Danny Shelton, Please Come Home!, It's time to stop running Options

[SoulEspresso]

Is this same scenario played and replayed in various adventist churches throughout North America? The nominating committee is stacked a certain way, nominating the favorites, ignoring the qualified? While not minimizing what may have happened in the Thompsonville church, the story is all too familiar...

[YogusBearus]

Is this same scenario played and replayed in various adventist churches throughout North America? The nominating committee is stacked a certain way, nominating the favorites, ignoring the qualified? While not minimizing what may have happened in the Thompsonville church, the story is all too familiar...

Naw, that doesn't happen anymore.

-bear

[Pickle]

Perhaps it was the way you put this particular issue earlier that raised my hackles.

I agree. I'm afraid I had an attack of gun shyness. "Didn't want to get sued." My apologies for wording it the way I did.

[PeacefulBe]

I agree with the principle you stated here. Perhaps it was the way you put this particular issue earlier that raised my hackles. You've documented a lot of abuse-of-power issues at 3ABN and Thompsonville, but there wasn't enough information with this story initially to connect it to that. Even if it wasn't intended on your part, it came across at first as innuendo rather than substantiating facts. IOW at least with this kind of event, IMO, reporting with key facts omitted is counterproductive to your goals. Sister's corroboration was helpful up to a point.

But I would implore you both to remember that the ends don't justify the means, because the ends are up to God. All we down here have are means, and we've got to use the right ones.

I strongly agree with you on these statements, SE.

Bob, sister, how you present things speaks to your characters and either strengthens or diminishes your credibility and the effectiveness of what you are attempting to accomplish. How you fight your battles shows who is leading.

[appletree]

I don't know anything about the issue, and my guess is that many have not heard the story but by putting out a story, that you don't know to be true or not you've planted the idea in peoples minds that Danny inappropriately fired someone, based on a story not known to be true. Now this to me is slander, even though you did say you didn't know if you had the facts straight. You have plenty on Danny without resorting to questionable tactics and rumors to get your point across.

I take issue with your comment that Pickle has enough on Danny that he doesn't have to resort to questionable rumors. What is anymore questionable about this than anything else Pickle has presented. He has no proof of this or any of the other accusations he has made. He can get online and read tax forms and say well it looks like, or he can pump all kinds of people that seem to be, ex wives, ex employees or someone who doesn't seem to like Danny, and say this person and that person said that Danny and 3abn did so and so. But where is the proof? I say again....all manner of speculation, opinion, emails and heresay will not be accepted as proof in any federal court of law.

[appletree]

Ohhhhhh , I see said the blind man, you're on THAT loooonnnng list of folk.

So you are agreeing with me when I have said in the past that many people here have had a problem personally or with their jobs at 3abn. Maybe directly with Danny or other administration. Let me tell you something. There isn't a president/CEO alive that hasn't had conflict or had to fire a number of people in the course of a 23 year career and who hasn't made plenty of enemies because of it. Ministry or not, people will get fired who aren't doing their jobs. People get fired who are stabbing their place of employment in the back. People get fired when caught in "compromising situations." People also get fired when found doing something that would intentionally hurt the work place. The fact is, if Danny was actually hard hearted, a lot more people would have been given a "pink slip" than there actually has been. I have know of a number of instances when an employee, proven wrong beyond a shadow of a doubt, was given the choice of quitting or being fired. Quitting looks so much better on a resume doesn't it? Those instances are called "mercy." And, unless it is something incomprehensible, the employee was always given a warning, maybe several warnings about their behaviour before they were let go.

Nex comment. Is that supposed to mean something when you advise a member to call the 800 number and ask for Danny? I don't get it. You ask for Danny you get the general manager and executive secretary who then decides whether to take a message or forward the call on to Danny. I believe that is standard in the work place.

How wrong you are ssom in judging Danny's heart and in making your accusations against him. You do not have a right to change any man's heart. You will be judged in the same manner as you judge other's. Your comments about not knowing if he even knows what a christian is and comparing him with a tv evangelist (which he is not) is inexcusable and makes me ask the question "do you know what a christian is?"

[appletree]

If the sin was public, as was Danny's divorce of Linda on unbiblical grounds, then what's the problem with a public call for confession and repentance?

1Ti 5:20 "Them that sin rebuke before all, that others also may fear."

Was Paul wrong in this counsel to Timothy?

For the third time, where is your proof? Prove that he did not have biblical grounds. You can't because there are those of us who have seen proof of the opposite. Please refrain from continueing to make this accusation without proof. That isn't wise since you are already in a court of law and it certainly isn't wise in God's court.

[appletree]

Danny Shelton, this post is directed specifically at you. Please accept it in the spirit in which it is presented, and please seriously consider the message inside.

Back in the 1980s, God placed upon you a massive and extremely important responsibility with worldwide impact. Heaven rejoiced when this responsibility was realized and Three Angels Broadcasting Network hit the airwaves. It was one of the most exciting moments in your life, as well as the lives of countless millions who have been blessed in so many ways by 3ABN over the years. God was blessing, and at the same time, Satan was declaring all-out war. Why was Satan declaring war? Because 3ABN was a powerful force for the Kingdom of God, and a definite threat to evil.

Somewhere along the line, however, Satan has gotten the upper hand. As a result, millions of lives and spiritual futures are at stake. Satan has pulled off one of his "best" scams....and he is having one big time of it!

Danny, there is no shame in admitting that you have fallen into Satan's trap. It happens to all of us. We're human. There is plenty of shame, however, in remaining in this trap. The fact is, it really isn't a "trap" at all. You are not trapped. 3ABN is not trapped. You can get out, and thereby bring Satan's celebration to a screeching halt!

I call upon you, Danny, to return to the loving Lord from Whom you have strayed. He WILL welcome you back, as will all of your Christian brothers and sisters.

Danny Shelton, please come home!

I agree with Ian and will add to that. No matter what experience you may have had with Danny or 3abn that doesn't make him guilty of the accusations that have been thrown at him, nor does it make you judge and jury. All your "public plea" does is prove you are doing exactly opposite of biblical instruction. You know the one.....If you have ought against your brother, go to he and he alone.....No where have I read to " go to the internet sites and spread gossip and speculation." I also agree with Dr. Walt's well worded and totally accurate email. Those of you who actually believe that Danny is guilty as charged are guilty of doing a greater wrong than what you have accused him of. You are guilty of going against biblical instruction in all areas where 3abn is concerned.
Please don't bother to quote scriptures about exposing sin in the camp. That is strictly for sin that has been witnessed and proven beyond a shadow of a doubt. Read what SOP has to say on this subject.

[princessdi]

I agrew ith you SE> Danny is not a preacher, per se, however, he has takent o role as a religious leader in that he runs a "ministry",a nd he used to speak fromt hat authority very often from the network,a nd still does, I believe, in person. Like J4J, I believe God did call DAnny to star this ministry. It is HUGE and God is requiring more of Danny in the way of accountability. He does has the capability of leading a lot of people astray,a nd I believe Danny has done exactly that with his behavior. People are follow "him")Danny) and not "Him"(God). If they were hearing God's voice, they would have known when Danny went left.

Well, I don't do a lot of original scholarship these days, so I have to rely on others as well.
The people who are closest to the individual have the biggest responsibility. Unfortunately, it's a lot harder when you're close to a person. It's becoming apparent that Linda seems to have known about some underhanded things some time back (or should have known). She should have been the first. I would have said the Board should have been next. ASI would follow that, I guess. After that it falls to the supporters and donors. Once they work behind the scenes and fail, then they can go public.

When they do so, however, they have to work hard to keep the moral high ground in every respect, and avoid every appearance of evil. Of course, if the behind-the-scenes work has failed, they're going to get opposition from the leader; but criticism that is constructive they need to consider carefully.

What sins? Sins the public knows about, and sins against the public. Who? People involved in complicity. Some of Danny's supporters on these boards, I think, know of malfeasance -- and to keep supporting him is shame. Other supporters, even some relatively close to the action, don't have the full picture even if they think they do. This is what I want to believe, at least. I would rather impart good motives to people rather than bad.

[SoulEspresso]

I take issue with your comment that Pickle has enough on Danny that he doesn't have to resort to questionable rumors. What is anymore questionable about this than anything else Pickle has presented. He has no proof of this or any of the other accusations he has made. He can get online and read tax forms and say well it looks like, or he can pump all kinds of people that seem to be, ex wives, ex employees or someone who doesn't seem to like Danny, and say this person and that person said that Danny and 3abn did so and so. But where is the proof? I say again....all manner of speculation, opinion, emails and heresay will not be accepted as proof in any federal court of law.

Man, if you can look at pdfs of original documents and call them speculation and opinion, then no one could ever prove anything to you.

So you are agreeing with me when I have said in the past that many people here have had a problem personally or with their jobs at 3abn. Maybe directly with Danny or other administration. Let me tell you something. There isn't a president/CEO alive that hasn't had conflict or had to fire a number of people in the course of a 23 year career and who hasn't made plenty of enemies because of it. Ministry or not, people will get fired who aren't doing their jobs. People get fired who are stabbing their place of employment in the back. People get fired when caught in "compromising situations." People also get fired when found doing something that would intentionally hurt the work place. The fact is, if Danny was actually hard hearted, a lot more people would have been given a "pink slip" than there actually has been. I have know of a number of instances when an employee, proven wrong beyond a shadow of a doubt, was given the choice of quitting or being fired. Quitting looks so much better on a resume doesn't it? Those instances are called "mercy." And, unless it is something incomprehensible, the employee was always given a warning, maybe several warnings about their behaviour before they were let go.

How wrong you are ssom in judging Danny's heart and in making your accusations against him. You do not have a right to change any man's heart. You will be judged in the same manner as you judge other's. Your comments about not knowing if he even knows what a christian is and comparing him with a tv evangelist (which he is not) is inexcusable and makes me ask the question "do you know what a christian is?"

Nobody here has made pronouncements about Danny's eternal destiny, but we are called to be fruit inspectors (see Matthew 7). People don't just make up allegations like these, whether you're talking about Tommy or Danny. You might get one. An old proverb ... "One might be crazy, and two might be drunk, but if three sees it, it's there!"

Danny is a television evangelist. He started a television station to evangelize. That in itself doesn't make him a bad person, although plenty of television evangelists have made wicked decisions. Lots of us have watched him on our screens and concluded that Danny has made wicked decisions, but then, we know that doesn't by itself mean he's going to the Second Resurrection instead of the First. There's time to repent!

For the third time, where is your proof? Prove that he did not have biblical grounds. You can't because there are those of us who have seen proof of the opposite. Please refrain from continueing to make this accusation without proof. That isn't wise since you are already in a court of law and it certainly isn't wise in God's court.

What, the phone records? Please. Dude, if your side had proof that Linda committed real adultery, you'd have posted it already. People have been asking for years now. It doesn't exist.

Danny may think he has a special dispensation because he started a TV station, so he's exempt from the moral standards God expects of everyone else. But he's not. And there is a heavenly court to which we all must answer. I'm not afraid, but the more Danny protests, the more I think he secretly is.

[princessdi]

This is why I know you are one of my favorite pastors.......Well said, SE!!!

I won't.

Bob and Gailon have done an admirable job in tackling areas that are documented or have eyewitnesses, and for that the Adventist church owes you guys. You stood up to the powers at 3ABN when nobody else would.

But there are areas, Bob, where you guys have resorted to questionable tactics, such as posting stuff on save3abn.com about people whom you don't know to be players, but doing so in such a way as to cast doubt on their characters. Then there were the Nick Miller communiques.

Not only do responsible believers have to do the right thing ... they have to do the right thing in the right way.

I've seen enough to draw my own conclusions about Danny, but these kinds of unsubstantiated and/or peripheral issues do not make you or your cause look better to the people who are following this.

[sonshineonme]

So you are agreeing with me when I have said in the past that many people here have had a problem personally or with their jobs at 3abn. Maybe directly with Danny or other administration. Let me tell you something. There isn't a president/CEO alive that hasn't had conflict or had to fire a number of people in the course of a 23 year career and who hasn't made plenty of enemies because of it. Ministry or not, people will get fired who aren't doing their jobs. People get fired who are stabbing their place of employment in the back. People get fired when caught in "compromising situations." People also get fired when found doing something that would intentionally hurt the work place. The fact is, if Danny was actually hard hearted, a lot more people would have been given a "pink slip" than there actually has been. I have know of a number of instances when an employee, proven wrong beyond a shadow of a doubt, was given the choice of quitting or being fired. Quitting looks so much better on a resume doesn't it? Those instances are called "mercy." And, unless it is something incomprehensible, the employee was always given a warning, maybe several warnings about their behaviour before they were let go.

Nex comment. Is that supposed to mean something when you advise a member to call the 800 number and ask for Danny? I don't get it. You ask for Danny you get the general manager and executive secretary who then decides whether to take a message or forward the call on to Danny. I believe that is standard in the work place.

How wrong you are ssom in judging Danny's heart and in making your accusations against him. You do not have a right to change any man's heart. You will be judged in the same manner as you judge other's. Your comments about not knowing if he even knows what a christian is and comparing him with a tv evangelist (which he is not) is inexcusable and makes me ask the question "do you know what a christian is?"

No, I am not agreeing with you about anything.

People get on "that list" for reasons that have nothing to do with what you stated.
You sound like you are making excuses for ds' behavior towards others, you are suppose to be a christian first, RIGHT? Isn't that what you tried to point out in your last paragraph? Character speaks more about a person and the decisions they make - if he didn't fire someone, I can't accept the idea it had to do with mercy of any kind, but maybe on something he needed from that person. Only God knows....I won't begin to decide that from where I sit.

If you read the posts up to mine, you will see that the entire thread started on someone wanting to communicate something to DS, but as we read on, it was said that DS would not talk that person, and after "Ian" suggest sarcasticly that all J4J had to do was pick up the phone and call (you and she really should make up your mind on how you can talk to DS) I said to J4J "call him then". What's the problem? You assume if he won't talk to J4J that J4J MUST be one of those bad people that got fired and is unworthy of hearing the voice of DS on the phone forever more? Even after a heartfelt plea for the mans soul and repentance? Hmm...

As for enemies, I know PLENTY of business owners who do NOT have ENEMIES after 23 years. If that is the case, it speaks to something much more serious. And lets remember, this is a christian ministry - right? You would think maybe people might not like you as a boss, or maybe the environment, but ENEMIES??? Again, hmm...makes a person wonder, doesn't it? Lets not put all the blame on those employees that so much "mercy" was shed on.

My God not only knows my heart and spirit of what I do and say, and I fully count on His grace, love and forgiveness for my sins - and of course He does that for all of us, if we ask.

BTW, becareful how you are judging me....after all, you will be judged in the same manner from the one in Heaven who see's it all as it really is, no matter what you say.

And you are right, he is not a tv evangelist. At least not anymore. And I guess that must be a bad thing the way you put it for me to "compare" him to one? Come'on, we all know who he has put himself out there to be. Call it what you want to.

Oh, and I know what a christian looks and acts like. Wonder no more.

This post has been edited by sonshineonme: Jan 14 2008, 12:50 AM

[princessdi]

You just had to bring that up! Next time I tell soembody that I consented to be on the nominating committee, please just slap me!

I can totoally see is\t happneing...some almost "expecting" to have Danny as an elder, purely because o his position, and one lone soul quesioning the nomination. I know that loniless all too well.

That bieng said, I must agree with the rest who thought the story should not have been "introduced" as it was. It did sound like a ocmplete rumor. Ia lso agree that Danny has done quite enough on his own to hang himself in the eyes of those who really wish to see, and even in those who decide to overlook his many transgressions. No need to throw those little darts everytime you get a chance, Just let those facts and documented truth speak for themselves. There is a such thing as overkill. This makes you look vindictive and really angry.

Is this same scenario played and replayed in various adventist churches throughout North America? The nominating committee is stacked a certain way, nominating the favorites, ignoring the qualified? While not minimizing what may have happened in the Thompsonville church, the story is all too familiar...

[SoulEspresso]

I know this is but the title of this thread has put this here in my head ... all ... day!

[Pickle]

For the third time, where is your proof? Prove that he did not have biblical grounds. You can't because there are those of us who have seen proof of the opposite. Please refrain from continueing to make this accusation without proof. That isn't wise since you are already in a court of law and it certainly isn't wise in God's court.

Have you forgotten??????


-------- Original Message --------
From: Danny Shelton
To: Linda Shelton
Date: Saturday, July 17, 2004 9:12 AM

Linda Sue,

...

After two vacations with him in Springfield, the second one without Johann tagging along, and now a several week vacation with him in Scandinavia as well as possibly here in the USA, you will, if you have not already, end up in bed with him. That's all he's been after since the beginning.

This post has been edited by Pickle: Jan 14 2008, 02:33 AM