service,
Mr. J

[Richard Sherwin]

Anyone who believes Danny has taken the high road in this must be looking up from a very low place indeed. Weather a person has taken the high road or the low road depends on your point of view.

[watchbird]

Appears to whom? Danny came here unsolicited telling lies when all he had to do is keep his big mouth shut. He and the 3ABN board did all they could to smear Linda in every possible public venue... whether it be on the air, on the internet or at the myriad churches where Danny's dog and pony show and begathon appeared. The way this whole ordeal has been handled by Danny and his minions from day one is why this "internet mess" as you put it is what it is and not once have you, Danny or anyone in your camp had the good sense to recognize that. For all your claims about Linda, the fact is that Danny needed cover for his relationship and subsequent marriage to Brandy because if he and Linda divorced for any reason other than her being unfaithful to him, he could not remarry and remain a member of the Seventh-day Adventist church in good and regular standing...

As for your saying Sis. White's saying we are not to expose the church to public scrutiny, again the blame for that lies at Danny's feet and has been exacerbated by persons such as yourself. Linda didn't make 3ABN send out letters casting aspersion on her; she didnt make 3ABN retape shows to make it seem like she never existed; she did not use the bully pulpit of the 3ABN broadcast to put out an unending stream of negative publicity about herself. It is you and those like you who have descended upon myriad internet forae like locusts spreading fear, uncertainty, doubt and outright lies who have exposed the church to public scrutiny. The high road you claim to have taken is a joke.... both collectively as supporters of Danny and individually, appletree; you couldn't find the high road with GPS; no, not one.

But if it helps you sleep at night believing a convenient lie rather than a number of hard truths so be it... but the fact remains that when you hear the the sound of the cornet, flute, harp, sackbut, psaltery, dulcimer, and all kinds of music, you are quick to prostrate yourself before the image of Danny Lee Nebuchadnezzar... and like certain Chaldeans in Daniel chapter 3 you are quick to condemn those of us who have not and who will not bow down.

Some things never change, I reckon.

In His service,
Mr. J

... Preach it Mr. J...... and

You have covered the waterfront very succinctly.... I'll just add one postscript to your comment about "believing a convenient lie".

It is quite possible that we would understand more about all these things which seem to us to be lies... whether convenient or inconvenient.... if we take seriously the beliefs about affirmations as taught by Shelley Quinn. If one takes those beliefs seriously, then it is not facts which determine what must be spoken... but one's desired outcome. For there is such power in the spoken word that what one says creates the reality one will have to live with. And this extends to negative words as well as positive one.... so one can NEVER admit to any unpleasant truth, for to do so would be to create that negative thing. What one has to do is to keep affirming what one wants reality to be... and in this way... that reality will come to be. If you think about it enough, it makes all of the declarations of innocence .. both here and on 3abn shows.... very understandable. In their belief system they would not dare do otherwise.

[Seraphim7]

... Preach it Mr. J...... and

You have covered the waterfront very succinctly.... I'll just add one postscript to your comment about "believing a convenient lie".

It is quite possible that we would understand more about all these things which seem to us to be lies... whether convenient or inconvenient.... if we take seriously the beliefs about affirmations as taught by Shelley Quinn. If one takes those beliefs seriously, then it is not facts which determine what must be spoken... but one's desired outcome. For there is such power in the spoken word that what one says creates the reality one will have to live with. And this extends to negative words as well as positive one.... so one can NEVER admit to any unpleasant truth, for to do so would be to create that negative thing. What one has to do is to keep affirming what one wants reality to be... and in this way... that reality will come to be. If you think about it enough, it makes all of the declarations of innocence .. both here and on 3abn shows.... very understandable. In their belief system they would not dare do otherwise.

WB that sounds, to me, like those folks are living in the state of Delusion. Though it not an official state in the US sadly, it doe exist.