Reaping The Whirl Wind, IRS Criminal Investigation of 3ABN Options

[calvin]

UUUUUMMMMMMMM
Good Grief! Lighten up!!! I think someone is wound up a little too tightly.

Warning : Follow Clay's instructions to "MOVE ON". That means you don't get to take public shots at my administrators, you got issues with them address it with me in a PM.

[jakann]

Pastoring is, and should be a full time job for those getting paid by tithes from the denomination. However that does not mean they do that all their waking hours. Pastors enjoy hobbies, sports etc. They have, and should have spare time, what they do during that spare time should be up to them, if they want to use it to invest their money in the stock market then that is none of my business. Some in fact might do very well at it. Or if in a previous life they had a business built up that fed money to them once they are pastoring then more power to them. The organizational skills that a good paster brings to his church might also be the same skill that will create wealth. I just think it's wrong to knock a pastor for the wise investment of his assets.

Pastors generally are too overworked in the direct responsibilities of pastoring and don't take enough time off to recharge their batteries, if you will. Pastoring is much different from say, that of a welder or chef where you can leave your job at the workplace and have another life outside of work. Christ was the great example where he would spend hours and hours away from his disciples and away from the people, in nature, with God. Our pastors need more of this. Not fooling around in sports but in recreation--- re-creation. Please read the chapter in Testimonies to the Church vol. 1 page 514 "Recreation for Christians".
If pastors start chasing around in sports and worldly business you'll soon notice it in the pulpit. Dry Spiritless sermons will abound. They need to remember that they can and should be a wellspring of spiritual life to their congregation and community. This can only happen if they and the church get the proper amount of work and rest.

And if a pastor has some cash he wishes to invest my advice would be to stay away from the stock market. The chances of you losing all your money there are, let me see, 100%! We are Seventh-day Adventists people! We believe that Jesus is coming VERY soon! All prophecy has been fulfilled in order and the next in line is the national Sunday law. While I'm not time setting this is an event that could be just months away. Shortly thereafter you won't be able to buy or sell anything, stocks or otherwise. Why not invest your money with a guaranteed return of 100% of your money with interest. The payoff isn't quick but is eternal! If you know of any pastors with money to invest just let me know, I've got dozens of ministries, churches, missions, schools, clinics, wellness centers, evangelists, and bible workers that could use the money. Time is short. Need we be reminded of the millions that the GC lost in the stock market here just a few years ago?

[Richard Sherwin]

Wow I always thought a person could make money in the stock market, I didn't realize that there was a 100% chance to lose it. Enlightening indeed.

There is a time and place to put money into the church and ministry however there is also a time and place to invest money. The parable of the talents shows us that investing money and reaping the profits are a good thing. Wise investment of the money will provide funds for ministry. I know a lot of people who have wealth because of good investments who then take the profits and give them to the Lord. If when they had a little they had turned it over to God it would not have had near the impact, but when they made that money grow they had much more to give. It's simply good business to invest our funds, it's also good stewardship.

Pastors generally are too overworked in the direct responsibilities of pastoring and don't take enough time off to recharge their batteries, if you will. Pastoring is much different from say, that of a welder or chef where you can leave your job at the workplace and have another life outside of work. Christ was the great example where he would spend hours and hours away from his disciples and away from the people, in nature, with God. Our pastors need more of this. Not fooling around in sports but in recreation--- re-creation. Please read the chapter in Testimonies to the Church vol. 1 page 514 "Recreation for Christians".
If pastors start chasing around in sports and worldly business you'll soon notice it in the pulpit. Dry Spiritless sermons will abound. They need to remember that they can and should be a wellspring of spiritual life to their congregation and community. This can only happen if they and the church get the proper amount of work and rest.

And if a pastor has some cash he wishes to invest my advice would be to stay away from the stock market. The chances of you losing all your money there are, let me see, 100%! We are Seventh-day Adventists people! We believe that Jesus is coming VERY soon! All prophecy has been fulfilled in order and the next in line is the national Sunday law. While I'm not time setting this is an event that could be just months away. Shortly thereafter you won't be able to buy or sell anything, stocks or otherwise. Why not invest your money with a guaranteed return of 100% of your money with interest. The payoff isn't quick but is eternal! If you know of any pastors with money to invest just let me know, I've got dozens of ministries, churches, missions, schools, clinics, wellness centers, evangelists, and bible workers that could use the money. Time is short. Need we be reminded of the millions that the GC lost in the stock market here just a few years ago?

[Denny]

Pastors generally are too overworked in the direct responsibilities of pastoring and don't take enough time off to recharge their batteries, if you will. Pastoring is much different from say, that of a welder or chef where you can leave your job at the workplace and have another life outside of work. Christ was the great example where he would spend hours and hours away from his disciples and away from the people, in nature, with God. Our pastors need more of this. Not fooling around in sports but in recreation--- re-creation. Please read the chapter in Testimonies to the Church vol. 1 page 514 "Recreation for Christians".
If pastors start chasing around in sports and worldly business you'll soon notice it in the pulpit. Dry Spiritless sermons will abound. They need to remember that they can and should be a wellspring of spiritual life to their congregation and community. This can only happen if they and the church get the proper amount of work and rest.

.

Nothing wrong with sports if we believe in good health then exercise cannot be ignored and taking part in a sports activity can be a part of that. How a pastor chooses to recharge his batteries is for him to decide and not the membership.

[Johann]

Wow I always thought a person could make money in the stock market, I didn't realize that there was a 100% chance to lose it. Enlightening indeed.

There is a time and place to put money into the church and ministry however there is also a time and place to invest money. The parable of the talents shows us that investing money and reaping the profits are a good thing. Wise investment of the money will provide funds for ministry. I know a lot of people who have wealth because of good investments who then take the profits and give them to the Lord. If when they had a little they had turned it over to God it would not have had near the impact, but when they made that money grow they had much more to give. It's simply good business to invest our funds, it's also good stewardship.

Some times we have to learn by mistakes. Several years back whhile I was an active pastor I thought I could make a fortune on the stock market. I saw an adverticement from a bank offering a loan to buy stock that was "guaranteed" to increase so much in value it three years that you could pay off your loan and make a sizeable profit. Three years later I discovered I could not sell my stock at face value, so I owed the bank quite a bit. I did make some payments on that loan, but then I recalled the adverticement and I told the bank I'd pay them no more because of the promise they'd given.

I referred to a court case verdict stating that when a bank gives bad finanial advice it has to cover some of the loss of the customer. I heard nothing from the bank until they sent out their statements at the beginning of the following year. It showed that I owed them nothing.

If I had paid their bill I'd lost quite a bit on my virgin stock venture. I decided not to try again, so I forfeited the chance to get wealthy.

[Daryl Fawcett]

Well, at least you got your loan paid off.

[watchbird]

Some times we have to learn by mistakes. Several years back whhile I was an active pastor I thought I could make a fortune on the stock market. I saw an adverticement from a bank offering a loan to buy stock that was "guaranteed" to increase so much in value it three years that you could pay off your loan and make a sizeable profit. Three years later I discovered I could not sell my stock at face value, so I owed the bank quite a bit. I did make some payments on that loan, but then I recalled the adverticement and I told the bank I'd pay them no more because of the promise they'd given.

I referred to a court case verdict stating that when a bank gives bad finanial advice it has to cover some of the loss of the customer. I heard nothing from the bank until they sent out their statements at the beginning of the following year. It showed that I owed them nothing.

If I had paid their bill I'd lost quite a bit on my virgin stock venture. I decided not to try again, so I forfeited the chance to get wealthy.

You are fortunate indeed.

There are distinct differences between investing in stocks... speculating in the stock market... gambling on the long shots on the stock market... and getting caught by "sucker bait"... the latter being what you did.

Sound investments are just that. Beyond that it gets progressively dangerous for one's fiscal health.

[Shepherdswife]

Pastors generally are too overworked in the direct responsibilities of pastoring and don't take enough time off to recharge their batteries, if you will. Pastoring is much different from say, that of a welder or chef where you can leave your job at the workplace and have another life outside of work. Christ was the great example where he would spend hours and hours away from his disciples and away from the people, in nature, with God. Our pastors need more of this. Not fooling around in sports but in recreation--- re-creation. Please read the chapter in Testimonies to the Church vol. 1 page 514 "Recreation for Christians".
If pastors start chasing around in sports and worldly business you'll soon notice it in the pulpit. Dry Spiritless sermons will abound. They need to remember that they can and should be a wellspring of spiritual life to their congregation and community. This can only happen if they and the church get the proper amount of work and rest.

And if a pastor has some cash he wishes to invest my advice would be to stay away from the stock market. The chances of you losing all your money there are, let me see, 100%! We are Seventh-day Adventists people! We believe that Jesus is coming VERY soon! All prophecy has been fulfilled in order and the next in line is the national Sunday law. While I'm not time setting this is an event that could be just months away. Shortly thereafter you won't be able to buy or sell anything, stocks or otherwise. Why not invest your money with a guaranteed return of 100% of your money with interest. The payoff isn't quick but is eternal! If you know of any pastors with money to invest just let me know, I've got dozens of ministries, churches, missions, schools, clinics, wellness centers, evangelists, and bible workers that could use the money. Time is short. Need we be reminded of the millions that the GC lost in the stock market here just a few years ago?

jakann, I find it fascinating that since we all see life from the perspective of our own experience, it is a human tendency to find and quote the verses and references that corroborate our experience, using them as a map that we believe all should follow. One of the least dry and spiritless speakers I know, who has been hugely fruitful in ministry, enjoys the challenge of the stock market. He has made quite a bit of money, which he uses to help in his ministry projects. Could I do it? Probably not. I don't have the gift that he does. Your stock market experience is probably an indication that you don't have the gift, either... but you and I have gifts that he does not have. All of us using what God has given us--regardless of whether we are ears or toes--that is ministry.

shepherdswife

[Pickle]

Perhaps the post was misunderstood? Perhaps 100% chance of losing was to be understood in the context of if you had money invested the day Christ returns? I think we can all agree that at some point in time, money invested in stocks will be a 100% loss.

A news article I saw 8-10 years ago talked about how PlayBoy and such were small time when it came to producing pornography, when compared to a major car manufacturer. That sure was an eye opener. Lots of major companies were producing more porno than the ones we usually think of. One guy, I think a director of one of these companies, said it was something everyone knew about but no one wanted to talk about.

If I were to invest in a company, I'd want to invest in a company that wasn't in the porno business.

[princessdi]

This is just a suggestion........

How about we ALL, starting today take a Sabbath/Holiday break from these threads? While they are true(from each one's perspective) they are not lovely, they do not bring one's mind closer to God and the Gift of His Son, Jesus Christ. Let's just take a few days to do exactly that. Go to church, or don't, but use the Sabbath hours for Praise & Worship to God, Then share and celebrate with others by having a bring-your-own favorite party snack holiday gathering at your home or church social. Gather with friends and family and think about the goodness of God. Put on your favorite seasonal cds and moives. Come into LC, and see who is there, start a conversation about how thankful we are for God's Gift to the World. What do you all think?

[Denny]

Here is a motion to close the 3ABN threads for the holiday season from today to January 2nd anyone prepared to second it?

[Noahswife]

Here is a motion to close the 3ABN threads for the holiday season from today to January 2nd anyone prepared to second it?

Me...ME!!! Choose me to second it....

This post has been edited by Noahswife: Dec 21 2007, 01:09 PM

[YogusBearus]

Here is a motion to close the 3ABN threads for the holiday season from today to January 2nd anyone prepared to second it?

I'm on board as long as I won't be held responsible for random acts of violence by those of us in severe withdrawal.

-bear

[princessdi]

...and if you need a thrid......

Here is a motion to close the 3ABN threads for the holiday season from today to January 2nd anyone prepared to second it?

[Clay]

if people have nothing better to do that hang out in the 3abn sub-forum this long holiday weekend.... let em.....