A Five Minute Transcript From 3abn "live" - 2/15/07, Danny's preamble to explaining the legal proceedings Options

[Seraphim7]

My guess would be that the Illinois conference officials do not appreciate having these people pass themselves off as one of them, and wish to disassociate themselves from what is being done falsely in their name.

Unlike the baseless assumptions you are attempting to pass off as facts, noted above, there is proof that some of you people have tried to pass yourselves off as independent thinkers without an agenda. When it is clear that such is far from the truth.

[sonshineonme]

Did you read the letter from Tommy Shelton which Bob posted today in the Tommy Shelton vindicated thread?

"I will begin with the opening paragraph of his cover sheet where he admits to “cooperating with certain Seventh Day Adventist "ecclesiastical investigators" who were looking into Tommy Shelton's conduct while he pastored in Illinois as well as presently in his employment at the 3ABN Seventh Day Adventist television ministry in Illinois.”

These men are not "ecclesiastical investigators" for the Seventh Day Adventist. They hold no official position, and have no authority in the Seventh Day Adventist Church to investigate anything or anybody. By next week I will have in hand an official statement from the Illinois Conference President of SDA, stating that these men do not work for the Seventh-Day-Adventist church and were not authorized to investigate anyone. Gailon Joy, one of the “self appointed investigators” was convicted of embezzlement in the 80’s. Although one may get the impression after talking with him that he is a lawyer, he is not. His conviction was appealed 3 times but the conviction remained. We have evidence of his unscrupulous dealings in recent months and years and you will also hear in the near future that he is being held accountable for his slander in a court of law."

Maybe you hear things backwards? Just because Tommy says this does not mean that Gailon has claimed to be what Tommy is pointing out he is not. ANYONE can investigate. There is NO crime in investigating anything (as you should also be investigating to find things out - it's the facts that come out that make the point of truth, not who is doing it.

So are you taking the bait Aletheia? Are you saying you are only willing to accept (and this is what Tommy is trying to put in your head) that an official SDA investigator has to do the investigating? When we know that the church has no authority so to speak over 3abn, how would they put about official conference paid investigators? You are falling in to the spinning pool right where they want you. No thanks, it's too icey for me, I'm not jumping in.

And you should keep in mind, here are any helping with the investigation - not just three people that includes people that work for the SDA church as well. Keep that in mind. You don't see everything going on and all who are involved in it. You are only seeing what Tommy and Danny and the Shelton clan are wanting you to THINK you see.

This post has been edited by sonshineonme: Feb 18 2007, 10:15 PM

[ida]

Did you read the letter from Tommy Shelton which Bob posted today in the Tommy Shelton vindicated thread?

- - -

Aletheia,

How are you involved with Tommy Shelton?

This post has been edited by ida: Feb 18 2007, 10:32 PM

[husbandoftheyear]

Alethia,

How are you involved with Tommy Shelton?

That is an excellent question, Ida.

[awesumtenor]

My guess would be that the Illinois conference officials do not appreciate having these people pass themselves off as one of them, and wish to disassociate themselves from what is being done falsely in their name.

What proof do you have that either Gailon Joy or Bob Pickle or Gregory Matthews posed as an Illinois Conference official?

Be specific...because all you have right now is the say so of someone that no sane lawyer would even bring into a court room much less put under oath...

You are quick to demand verification of statements that are contrary to your held positions; here you have nothing but the word of someone who has a propensity for being less than forthcoming when his sexual proclivities get him into trouble and you are willing to accept what he states sight unseen with no additional proof either desired or required...

Being a respecter of persons is sin, Cindy... so rather than your doing the varying standard of factual accountability thing... give us some proof that this actually happened.

In His service,
Mr. J

This post has been edited by awesumtenor: Feb 18 2007, 10:46 PM

[Ralph]

Here is the update for post #31

http://mypage.direct.ca/r/rseland/private/second.html

[Observer]

Did you read the letter from Tommy Shelton which Bob posted today in the Tommy Shelton vindicated thread?

"I will begin with the opening paragraph of his cover sheet where he admits to “cooperating with certain Seventh Day Adventist "ecclesiastical investigators" who were looking into Tommy Shelton's conduct while he pastored in Illinois as well as presently in his employment at the 3ABN Seventh Day Adventist television ministry in Illinois.”

These men are not "ecclesiastical investigators" for the Seventh Day Adventist. They hold no official position, and have no authority in the Seventh Day Adventist Church to investigate anything or anybody. By next week I will have in hand an official statement from the Illinois Conference President of SDA, stating that these men do not work for the Seventh-Day-Adventist church and were not authorized to investigate anyone. Gailon Joy, one of the “self appointed investigators” was convicted of embezzlement in the 80’s. Although one may get the impression after talking with him that he is a lawyer, he is not. His conviction was appealed 3 times but the conviction remained. We have evidence of his unscrupulous dealings in recent months and years and you will also hear in the near future that he is being held accountable for his slander in a court of law."

Well, well, well. you know it is very hard to prove a negative. Often negative statements are wrong.

Both Bob Pickle and I do hold a position with the SDA Church. I do not know what it meant by the word "official" that modifies the sentence. Many people would assume that those who are listed in what is commonly called the YEARBOOK do hold "official" pistons. If that is what gives one an official position, then I hold an official position. I am listed in the 2006 YEARBOOK. I have not yet seen the 2007 YEARBOOK. But, I expect to see my name listed in it.

I wonder how the IL Conference President could know that none of us work for the SDA Church. At least one of us receives money for services rendered to the SDA Church. Perhaps the implication is that the person who receives that money is not really working for the SDA Church. Oh, well, just another piece of information that is wrong.

However, let me point out an accurate statement that were made in the above quote:

None of us are either authorized to investigate any one, or are we doing so under the authority of the SDA Church. That statement is 100 per-cent correct.

The statements that the three of us make, and what we do in this matter is done independently, and is not done in the name of anyone except ourselves.

[Grace]

Here is the update for post #31

http://mypage.direct.ca/r/rseland/private/second.html

Thank you, Ralph! Awesome job and very useful for those of us who were unable to watch it.

Well, well, well. you know it is very hard to prove a negative. Often negative statements are wrong.

Both Bob Pickle and I do hold a position with the SDA Church. I do not know what it meant by the word "official" that modifies the sentence. Many people would assume that those who are listed in what is commonly called the YEARBOOK do hold "official" pistons. If that is what gives one an official position, then I hold an official position. I am listed in the 2006 YEARBOOK. I have not yet seen the 2007 YEARBOOK. But, I expect to see my name listed in it.

I wonder how the IL Conference President could know that none of us work for the SDA Church. At least one of us receives money for services rendered to the SDA Church. Perhaps the implication is that the person who receives that money is not really working for the SDA Church. Oh, well, just another piece of information that is wrong.

However, let me point out an accurate statement that were made in the above quote:

None of us are either authorized to investigate any one, or are we doing so under the authority of the SDA Church. That statement is 100 per-cent correct.

The statements that the three of us make, and what we do in this matter is done independently, and is not done in the name of anyone except ourselves.

Observer, I've never seen you nor any of your group state or imply that you were officially mandated by the Church to investigate. You've always presented yourselves as independent investigators. That's a technique of DS, TS and Co. to say that you've said something wrong that you haven't, so they can accuse you of something and divert the attention of people from the real issue. I find it very dishonest and for me they lose credibility when they do that. Too bad!

[watchbird]

. . . . However, let me point out an accurate statement that were made in the above quote:

None of us are either authorized to investigate any one, or are we doing so under the authority of the SDA Church. That statement is 100 per-cent correct.

The statements that the three of us make, and what we do in this matter is done independently, and is not done in the name of anyone except ourselves.

That this statement is accurate, is what, IMO, makes this perhaps the saddest statement that has been made any time.... any place.... about any thing.... having to do with any part of the whole sordid mess at 3ABN.

That the Adventist church has NOT "authorized" anyone "to investigate any one"... given the multiple allegations against the owners/administrators of 3abn that have been brought for the past several years, even before Linda's ouster.... is to me not only a tragic mistake on the part of the highest church officials, but also a gross failure of their responsibilities as overseers of the church.

If they, as they have consistently claimed, in truth have no "right' to investigate, nor censure, nor cut their alliances with, any individual or ministry which has as many allegations against themselves as does the 3abn "ministry" (put in quotes since it would seem that this is more of a business than a true ministry).... then of what use are those "overseers of the church" to the body of the church? Is it not the biblical function of government... including church government.... to protect its citizens (members) from those who prey upon the flock at the same time they pretend to be preaching to the flock?

Observer, I've never seen you nor any of your group state or imply that you were officially mandated by the Church to investigate. You've always presented yourselves as independent investigators. That's a technique of DS, TS and Co. to say that you've said something wrong that you haven't, so they can accuse you of something and divert the attention of people from the real issue. I find it very dishonest and for me they lose credibility when they do that. Too bad!

And the fact that anyone would consider it "wrong" even if the researchers HAD claimed to be representing the church, is also but one more example of how truth is twisted and good is called evil by the spindoctors representing 3abn. The facts are that the researchers DO represent the church... the BODY of the church which SHOULD have a representative through its highest elected representatives, but does not. Thus spokespersons have to arise from within the body itself... to fill the gap left by those who were supposed by most of us to be the very ones who SHOULD investigate, speak, and act in a fair, just, and protective manner.

Would we be having any of these dialogues had they done so?

Of course not.

But we would "know the truth... and the truth will make [would have made] us free". Unfortunately, they did not, so the word of God through, Hosea 4:6 is today being fulfilled in our midst..... "My people are [being] destroyed for lack of knowledge".

And administrators should take note.... especially any who are tempted to take up stones to cast upon those who are trying to fill the vacuum left by their inaction.... that those who do not oppose wickedness are by their very silence and inaction aligning themselves with that wickedness which they do not oppose.

In the words of Isaiah....

Woe to those who call evil good, and good evil;
Who substitute darkness for light and light for darkness;
Who substitute bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter!
Woe to those who are wise in their own eyes
And clever in their own sight!

[Grace]

That this statement is accurate, is what, IMO, makes this perhaps the saddest statement that has been made any time.... any place.... about any thing.... having to do with any part of the whole sordid mess at 3ABN.

That the Adventist church has NOT "authorized" anyone "to investigate any one"... given the multiple allegations against the owners/administrators of 3abn that have been brought for the past several years, even before Linda's ouster.... is to me not only a tragic mistake on the part of the highest church officials, but also a gross failure of their responsibilities as overseers of the church.

If they, as they have consistently claimed, in truth have no "right' to investigate, nor censure, nor cut their alliances with, any individual or ministry which has as many allegations against themselves as does the 3abn "ministry" (put in quotes since it would seem that this is more of a business than a true ministry).... then of what use are those "overseers of the church" to the body of the church? Is it not the biblical function of government... including church government.... to protect its citizens (members) from those who prey upon the flock at the same time they pretend to be preaching to the flock?


And the fact that anyone would consider it "wrong" even if the researchers HAD claimed to be representing the church, is also but one more example of how truth is twisted and good is called evil by the spindoctors representing 3abn. The facts are that the researchers DO represent the church... the BODY of the church which SHOULD have a representative through its highest elected representatives, but does not. Thus spokespersons have to arise from within the body itself... to fill the gap left by those who were supposed by most of us to be the very ones who SHOULD investigate, speak, and act in a fair, just, and protective manner.

Would we be having any of these dialogues had they done so?

Of course not.

But we would "know the truth... and the truth will make [would have made] us free". Unfortunately, they did not, so the word of God through, Hosea 4:6 is today being fulfilled in our midst..... "My people are [being] destroyed for lack of knowledge".

And administrators should take note.... especially any who are tempted to take up stones to cast upon those who are trying to fill the vacuum left by their inaction.... that those who do not oppose wickedness are by their very silence and inaction aligning themselves with that wickedness which they do not oppose.

In the words of Isaiah....

Woe to those who call evil good, and good evil;
Who substitute darkness for light and light for darkness;
Who substitute bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter!
Woe to those who are wise in their own eyes
And clever in their own sight!

[Noahswife]

Here is the update for post #31

http://mypage.direct.ca/r/rseland/private/second.html

Thanks for the time you spent creating the transcription.

It sure made for interesting reading.

My take on this "live show" would be that the contributions have dramatically fallen off. Especially since last month they claimed they were doing just fine. Also, the AToday article was just posted and could hurt things even more. I think it was also a preemptive strike against those donors who might send their money elsewhere to avoid it being used for legal fees.

Second, they are getting pressure from big donors to defend themselves.

Third, Danny can sure mumble and say absolutely nothing but tell his supporters what they want to hear.

He sure can talk without using clear language. Can/Will the lemmings really believe, if they were actually listening, that he could not remember what WT covered him for? What a line.

Did you see my post on conversational terrorism? There are some subcategories with a religious bent that I have thought of adding to the article on the website where I found the article I posted. But I have come to expect nothing else of him/them as the latest TS letter demonstrates.

And the ASI discussion? What a joke considering the emails we have been shown. How many cult of shelton will just accept his words and not check it out for themselves.

IF Danny thinks his style of giving information or "answering questions" will work in a court of law he might be in for a surprise.

But hey, JMVHO.

nw

[daylily]

Molly: You know I was sitting here thinking. It's a sad day when we have to take air time to talk about this stuff. but we were forced into it. But you know one scriptures that you quote so frequently is John 10:10 The thief comes to kill and destroy and Jesus comes to give life and to give it abundantly. And he said He said.....Look at the fruits of the ministry.. [Reads letters from people blessed by 3abn]

Ralph, I think Shelly made the comment quoted above rather than Molly.

Thank you for taking the time to transcribe the program. I'm sure it was a lot of work!

[Eirene]

3ABN will be showing this program again this morning between 8-10 am CST.

[Richard Sherwin]

They just don't get the fact that the more they show that program, the more the post on here, the more they protest the more they are drawing people's attention to their troubles. Makes you kinda wonder what they are thinking or who is giving them advice. But let them carry on....

Richard

3ABN will be showing this program again this morning between 8-10 am CST.

[Eirene]

Couldn't we just as easily think along these lines. Many of their programs are repeated at different times so that all may have an opporturnity to view. This one was shown Thurs. night, Sunday afternoon and now Tuesday morning.